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FishyFish

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Give over.

They're shite because they're shite. That's not continuity, that's just shiteness. If someone at the BBC was actually in charge of ensuring the SFX were 'made suitably crap' then the whole aim of trying to appeal to a new, wider audience would go out of the window. It was canned before because not enough people watched it. People didn't watch it because of the substandard scripts, acting, sets and FX. Even if that wasn't the exclusive rule, that's the perception most people had. Who, in their right mind, would commission a new series and actively seek to replicate all the things that caused it to fail in the first place?

And besides which, if your theory about the FX being crap as 'the whole point' holds true, how do you explain some of the good-looking FX they've already previewed? Won't that contradict the 'whole point' when those episodes get broadcast?

Agreed. No excuses. They can do better, and I'm sure they will. There's no excuse for crap FX anymore, there really isn't.

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I've seen a bit of Logopolis / Castrovalva. I'm going to watch them all when I get a bit of TV time. The crossover between Tom and Peter are when my strongest Who memories are: old enough to remember more than random scary moments and before I was too old / it turned shit.

I had recurring Escher like nightmares as a child, lost in a familar world where locations kept repeating or moving, and Castrovalva haunted me for a while.

I might get some of the other eps you lots are recommending off uknova (but I think they only carry episodes that are unavailable on DVD).

Castrovalva is wicked. The bit where the child is teaching the Doctor how to add up. Wonderful. The bit where he sees Castrovalva as a repeating loop. Magical. The bit where the dark haired bloke realises what they are "You made us, man of evil. But now we are free!". Spine tingling.

You've got to watch Kinda next Graham. Those bits where Tegan is in that creepy void and gets the snake tatoo on her arm are the stuff of childhood nightmares. And it has some proper intelligent writing too, expecially the bit where Simon Rouse goes nuts ("You can't mend people!")

They may have been slower paced, but that just meant you need to be a bit more patient and let the stories develop. "Rose" was Dr Who for the Sunny Delight generation.

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I thought it was alright. I guess it'll get better as the series progresses, as they did try to fit loads into one episode on Saturday. I feel they might have been better going for a feature length episode to start off with.

On the why that bin question, wasn't it because they where tring to track down the doctor through the girl and the boyfriend was an obvoius link to her, so it would use him to get to the Doctor through her.

The only thing that seemed out of place to me was the guns in the dolls. The thought of shop dummies coming to life and strangling folk seems much more scary anyway.

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I had recurring Escher like nightmares as a child, lost in a familar world where locations kept repeating or moving, and Castrovalva haunted me for a while.

Sans nightmares, I had the same experience as you. Castrovalva was a memorable story. Not as good now, of course (and, as usual, there's a lot of stupid padding). But as a kid... wow!

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it's the Star Wars argument all over again innit?

talking of Star Wars..I found the 45 min episode to be more enjoyable than all of the new Star Wars films thus far.

SERIOUS.

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Won't argue this point, but check here....

Linky

"It axed the show in 1989 because of falling viewing figures, but is now convinced that it could prove crucial in the battle for Saturday-night ratings" ... was where I got that from.

Like I say, haven't been a fan in years, but there's been lots of talk recently about why it got axed originally, and yes I heard the DG didn't like it, but as I understand it he used the poor viewing figures explanation to back that up. Happy to stand corrected.

Is 6.5 million viewers a lot these days? I honestly have no idea. I thought 14-15million was about average for something like Eastenders or something, and that must cost a damn sight less than this new show I'd have though, but I could be totally wrong.

Please don't see me as 'slagging the show off to my hearts content' - that implies I'm actively seeking to discredit the show, finding fault for the sake of being argumentative in an ongoing campaign of vitriol and criticism. I'm just offering my assessment of it. I thought it was very poor. It'll get no more discussion from me, because I've voiced my opinion. I think it's fantastic that other people liked it. Just not for me is all, for all the reasons that I stated.

Since the advent (and mass take-up) of so-called "multi-channel" television, viewing figures for individual terrestrial channels are far lower than they used to be. The 10.5 million who watched Who on Saturday translates as a massive success. The figures will doubtless drop next week, but if they can keep the series at somewhere around 8-9 million for the entire run, then it'll be renewed. Less expensive shows have been given more seasons even when hovering around the 5-6 million mark. It's a far cry from the days when 18 million people gathered around to watch the same show, that very very rarely happens these days.

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um he has a time machine linkster. If the Doctor nips away from Rose in the middle of the story he could be gone travelling alone for years. Then nips back to sort out the nestene stuff. During which time he could also nip to 1963 and Sumatra. Any gap is fair game. If he disappears in any story IMO on his own then who knows where or when he's off too.

He could, yes. Has he ever done that in the middle of a story though?

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If I could enjoy old Hartnell, Troughton and Pertwee episodes as an adult, why not this?

Because like me you knew the stories already. I can watch the old shows and enjoy them largely because of my memories of reading the books.

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Because like me you knew the stories already. I can watch the old shows and enjoy them largely because of my memories of reading the books.

Partly true I suppose. Except for the ones I didn't like as books but did when I saw the original show, and vice versa. But you have a point.

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Doesn't he pop off to the end of the world in Pyramids of Mars, to show Sarah what would happen if Sutekh succeeded?

Relates to the same story though doesn't it? Totally different to what cassidy's suggesting happened in the new one.

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They may have been slower paced, but that just meant you need to be a bit more patient and let the stories develop. "Rose" was Dr Who for the Sunny Delight generation.

I'm 32, I've never touched "good old Sunny D", I despise no-brain hyperspeed nonsense, and I loved the new Doctor Who. Explain that, smarty-pants! :)

And yes, at the time, Castrovalva was excelllent. And it still has magic moments. But it does look horribly dated now. And you must admit that all the material carrying the "coffin" with the Doctor in it was padding, and the Master's trap at the start (all that "index file" idiocy) was naff and also obvious padding. Castrovava's heart - the Escher stuff - was superb. But it's padded with very slow camp pantomime Master stuff, and lots of slow walking through a forest carrying a box. When they finally get to the city, it's great.

A Castrovalva-style story would not be the way to launch the new Who.

But Davison's wail of "Recursive Occlusion... someone is manipulating Castrovalva... we're caught in a space time trap!" is one of my favourite TV moments ever.

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Relates to the same story though doesn't it? Totally different to what cassidy's suggesting happened in the new one.

i'm just stunned at the praise its getting in the main. Feel's like Im in some kind of bizarro world. Where normal people are talking and enjoying Doctor Who again.

Oh and yes watch Kinda fantastic story :)

Its just a few books are set in these gaps linkster. I also tend to think the Doctor does bugger off and make notice of himself throughout history. Again another book thing though :wub:

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do you get to see them before us, because your 1st name is Davros or something? :)

I wish I could have that apostrophe back. I'm not Davros, I'm his long neglected sock drawer!

Hey, come to think of it, there's no reason why Davros couldn't be in the new series is there? They could show him as he originally was, before the accident that made him the bitter and twisted megalomaniac bent on universal domination that he is! That would rock.

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Just been looking at the episode titles on the BBC site. Some of them sound quite intriguing, especially "The Unquiet Dead"!

Come on, I want to see it scar children for life!

This episode does look rather creepy. Mind you episode 8 and 9 and 10 look really scary. Oh and the Dalek I have to say (as a non dalek fan) looks like it kicks ass. The new death ray effect is ace. Daleks = scary :)

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I loved it. Something (anything!) to watch on Saturday night again, other than Match of the Day.

Here's the clincher for me: I'd been building up my 6 year old daughter all week to watch this, and my 3 year old daughter wasn't wanting to miss out either. By the time Saturday comes around our boiler had broken, so the whole family were sat together on the sofa with a wollen blanket over us to keep warm.

As soon as those Auton things started moving I watched my 3 year old start slowly pulling the blanket up over her face, hiding behind it with only her eyes poking out above (but still watching intently), and the 6 year old was cuddling closer and closer to me, eventually gripping me hard and hiding her face behind my back.

They were terrified, but loved it and can't wait for the next one.

Result!

I'm going to have to move the sofa away from the wall for the Dalek episode, so they can hide behind it in time-honoured fashion.

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Just been looking at the episode titles on the BBC site. Some of them sound quite intriguing, especially "The Unquiet Dead"!

Come on, I want to see it scar children for life!

My five-year-old was scared by the Autons in the new episode - he watched it sat on my knee, in exactly the same as I watched the original Spearhead from Space sat on my dad's knee when I was five.

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There's an SFX Doctor Who special out which gives a brief synopsis of the stories to come (with some mild spoilers). I'm looking forward to episode 6  :)

Do they go back to (modern day) Earth? What I liked best about the first episode was spotting all the bits of Cardiff I recognised :wub:

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My five-year-old was scared by the Autons in the new episode - he watched it sat on my knee, in exactly the same as I watched the original Spearhead from Space sat on my dad's knee when I was five.

brilliant to hear. Thats exactly the point of the Series. Getting family's to sit together again on a saturday evening. To actually watch something decent on TV. Makes a change.

Oh and Ste glad to hear Who managed to scare and entertain the kids.

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I suppose if I had to find something to criticise it would be the abundance of holes in the plot, but it was only afterwards that they started occuring to me.

Oh, and I didn't like the new TARDIS interior.

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This episode does look rather creepy. Mind you episode 8 and 9 and 10 look really scary. Oh and the Dalek I have to say (as a non dalek fan) looks like it kicks ass. The new death ray effect is ace. Daleks = scary  :)

Am I right in thinking that the Dalek seen in the trailer is a "vintage" Dalek, and that the proper ones haven't been shown yet...

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Do they go back to (modern day) Earth? What I liked best about the first episode was spotting all the bits of Cardiff I recognised :wub:

Modern Earth based tales are 4 and 5 = the first 2 parter. Aliens of London/World War III

Episode 6 is future Earth I think =DALEK

Episode 8 is 1980's Earth this looks very scary for the kids IMO and its Eccleston favourite.

Ep 11 is Modern day Cardiff

Ep 12 and 13 we really now chuff all on them :) Think its modern Earth again?

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Oh, and I didn't like the new TARDIS interior.

Yeah, hopefully it will be filmed in a less "This is a set" type way in future eps. Useless director!! :)

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Slightly OT, I seem to remember a period (Tom baker I think) where the Tardis' control room was all Victorian with lots of brass and purple velvet. Why was that then? Davros' sock drawer can you help?

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