Televisions And The Next Gen.

[Blue]

What with the 360 catering for High Definition (and the PS3?), is anyone thinking of upgrading their set and do you have any recommendations on what's required/good deals etc?

Do plasma and LCD T.V's handle HD or does it have to be a specifically HD T.V.

Sorry if this should be in ask the forum but wanted it to be a bit of a gaming discussion around the whole subject of whether you all felt it necessary/desirable to upgrade in preparation.

Ta.

[Andy_Tanner]

i'm not bothering until the price comes down to that of normal tellys i.e. £400 for a decent 28" set. hopefully this will happen in the next year or so.

[CurryKitten]

What with the 360 catering for High Definition (and the PS3?), is anyone thinking of upgrading their set and do you have any recommendations on what's required/good deals etc?

Do plasma and LCD T.V's handle HD or does it have to be a specifically HD T.V.

Sorry if this should be in ask the forum but wanted it to be a bit of a gaming discussion around the whole subject of whether you all felt it necessary/desirable to upgrade in preparation.

Ta.

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Well, they'll still work on regular TV's of course. My projector does 1080i, so I'm happy enough.

[sofasurfer]

Im not getting a Plasma till next year when we move house and I can set up my dream system in our new place.

I will wait till then.At the moment I have a Panny 36" CRT that gives me a fantastic RGB image.

I have already bought the hidef compatible DVD player in preparation for my new screen.

[CurryKitten]

I have already bought the hidef compatible DVD player in preparation for my new screen.

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Can you explain what that means, does it scale everything to 720p or something ?

[suzakuseven]

Hopefully the rumoured (possibly confirmed, but I haven't seen it) VGA cable will be released with the 360 and I'll be able to play in high def on my LCD flatscreen monitor. Saying that, what res is high def again? My monitor can only go up to 1280x1024 max...hope that's enough!

[FiL]

not all plasmas, LCD and projectors can do hi def.

the imager size needs to be 1280x720 or 1920x1080 (as well as some which are 1280x768) as these are the two hi def resolutions.

many projectors and plasma screens are sold as "hi def ready" simply because they can downscale 720p through their component input and then display it on the 853x480 screen.

if you're buying a TV buy one with the highest resolution you can afford if you really want to see the benefit of hi def.

oh and seven, 1280x1024 will be fine for 720p as you can just letterbox it.

VGA cable is confirmed in OXM, so i guess it's official.

[suzakuseven]

*edit* Thanks FiL

[Marzipan Travolta]

I really wouldn't buy a HDTV in the next 6 months as prep for the 360 unless you're buying a new TV anyway or have more money than sense. Price will fall a lot.

[cubeadvance]

Try doing a quick search. There's lots of people in the same boat, and there has been some top advice given. My advice would be to wait.

[Ayton]

I upgraded in February (but I'm in the US where HDTV has properly rolled out, cable satellite and broadcast all carry HD.)

My advice is to compare the picture between the high-def CRT sets and plasmas/LCDs. People are willing to sacrifice so much picture quality for a thin TV. The contrast, depth, richness, color and viewing angle are still winners on CRT compared with the flat boys. The downside is that no CRT has perfect geometry.

After much comparing, I went for a Sony Wega HDTV. At 1080i, it's not a TV, it's a window. Don't discount CRT immediately. They still rule the picture quality roost, in my opinion.

(And Samsung is working on some almost plasma thin high-def CRTs at the moment, if memory serves.)

[Smoothy]

I'm personally going to wait a while. No point in getting HDTV till the consoles are actually out.

[Monkichi 2.0]

Does anyone have a site with comparisons between pictures on a HD TV and a normal one? I keep hearing about how "amazing" the difference is but every TV shop I've been in has the image hooked up with shitty composite.

[Jack]

Find a TV shop that isn't Dixons. Every town has at least one proper TV and hi fi store where they know what component leads look like.

[Vorgot]

Well, I have zero chance of getting a HD TV for games in the near future, as my main TV is in the lounge for *gasp* TV viewing, and my backup TV, which is still a 28" Widescreen, is in the back in the Games Room as we call it. Replacing a TV for the sake of playing games with high definition is just not going to happen in my house. Especially as the new consoles will still play on a standard set.

Microsoft pushing HD as the huge advance this generation is a crock in my opinion, as most of the new consoles will be hooked up to secondary TVs or in kids rooms, not attached to the house main TV, so I can't see the take-up on HD TVs going up because of consoles.

[El Geet]

Does anyone have a site with comparisons between pictures on a HD TV and a normal one? I keep hearing about how "amazing" the difference is but every TV shop I've been in has the image hooked up with shitty composite.

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Problem is there isn't really any HD source material (movie-wise) in this country yet apart from a couple of sattelite broadcasters.

Your best bet is a Sevenoaks Sound and Vision or Richer Sounds where they sometimes have a feed showing HD-1 (formerly Euro1080 or something) via sattelite which is a HD source.

[Ayton]

Microsoft pushing HD as the huge advance this generation is a crock in my opinion, as most of the new consoles will be hooked up to secondary TVs or in kids rooms, not attached to the house main TV, so I can't see the take-up on HD TVs going up because of consoles.

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It's not a crock, it's just not very internationally minded.

The 360 is an American console designed by an American company, and its biggest market is America, where HDTV is exploding. Makes perfect sense. It's the new TV standard. They just need to think of another way to market it in places like Britain that are a bit behind.

I keep seeing such hostility from the UK about Microsoft's "HD era" or whatever. It's so bitter. What's wrong with greatly increased resolution? This is the next generation. I don't want to still be playing games in 640x480 in two, three, four years. I want to see tiny things on the horizon the way PC gamers can. If anything this is overdue.

[MrMorgasaurus]

It's not a crock, it's just not very internationally minded.

The 360 is an American console designed by an American company, and its biggest market is America, where HDTV is exploding. Makes perfect sense. It's the new TV standard. They just need to think of another way to market it in places like Britain that are a bit behind.

I keep seeing such hostility from the UK about Microsoft's "HD era" or whatever. It's so bitter. What's wrong with greatly increased resolution? This is the next generation. I don't want to still be playing games in 640x480 in two, three, four years. I want to see tiny things on the horizon the way PC gamers can. If anything this is overdue.

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In addition I think MS would prefer you to put one of their boxes in your Living room with your primary tele. The media capabilities of the 360 will be far in excess of that of an (unmodded) Xbox. Ultimately they will want it to be an entertainment center and not just a games machine. The Hi Def ability of the 360 will no doubt aid this transition even if it only starts as 'trying it out on the really cool tele in the living room to see what looks like'.

I've got a modded box in my living room simply for the multimedia capabilities it offers. I wouldn't be without it now.

[Spunky Monkey]

I keep seeing such hostility from the UK about Microsoft's "HD era" or whatever. It's so bitter. What's wrong with greatly increased resolution? This is the next generation. I don't want to still be playing games in 640x480 in two, three, four years. I want to see tiny things on the horizon the way PC gamers can. If anything this is overdue.

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thats probably because the same TV over here would cost as 4 times as much, be smaller, with no HD content on normal TV and even things like films are hard to come by in HD.

Also paying out a few hundred quid (at the cheaper end of the scale, let alone the normal end of around 2 grand) is a bit of a problem with most people who have a perfectly working tv at the moment.

[Vorgot]

I keep seeing such hostility from the UK about Microsoft's "HD era" or whatever. It's so bitter. What's wrong with greatly increased resolution? This is the next generation. I don't want to still be playing games in 640x480 in two, three, four years. I want to see tiny things on the horizon the way PC gamers can. If anything this is overdue.

I'm not being hostile towards it, I just don't see it as the main thrust behind the new generation of machines. Its a great feature to have, no doubt about that, but it is the reason to buy into the next gen as Microsoft seem to think it is? It almost seems that MS are trying to get a hook for the next gen, PS1 & N64 made games 3D, PS2 injected emotion (or thats what they said) and now this gen is apparently the HD era? Seems like they are struggling to convince people to upgrade.

And the thing is, they won't need too much persading. I'll be first in line for a 360 thanks, but on my old TV. And I get the point about HD being huge in the US, but I'll also go back to the games on a second TV. My house can't be the only one where the main TV is for the wife and young children, which gives me the only time I can get on the games in back?

[senor_herer]

It's not a crock, it's just not very internationally minded.

The 360 is an American console designed by an American company, and its biggest market is America, where HDTV is exploding. Makes perfect sense. It's the new TV standard. They just need to think of another way to market it in places like Britain that are a bit behind.

I keep seeing such hostility from the UK about Microsoft's "HD era" or whatever. It's so bitter. What's wrong with greatly increased resolution? This is the next generation. I don't want to still be playing games in 640x480 in two, three, four years. I want to see tiny things on the horizon the way PC gamers can. If anything this is overdue.

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Too right, mate.

Hooray for somebody finally bothering with HD output on their consoles ("somebody" other than Sega that is - *reminisces about DC VGA boxes* ). I'm sick of going through hoops with VGA transcoders, deinterlacers, expensive imported cables and the like just to get bloody consoles to output a nice picture through something like VGA or DVI.

Anyone who's had the pleasure of gaming or watching movies at 720p/1080i (or god forbid 1080p - 1920x1080!!11!) through decent equipment (and with DECENT cabling) should know the difference it makes.

It doesn't surprise me that some people don't notice the difference though - I swear that 90% of people who own widescreen TV's watch everything in the wrong aspect ratio, I just see it sooooo often. You'll say "don't you care that his head looks like a rugby ball?" and they'll just stare at you blankly and reply that they "hadn't really noticed to be honest". If people can't even figure out that they're watching a 4:3 image stretched to 16:9 and/or don't care about it then I fear it won't be easy to sell them on the virtues of high resolution, non interlaced displays.

Thank god Sony and MS have taken notice, looks like we're going to be stuck with the same Nintendo problems with the Revolution though: 480i and no widescreen options on Nintendo games as usual

[Ayton]

I'm not being hostile towards it, I just don't see it as the main thrust behind the new generation of machines. Its a great feature to have, no doubt about that, but it is the reason to buy into the next gen as Microsoft seem to think it is? It almost seems that MS are trying to get a hook for the next gen, PS1 & N64 made games 3D, PS2 injected emotion (or thats what they said) and now this gen is apparently the HD era? Seems like they are struggling to convince people to upgrade.

And the thing is, they won't need too much persading. I'll be first in line for a 360 thanks, but on my old TV. And I get the point about HD being huge in the US, but I'll also go back to the games on a second TV. My house can't be the only one where the main TV is for the wife and young children, which gives me the only time I can get on the games in back?

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Point taken on the second TV thing. It seems Microsoft down right expects to have its console hooked up to the home's main screen, and perhaps they've misjudged that. Not with me - even now I play my consoles on the home's main TV, if only because there's no going back to 480i from 480p - but for the family man, possibly.

This means only that you must upgrade your private TV in the back before upgrading the one the wife and kids watch.

As for struggling to convince people to upgrade, though, well! I'd argue, and let's be honest, win, that Sony's PS2 mantra on imbuing "emotion" into videogames, an entirely intangible concept, represented far worse straw clutching than Microsoft's introduction of high-definition gaming. HD gaming is utterly demonstrable: look at this game running in 1920x1080, MS can say, see how it has many more pixels than your old standard def games? What could Sony do? "Do you feel sad yet? How about now?"

Anyway, I feel that as soon as you see a good HDTV demo, from a genuine 1080 source, that all of this will be immaterial. It's impossible to resist.

[Vorgot]

As for struggling to convince people to upgrade, though, well! I'd argue, and let's be honest, win, that Sony's PS2 mantra on imbuing "emotion" into videogames, an entirely intangible concept, represented far worse straw clutching than Microsoft's introduction of high-definition gaming. HD gaming is utterly demonstrable: look at this game running in 1920x1080, MS can say, see how it has many more pixels than your old standard def games? What could Sony do? "Do you feel sad yet? How about now?"

Anyway, I feel that as soon as you see a good HDTV demo, from a genuine 1080 source, that all of this will be immaterial. It's impossible to resist.

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I do agree on the emotion thing (did people really buy into that?), and I agree that games will look way better on HD TV, but there won't be too many places where I see that setup.

ANd I would be a dead man if I end up buying an 800 quid TV set to play a 300 quid console on. So I hope I never do see how good it looks or both my current TVs have terminal failures

[Ayton]

I do agree on the emotion thing (did people really buy into that?)

I did. Like a FOOL. I still have the press release in which they stated playing PS2 would be like jacking into the Matrix.

ANd I would be a dead man if I end up buying an 800 quid TV set to play a 300 quid console on. So I hope I never do see how good it looks or both my current TVs have terminal failures

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Aha. Again, though, it's not just for a games console, it's the new TV standard. HD-DVD and Blu-Ray launch properly at the end of the year. No matter which one wins the format war, they both play movies at 1920x1080 to fit snugly with the HDTV standard. Imagine Navy Seals at 1920x1080i! NAVY SEALS!

[Guest Supermackem]

Im hd ready now i have two hd sets. Watching some of the movies i have in hd makes dvds look like vhs tapes. And playing xbox games in hd makes a huge difference even only 480p. If you really want a tv thats hd ready and is future proof find one with hdmi on and your half way there. This will be the new standard in connections come hd-dvd blue ray and ps3, just dont know why 360 doesnt seem to have one. Also sets are at a nice price now, one set cost me under £700 not bad for what i got. I was of the thinking why wait when i can be seeing the benifits now with upscaled dvds wmvhd and xbox in hd.

[Smoothy]

Aha. Again, though, it's not just for a games console, it's the new TV standard. HD-DVD and Blu-Ray launch properly at the end of the year. No matter which one wins the format war, they both play movies at 1920x1080 to fit snugly with the HDTV standard. Imagine Navy Seals at 1920x1080i! NAVY SEALS!

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Pity the Xbox 360 only plays DVDs then or should I say

[Ayton]

One assumes the HDTV customer is not the type of wag to watch films on their games console.

You ever watch a movie on PS2? Ick.

[MotiVater]

Imagine Navy Seals at 1920x1080i! NAVY SEALS!

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I did a lol. A real one. Thanks for that.

[senor_herer]

Pity the Xbox 360 only plays DVDs then or should I say

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The Blu Ray thing could be a major bonus for the PS3 as it's one feature that could help sway the man on the street. It won't affect gamers' decisions but it could help Sony if consumer uptake and awareness of HD movies is good and if the BR Vs HD DVD affair doesn't all get out of hand. DVD playback certainly helped shift PS2's in Japan and Europe, less so in the US perhaps.

It's not something that would sway my decision, but the man in Game with £300 burning a hole in his pocket could be convinced 18-24 months down the line.

[Smoothy]

That's the one drawback of the Xbox 360. Give it a few years and HD might be coming thick and fast. And while they are stuck with a plain DVD, Sony will be stuffing lots of content onto Blu-Ray DVD. Still, it might not happen that way... but at least it's there.