Arsenal

[hat]

So it's like this with RVP. He (and his people) are determined to get out and City is the only place he'll go to, this isn't a case of if but just when and for how much.

I'm not trolling btw, I'm just a pissed off season ticket holder.

[The Fox]

I don't think the club is going to want to sell another player to Man City though. It just looks really bad.

[Dude Ranch]

So it's like this with RVP. He (and his people) are determined to get out and City is the only place he'll go to, this isn't a case of if but just when and for how much.

I'm not trolling btw, I'm just a pissed off season ticket holder.

£25m? I'd shake on that.

What are you paying for your ticket by the way mate? I spent a grand odd every year for ten years and loved it. I wouldn't pay anywhere near that now even if I lived round the corner. 1k+ at the moment is ridiculous regardless of how you feel about the Arsenal IMHO. With total respect to the season ticket holders on here.

EDIT: @the Fox. It will be a tragic, intolerable almost. What can we do? If they don't buy him for a massive fee then they'll buy someone else as good or better anyway and we get less money from another Club. They can have him.

[hat]

£25m? I'd shake on that.

What are you paying for your ticket by the way mate?

Was £1248 this year as I sold a few matches back last season. I've had a season ticket since I was 12 and it's unlikely I'd ever give it up now unless the club became an oligarch's plaything.

[toythatkills]

So it's like this with RVP. He (and his people) are determined to get out and City is the only place he'll go to, this isn't a case of if but just when and for how much.

Where does this even come from? Your mate's dad's brother's milkman's nail technician's son saw Van Persie in Tesco and he told him all about it?

[The Fox]

I think there's a good chance they'll tell him he can leave this summer, but not to Man City. Even if he went to Chelsea or Man Utd, I think that's currently less of a PR disaster, given the whole 'MCFC feeder club' accusations.

[hat]

I don't think the club is going to want to sell another player to Man City though. It just looks really bad.

Well he's had this set up for a while and while upaletable they'll stump up more than anyone else so we might as well. With any luck he'll revert to type and break down again, missing most of every season he's there.

[The Fox]

It's not like they're gonna pay double what anyone else will though. Is saving some face worth a couple of million quid? Maybe. At the end of the day he is under contract so it's not like he has all the cards.

[hat]

Where does this even come from? Your mate's dad's brother's milkman's nail technician's son saw Van Persie in Tesco and he told him all about it?

Someone who shares the same advisors as Robin. Take it with as much of a pinch of salt as you want, I'm not bragging about it but just letting people know who might want to know the current position.

[Dude Ranch]

I thought hat was talking hypothetically, for the record. Not that there was any suggestion of inside knowledge.

Anyway, the one thing that miffs me is that through Vieira, Henry, Fabregas and van Persie the one I warmed to most as captain was van Persie.

[Art Vandelay]

It's not like the old days where you could just tell a player he's been sold to Bumfuck Nowhere FC and that was that. 99 times out of a 100 the player ends up where he wants and it doesn't take a genius to work out that Van Persie and his people released an enormously destructive statement so he could wind up somewhere we don't want to sell him, i.e. Man City. You'd be a brave man to bet against that happening.

As Dude says though if they don't buy him they'll get someone else. It's just a shame we always seem to fall into the same pattern of selling someone decent to that mob. We've got a French wonderkid from Caen on trial this week though, so that's something.

[KRP]

Bumfuck Nowhere FC

[Daley]

If he wanted to leave so bad he should have requested a transfer. But he won't because that will cost him money. Sometimes I do wonder why I still bother with football.

[g wings]

I wish the term "World Class" would fuck off and die. People reference it like it's an actual category of ability.

Once a good player would be "in form" or "out of form", now he's "world class" or "good, but not world class".

That doesn't make sense. Squillaci can be as "in form" as you like, still doesn't make him much good.

[Daley]

Going off subject a bit and I know I've spoken about this before but Wilshere is really the only player we've genuinely brought through to the first team from scratch in a decade. Not much of a return, especially given that Arsene this week suggested that he won't change and he'll stick by the youth model.

That is the way youth systems work, at the top level anyway. You get one gem now and again and that is what it is about. This is supplemented by a few squad players and the rest you sell to pay for the system to continue or let go. Cashley is probably one of the best left backs around right now and Wilshere has the potential to be a top player, although obviously both are not still with us! If we can supplement this with the Gibbs and Frimpongs of this world, recoup a few million here and there by selling people down to the championship, then so be it.

Man Utd do very well but the Nevilles-Becks-Scholes etc generation was just a massive fluke and has not been repeated. Their system is similar to what I describe above. Wellbeck and maybe one or two more in the first team squad and the rest they sell to Steve Bruce and Mark Hughes whenever they end up in a job.

[Dude Ranch]

One player though Daley. ONE player of real note. Isn't that pathetic for a Club basing a future around a mostly youth inspired project? I'd be amazed if our youth system even funds itself. It clearly doesn't work, for a top Club to produce one player of genuine quality in ten odd years shows that something is wrong IMO. We buy OK young players but can't make them. The academy didn't open last week, it's been up and running for yonks. After Wilshere the next best hope is Frimpong, as you said.

[The Fox]

Fiorentina are apparently denying they have bid for Chamakh, because "he earns €3m per season".

FML.

[Daley]

One player though Daley. ONE player of real note. Isn't that pathetic for a Club basing a future around a mostly youth inspired project? I'd be amazed if our youth system even funds itself. It clearly doesn't work, for a top Club to produce one player of genuine quality in ten odd years shows that something is wrong IMO. We buy OK young players but can't make them. The academy didn't open last week, it's been up and running for yonks. After Wilshere the next best hope is Frimpong, as you said.

OK I agree that I would like more players coming through. But how much would Wilshere cost? And I can't find figures for Arsenal's but guess how much Barca spend on La Masia? It's the most expensive in Europe and it is estimated to cost them £5m a season to operate. Assuming Arsenal's is less, isn't it worth that to try and find another Wilshere or Cole? And don't forget it is also home to all the foreign kids Arsenal steal from their clubs.

[The Fox]

Yeah I mean have Barca even brought anyone through since Busquets and Pedro a few years ago? They clearly have by far and away the best and most productive academy but even with them, a lot of the hyped young players coming through end up not making the grade. Bojan, Dos Santos, Jeffren etc.

[JDubYes]

Would people really rather he was sold to Man Utd than Man City? Of the three English clubs that have been mentioned I think I'd probably actually prefer he was sold to Man City rather than Man Utd and Chelsea...

My reasoning is this; Man City are a special case. The same rules don't (seem to) apply. Everyone knows they have a bottomless pit of money, so if they're involved and your player has just the one solitary mercenary bone in their body, then you've pretty much lost. It may be galling watching them steal our players every summer, but at least it's understandable.

Chelsea are similar in a way, but with a few differences. They're our local rivals, they finished lower than us in the league last year*, and they still have a tenuous grasp on reality. They'll still throw more money around that is really feasible under normal circumstances, but still not as much as City, and not so often. Based on these things, I'd rather he went to City, to be honest.

Then you have Man Utd. The same Man Utd who, as big a marketing juggernaut as they are, as successful as they've been, and as preferable as their wage structure must be to ours... I just can't justify it. His joining Utd at this point would just be the worst possible thing, as far as I'm concerned. For nearly half of my life they've felt like either our biggest rivals or our biggest obstacle, and selling RVP to them would just be a demonstration of our impotence and utter lack of control over these situations, and both justify RVP's decision and utterly destroy any positive memories I have of him.

As far as the other usual suspects, I actually find that I wouldn't even mind Barcelona too much in comparison. They're one of the finest teams of this generation, maybe ever, and could actually use another striker, so he should actually play too. Add in that the city's nice, that he'd be leaving the UK, and that I can understand someone wanting to be part of that team and, now that it's pretty much a given that he's going, I could live with him going there.

tl;dr - I'd be happier with RVP going to one of the usual suspects than Man Utd or Chelsea, as at least then I could understand his reasoning (without being particularly happy about it, obviously).

* I know they won the Chamions League, but so what? If a player joins a team who finished fifth (it was fifth, right?) in their domestic leagiue just because they won the CL then they're a bit dense, as far as I'm concerned. It's a knockout competition, so there's no guarantee of repeat success (or any kind of success at all), and it's not like Chelsea romped magnificently to their title anyway.

If you were a silverware-hungry footballer, and Villa were to finish 13th this year but win the FA Cup, would you join them because you thought they were a good bet to win Trophies?

Okay, that's not really a fair comparison, but it illustrates my point. If Barcelona can't repeat as CL champions, do people really expect Chelsea to?

[Daley]

@The Fox

It's a bit of a vicious circle for Barca too. Once a bunch of talented young players become well established, how do the next batch break through? The standards are sky high so only the very best make it through.

[Rev]

I think Arsenal have suffered by not really giving the players a fair chance before allowing them to leave. Muamba and Larsson would both have got in the Arsenal squad last year, I'm sure. Busquets is a good player, but he's not anything spectacular. He just got given lots and lots of chances and eventually came good on it.

Fiorentina are apparently denying they have bid for Chamakh, because "he earns €3m per season".

FML.

It works out to €57k, which is about £45k p/w. Considering he came on a free and was meant to be quite good, that's not bad really by modern Premiership standards.

[Sirloin]

Yeah I mean have Barca even brought anyone through since Busquets and Pedro a few years ago? They clearly have by far and away the best and most productive academy but even with them, a lot of the hyped young players coming through end up not making the grade. Bojan, Dos Santos, Jeffren etc.

Cuenca and Thiago Alcantra? Both played quite a bit last season. Thiago looked very good at times.

[Rev]

Cuenca didn't, to be fair. Every match I saw him in he was entirely hopeless. Mind you, I'm not a fan of Pedro either.

[Sirloin]

Pedro is just about my favourite Barca player, every time I bet on him he scores.

[The Fox]

Cuenca and Tello are unproven really though aren't they. They've by no means made it into the first team for sure. Thiago maybe has more chance.

@Rev - yeah it doesn't seem a huge amount, especially if part of that is a hefty signing-on fee.

More good news -- Squillaci is "out of reach" for Bastia.

You just know all these players are still gonna be stinking the place up on deadline day don't you, and we'll have signed no one in midfield.

[Daley]

More here: http://www.arsenal.c...picture-special

[The Fox]

Is that his new prosthetic leg?

[toythatkills]

More here: http://www.arsenal.c...picture-special

It might look like he's lifting a weight, but it's actually a piece of scaffolding that the club doctors have attached to him in the hopes that it will stop him falling to bits. He'll be playing with that when he makes all three appearances next season.

[Daley]