Doctor Who

[Shoes]

Who writes next week's? The gay one who can't write at all? (and I don't mean Mark Gatiss)

Ho!

[Davros sock drawer]

Ahh, 'The Body.' I still hold that as the most disturbing 45 mins of television ever.

Anyway... Dr Who, eh? Let's hope next week's is an improvement. I liked the drawing that came to life.

There's nothing to improve upon. That was a very funny episode, just totally different to anything else this series. It was executed so well, it's really just a question of whether people like the style or not.

I can understand why you might think it was a bad idea, but it was still done really well, within the format it set itself.

It was just a bit of light relief, some Who-based whimsy, rather than a full Who story. But within that framework, it also had some rather poignant and interesting things to say.

[El Pibe]

I must confess that I never watched Queer as Folk, but on the basis of Who, I cannot see quite why RTd is so revered.

His dialogue is okay...

Anyways...next weeks looks dreadful, from the trailer. Fingers crossed, though.

[mdn2]

I can understand why you might think it was a bad idea, but it was still done really well, within the format it set itself.

It was just a bit of light relief, some Who-based whimsy, rather than a full Who story. But within that framework, it also had some rather poignant and interesting things to say.

No, I did like the idea. It just felt like I had seen it all before. And I found the dialogue predictable. I mean "Mmm, tastes like chicken?!!"

[Davros sock drawer]

No, I did like the idea. It just felt like I had seen it all before. And I found the dialogue predictable. I mean "Mmm, tastes like chicken?!!"

Oh come on. It was a funny line!

[biglime]

The problem with Davies is that while he's a very, very good writer, he's really quite bad at comedy.

I thought last night's episode was a cracker, though - and let me say this:

The minute every episode of Doctor Who is in the vein of The Satan Pit or Girl In The Fireplace, the series dies again.

As for this being similar to something that's been done before... Where's the episode where someone makes a video diary about having their life touched by a genuinely iconic character? Nowhere. It hasn't been done before. And certainly not with so much heart - which is the real key to the show's success this time round.

Oh, and I thought Camille Coduri was brilliant in this episode.

[Shoes]

The thing with Russell is his stuff is always realistic. It's witty, but it never sounds laboured.

Like the bits with Jackie. She's great.

[biglime]

The thing with Russell is his stuff is always realistic. It's witty, but it never sounds laboured.

When he's not trying to write a "funny line", aye.

When he goes out to do the comedy, he falls on his face nine times out of ten, even though he hits the funnybone regularly in the midst of general dialogue.

[JPickford (retired mod)]

I wonder if the fate of 'Bliss' was a wry critque of Two Pints?

I've watched this episode twice now and I love it. Judging by some of the reactions it *does* seem expertly designed to push buttons in the more po-faced fans. While watching it I thought it would win over the hardcord fans - clearly not.

I love the fact that despite the light touch and the whimsy, RTD is making a quite serious point about the Doctor. The Jackie scenes in particular were quite wonderful - both funny and sad. I'll miss her if they move on when Rose leaves.

[jonathanhoey]

it *does* seem expertly designed to push buttons in the more po-faced fans. While watching it I thought it would win over the hardcord fans - clearly not.

You're saying you think RTD *intended* for people not to like it? Then the man's a genius.

[mdn2]

Judging by some of the reactions it *does* seem expertly designed to push buttons in the more po-faced fans. While watching it I thought it would win over the hardcord fans - clearly not.

I wouldn't consider myself a po-faced fan. I like the show as Saturday evening light entertainment and nothing more. In fact, this episode is the first time I've posted on an internet forum about Doctor Who. And I still thought it was crap. Poor story and poor dialogue. Like I said earlier I liked the idea, but it could have been handled so much better.

[JPickford (retired mod)]

You're saying you think RTD *intended* for people not to like it? Then the man's a genius.

Well I think he knew full well that certain people wouldn't like it - and judging from what he apparently said on the commentary (I haven't heard it) - it wasn't totally accidental.

[jonathanhoey]

I'll be interested to watch it again with the commentary, certainly. Hopefully it'll block out some of the dialogue. Bonus!

Edit: to clarify my position on this, I think the reason RTD's stuff frustrates me so much is that it's dreadfully, dreadfully inconsistent. He's capable of utter brilliance, but it seems to have to come at the price of indulgent bilge like L&M.

[JPickford (retired mod)]

Poor story and poor dialogue.

Not sure what you mean there at all. You've hit on RTD's strong points, well certainly the dialogue which I thought was wonderful.

[Jumble Jumble]

The style and format was fine, it was the execution I had a problem with. I don't mind a silly romp now and then (or indeed, quite often) if it's not also a bit rubbish. The jokes were about the level I could come up with (ie not good), Peter Kay was just Peter Kay, and as I said before I thought some of the acting was terrible - not all of it though, some of the guest stars were good and it was another good one for Tennant (for what we saw of him).

Spending a story only seeing a character reflected in others' eyes has been done before and can be incredibly good (e.g. Citizen Kane) - and those parts of this were very good. I liked that LINDA started a band, became friends etc. In fact I think I liked pretty much the whole story. It was just the jokes the acting and the childish direction that got to me.

I was slightly disappointed that the big secret about why he had been there was just "oh, I was just killing a monster" - I think I'd have liked it if it had tied in a bit more. I mean I don't remember even being told that the guy's mum was dead.

Also, I guess this means we haven't seen everything the tenth doctor has done - in the flashbacks he was in the living room on his own, no Rose, but still played by Tennant. So when did this happen?

[mdn2]

Not sure what you mean there at all. You've hit on RTD's strong points, well certainly the dialogue which I thought was wonderful.

I found it cringeworthy. Like I said earlier the 'chicken' line stood out. And when Bliss had been absorbed into PK ass and said something along the line of "You don't want to know where I am!" elicited a groan. Also we found out PK alien came from the sister planet of 'Raxo-whatever-it's-long-name-is' called 'Clom'. These are all predictable staple jokes from poor sitcoms.

And the story was slight. Alien recruits a group of people because he wants to absorb the Doctor because he will taste good. You can say what you like about the other half of the story but we have seen it all before. And better too.

Don't get me wrong. I do like the show and as I have said twice previous, I think this idea could have been done better.

EDIT: I agree pretty much with what Jumble Jumble said.

[K]

I think my problem is that RTD concentrates too much on the characters and story- the actual sci-fi elements are usually completely sidelined, and fairly irrelevent at the end of the day. It generally just looks as though the writer thought up the characters and the scenario, and then just slotted some generic baddies in as an afterthought.

It's admirable that we get a sci-fi programme that concentrates on character, but it does beg the question whether or not there's a point to the show being sci-fi at all, when it's treated as such a secondary element.

Interestingly, The Impossible Planet/The Satan Pit where the polar opposite of an RTD episode, in that it was chock-full of sci-fi devices, but had no characterisation whatsoever. It is possible to do both, though- all of Steven Moffatt's episodes have nailed it.

[Nick R]

I really liked the episode. It was fairly quirky and very funny to start with (I liked the scene in the laundrette), and although it got a bit too daft at times (once the faces started to appear on the Absorbalof'sbody), it was always great fun.

Marc Warren was good. I've never seen Hustle or Band of Brothers but I do remember him playing a particularly vicious baddie in an episode of A Touch of Frost. And he's going to play Mr Teatime as well!

[robbright]

I loved this episode,

ITs nice to see from a victims point of view for a change

The doctor seemed cold and devious insteado f all happy and smiley and bouncy.

[Bad Ambassador]

You're saying you think RTD *intended* for people not to like it? Then the man's a genius.

He knew it'd wind up a few fanboy internet nerds, who, in the grand scheme of things, don't count for shit.

[Moose]

I'll tell you what the series needs - an assistant that has his/her own agenda and isn't the hanger-on that they've all been so far. Someone bad and smart enough to avoid the Doctor's attentions.

[Bad Ambassador]

Who writes next week's? The gay one who can't write at all? (and I don't mean Mark Gatiss)

Matthew Graham, of Life on Mars fame. Not gay!

[Popo]

Also we found out PK alien came from the sister planet of 'Raxo-whatever-it's-long-name-is' called 'Clom'. These are all predictable staple jokes from poor sitcoms.

So wrong. Funny joke + expert comedic timing (on Kay's part) = laugh out loud moment.

If it wasn't Peter Kay delivering it, it would have been quite limp I think.

[Alex W.]

I knew from the get-go where this episode was going, which wasn't a flaw but it did give me an expectation of seeing things from another point of view. I felt that it failed because it was tired feeling. I'd seen it's like too often.

I like the fact that there is an effect on other people of the Doctor's dealings but it felt less sinister, less cold than it should have.

It's all very well for RTD to make sure the story is grounded in reality but constantly showing the contemporary planet is coming off as looking like a poor man's soap opera. He's mixed the forumla up a bit and that's great but he's now settled into another, equally stale, formula.

The idea of consequences is great too; just what the series needs but I'm afraid it's going to be pish again.

That's a good point, actually. Mixing up this idea of those the Doctor leave behind with an episode focussed more on comedy and clever editing, they kind of diluted the effect.

[Garwoofoo]

That's a good point, actually. Mixing up this idea of those the Doctor leave behind with an episode focussed more on comedy and clever editing, they kind of diluted the effect.

As opposed to say, School Reunion? Or The Girl In the Fireplace? Both of which mixed up the idea of those the Doctor leave behind with a serious and well-written plot and plenty of emotional impact?

The whole damn series has dealt with themes of love, loss and moving on. Now we know Rose is leaving, it seems blindingly obvious.

[Alex W.]

I'd kind of forgotten how much this series was about the Doctor leaving folk behind.

[JohnC]

I'm after listening to Mr. Blue Sky loads of times since this episode.

[SeanR]

I really don't want to post in this thread just to say that the shizznezz of this episode is actually what kept me watching, but it was.

and then I though, why would it have to be THIS doctor that visited him as a child to stop the shadow-thing, and not one of the earlier ones?

and if he was too late, why not go back and try again?

[Gommy]

I was hoping the Dr was going to have no recollection of him as a boy. Seeing as he travels in a time machine it seems perfectly possible that its in the Dr's future that he saves the boy/his mother.

[Jack]

Oh, man, that was really bad. Marc Warren looked like he was reading his lines off a card, pretty much every bit with Jackie was cringeworthy (apart from her telling Elton to bugger off), and the Absorbaloff was just awful. It might have seemed a bit better if it hadn't come after "The Impossible Planet"/"The Satan Pit", but I really felt like I was watching a bad fanfiction story.

And fucking Cardiff-dressed-as-London again. Apparently Cardiff is the new quarry.