Arsenal

[wev]

I want a trophy, any would do, treat the Carling Cup seriously and our players will begin to understand what it feels like to actually win something and maybe knuckle down more other competitions.

[Art Vandelay]

When they were going through the Chelsea team yesterday they've collectively won enough trophies that you could smelt them down and build an aircraft carrier. It wouldn't hurt to have a few seasoned campaigners.

[CandyBob]

I want a trophy, any would do, treat the Carling Cup seriously and our players will begin to understand what it feels like to actually win something and maybe knuckle down more other competitions.

Not possible. The squad can barely get through the season concentrating on the PL and CL.

[The Fox]

I want a trophy, any would do, treat the Carling Cup seriously and our players will begin to understand what it feels like to actually win something and maybe knuckle down more other competitions.

What would you rather get: Champions League qualification but no trophies (ie our normal season these days), or Europa League qualification with a Carling Cup/FA Cup win?

For me it's the former, but it's sort of beside the point. Wenger said numerous times before the start of the season that this would be the year the youth plan finally came to fruition and we would actually win the league again.

[Rev]

Not possible. The squad can barely get through the season concentrating on the PL and CL.

I don't think that is true. How many of our injuries, percentage wise, have taken place on the pitch? I don't know for sure, but to me the vast majority seem to come on the training ground. If they're going to be picking up injuries off the pitch, we might as well put them on the pitch as often as possible.

[The Fox]

We should probably stop training on a toxic minefield really.

[wev]

What would you rather get: Champions League qualification but no trophies (ie our normal season these days), or Europa League qualification with a Carling Cup/FA Cup win?

For me it's the former, but it's sort of beside the point. Wenger said numerous times before the start of the season that this would be the year the youth plan finally came to fruition and we would actually win the league again.

I think we can manage to get third in the league and a domestic cup quite easily, that still gives us Champions League qualification (without having to play in the play-offs) and a bit of silverware that would give our players a bit of experience.

[CandyBob]

I don't think that is true. How many of our injuries, percentage wise, have taken place on the pitch? I don't know for sure, but to me the vast majority seem to come on the training ground. If they're going to be picking up injuries off the pitch, we might as well put them on the pitch as often as possible.

Things would just have been worse surely?

Even ManU played some youngsters in the Carling. Chelsea seem to be the only team that can try and compete on four fronts, mainly because their bench is as good as most PL teams first 11.

[wev]

I'm not suggesting we play our First XI in every single game possible. But Man Utd mix it up int he Carling Cup, we just play our youth unless we have someone who older who's really in need of some games.

[fat flatulent git]

Who do Arsenal have at the moment who could be described as a physically imposing presence? Someone who can knock other players off the ball and make the other team think twice about challenging. Fabregas? Anyone else?

[The Fox]

Diaby, maybe Song. No one else really.

[wev]

Vermaelen.

[CandyBob]

I think we can manage to get third in the league and a domestic cup quite easily, that still gives us Champions League qualification (without having to play in the play-offs) and a bit of silverware that would give our players a bit of experience.

We will also be playing in the CL as well which is a massive drain on resources. Unless you qualify early, pretty much every game is a must not lose to a must win. Huge pressure. The Barcelona games basically killed the season off for us.

I think its unrealistic to expect to challenge on those fronts. Arsene is right in that its PL first domestically then CL qualification. Anything else is nice of course but not essential.

[fat flatulent git]

Diaby, maybe Song. No one else really.

Haven't seen much of him, but I thought Diaby was a bit lightweight. I stand corrected then.

Do you think the team needs such a player to be bought in the summer?

[CandyBob]

Who do Arsenal have at the moment who could be described as a physically imposing presence? Someone who can knock other players off the ball and make the other team think twice about challenging. Fabregas? Anyone else?

Campbell, Diaby, Song, Vermaelen. Sagna doesn't muck about either. We've all seen Diaby, when he can be bothered, strength 2-3 players off of the ball on his own.

[wev]

We will also be playing in the CL as well which is a massive drain on resources. Unless you qualify early, pretty much every game is a must not lose to a must win. Huge pressure. The Barcelona games basically killed the season off for us.

I think its unrealistic to expect to challenge on those fronts. Arsene is right in that its PL first domestically then CL qualification. Anything else is nice of course but not essential.

We've seen our players bottle it when up against more experienced opposition pretty much every time this season, a trophy under their belts will give them a bit of extra confidence which I feel is much needed if we're to compete properly on other fronts.

We saw it a few seasons ago at Man Utd, they were struggling in other competitions, the Carling Cup provided a spring board for them having that extra confidence to go further the following season.

[Rev]

We should probably stop training on a toxic minefield really.

Pipe-dream.

Things would just have been worse surely?

Probably.

Although for the sake of argument, you could claim it might make things better - training would be less intensive if you've played recently. And maybe not everyone in the squad, but lots of them, want to play every match possible. Telling those players "I don't think you're capable of playing two matches in a week" doesn't have a great impact I would think. And losing after putting out a weakened team has been what has ruined the last however many seasons. Certainly this season. Would an extra couple of injuries be so much worse than that happening?

[fat flatulent git]

Campbell, Diaby, Song, Vermaelen. Sagna doesn't muck about either.

Ah, I forgot about Campbell, although I wonder how many appearances he will make next season.

I thought perhaps a lack of physical presence might have explained partly why Arsenal petered out a bit this season after a good start, but perhaps not.

[Rev]

Ah, I forgot about Campbell, although I wonder how many appearances he will make next season.

79. He'll play in games that aren't even on.

[CandyBob]

We've seen our players bottle it when up against more experienced opposition pretty much every time this season, a trophy under their belts will give them a bit of extra confidence which I feel is much needed if we're to compete properly on other fronts.

We saw it a few seasons ago at Man Utd, they were struggling in other competitions, the Carling Cup provided a spring board for them having that extra confidence to go further the following season.

In that case I think we would need to concentrate on doing that at the expense of other things for one season. I personally don't think it would make things better in the long run but you might be right. No win for Arsene though as fans would still moan.

[Mars]

Not possible. The squad can barely get through the season concentrating on the PL and CL.

And not really competing in either, to be honest...

[CandyBob]

Ah, I forgot about Campbell, although I wonder how many appearances he will make next season.

I thought perhaps a lack of physical presence might have explained partly why Arsenal petered out a bit this season after a good start, but perhaps not.

It partly that but not as important as other things for me.

[CandyBob]

And not really competing in either, to be honest...

We were in it until a few games ago. I don't think better results against Blackburn and Wigan would make much difference ultimately be we did really well to be so close.

[wev]

Some fans need to wake up and smell the roses though. We're much better off financially in the long run than Man Utd and Liverpool and our squads not reaching the end of its time together like Chelsea. Premier League and Champions League success is possible in the future (I'd also say the near future), but a Carling Cup win, even better the FA Cup, would give us some silverware.

I've seen fans criticise Wenger for not taking those two trophies seriously, but they'd also criticise if we won one of them. End of the day, most of our fans are young and were spoilt by the "Invincibles". I don't think its too much to expect us to be competetive, but we can't just go straight in and win something like the Champions League when our players have no experience of winning anything else.

[wev]

We were in it until a few games ago. I don't think better results against Blackburn and Wigan would make much difference ultimately be we did really well to be so close.

Let's be honest, we were always chasing. It looked promising but we were always chasing and never really took chances that were presented to us, you can blame that on various things but I've stated all season long that with our lack of experience, our permanent injury issues and the way we were defending at the start of the season (which only got worse as the season progressed) we were never going to provide a serious challenge.

[CandyBob]

Let's be honest, we were always chasing. It looked promising but we were always chasing and never really took chances that were presented to us, you can blame that on various things but I've stated all season long that with our lack of experience, our permanent injury issues and the way we were defending at the start of the season (which only got worse as the season progressed) we were never going to provide a serious challenge.

Yeah even when it was so close, I didn't think that we were realistically going to do it. The injuries more than anything took their toll. The experience we lacked that you mention we had in the forms of Gallas, Fab, RvP and Arshavin but weren't available to us.

[The Fox]

Ah, I forgot about Campbell, although I wonder how many appearances he will make next season.

Wenger will allow Gallas and Silvestre to leave on frees, heralding the return of Djourou as "like a new signing" and dismissing the need to buy a new centre back. Then, in pre-season training, Vermaelen will break both his legs in a training ground collision with Djourou, an incident which will also cause the latter's knee to fall off. Again. Since the transfer window will have closed, this will leave rusty oil tanker Campbell, 57, and young rookie Havard Nordtveit, 13, as our central defensive pairing for every game of the season.

[Dude Ranch]

our squads not reaching the end of its time together like Chelsea.

They'll continue to add class to it though and keep a core of experienced winners. Something Arsene didn't do. He started again, unfortunately.

Did anyone watch any of Chelsea yesterday? Did you not look at their players and wonder where the hell that kind of physical presence, confidence and experience is at the Arsenal?

When we sold Anelka to Madrid, their top fella said they only want to sign champions. Forget that it's Madrid and all that, but I always remember that. However it worked out they only wanted to sign winners. We've done the opposite. OK players but they're not up to it, they don't really want it IMO. Maybe Cesc and Vermaelen, and Campbell this season. The way most of them sometimes can't be bothered speaks volumes, you could pick any five names out of a hat and sell them, no problem. Arsene is as much to blame for this as the players, they needed the hair drier treatment from day one. Ferguson wouldn't have had it, nor Mourinho. We're weak, flat track bullies. We need three mean and nasty players who absolutely will not settle for second best and will fight to the death. And then for that to rub off on the rest.

[CandyBob]

Not sure if its been mentioned but was I right when I heard the Mirror hack on Arseblog saying that there will be changes in the medical staff next season? I guess you could read into that that the clubs injuries are not average across the rest of the league.

[Dude Ranch]

Not sure if its been mentioned but was I right when I heard the Mirror hack on Arseblog saying that there will be changes in the medical staff next season?

He could do worse than promote Bould to number 2. Sorry Pat.