Doctor Who

[Sidewaysbob]

The best bit was Danny's flashback.

War is hell kids.

Oh and me and the boy let out a shout of recognition when the two doors came together.

[Space Gibbon]

If only there was a second part where some or all of these things might be revealed.

Yeah, but usually the second part is answering the question "How is the Doctor going to get out of this/fix this?" not "What the hell is going on?" It kind of undermines things when the true nature of the threat is revealed fifteen minutes before it's resolved.

My point is that the whole episode was setup, much of which was exposition of information that was later revealed to be a load of bollocks. It was just a bit boring, generally, and part 2 will have to be pretty special to make up for it.

[Commander Jameson]

One thing I'm not clear on was the 3W bit. Was that meant to be a real discovery or just something Missy made up? If it was real, was the Nethersphere meant to be a business of sorts?

[Harsin]

It's something made up so families don't destroy bodies so they can be turned into Cybermen instead.

[Commander Jameson]

Thanks.

So it's meant to be a real thing here on Earth then (presumably sometime in the future)? I think I might have to rewatch it to work out where the bodies are coming from. I think I get it that the consciousnesses are uploaded into the Matrix thing, but not sure where the physical bodies are.

[Fury4k]

The physical bodies are in the chambers filled with the dark water...

[Delargey]

I dunno why they wanted the bodies anyway. If they were only using the bones-just build them all robot.

[pranny]

I wasnt sure why they were just bones and no flesh. Apart from it being creepy of course.

[Cassie Brook]

After watching the new epi, I have these questions: why are they in a plane when they have a TARDIS at their disposal anyway? I still can't get my head round that, lol. Can't wait to see the episode though! Also, they keep pushing that shot of Osgood and her inhaler in the promos, are we meant to think that she's still a Zygon or something?! :s

[Cassie Brook]

After watching the new epi, I have these questions: why are they in a plane when they have a TARDIS at their disposal anyway? I still can't get my head round that, lol. Can't wait to see the episode though! Also, they keep pushing that shot of Osgood and her inhaler in the promos, are we meant to think that she's still a Zygon or something?! :s

[Cassie Brook]

Haven't I posted???? Ok, here's my questions: why are they in a plane when they have a TARDIS at their disposal anyway? I still can't get my head round that, lol. Can't wait to see the episode though! Also, they keep pushing that shot of Osgood and her inhaler in the promos, are we meant to think that she's still a Zygon or something?! :s

[SeanR]

You posted.

[Alex W.]

Am I right in thinking that the whole "dead outnumber the living thing" means that they've used every dead human body as a Cyberman?

Wouldn't someone notice that there have never been any human skeletons anywhere in the world ever, because The Master is nicking them?

[Fury4k]

What is with you people and over thinking this show so much? It was just a scary turn of phrase to illustrate the potential of her plan and the size of her army.

[Mr Cochese]

There were only about twenty of them.

[Comrade]

Trailer for the finale:

Looks like they're going for the whole RTD-style world invasion thing.

[Glasgowchivas]

"Oh, a Scotsman shouting in the streets! Sorry, everyone! I didn't realise there was a match on!"

Michelle Gomez was brilliant in this, fantastic casting, I look forward to her future encounters with the Doctor.

Surely it's now only a matter of time before the Doctor regenerates as a woman; though given the current state of on-line commenting on all issues concerning women I'd expect Moffat to be beheaded on-camera shortly after the announcement is made.

[kensei]

I really don't understand the obsession with turning male characters female. I also half wonder if Missy is a misdirection - we've spent a good bit of time with Seb for a minor character - who is he? Pulling the reverse is probably too nuts especially after the hype, but there's an outside chance.

Secondly, we've seen two alternative reality mechanisms - the dream patch and the matrix that I also wonder how much of what we are seeing is real. The Master was traditionally after the Doctors regens, and the last time we saw him he was dying. Missy also picked Clara for something. Was the sequence with Clara and the patch a foreshadowing?

Mostly I'm rambling because Dark Water gave absolutely nothing away.

[Glasgowchivas]

I's not really an obsession though, is it? More just a question of saying why is this character always a white male? It's especially relevant with a character who can *literally* change into another person, in-story and have it be accepted.

[Mr Cochese]

The Chekov's dream patch is totally going to feature somehow in the resolution, if only as some stupid trick to defeat Missy. After that, dream patches will never be mentioned again.

[kensei]

I's not really an obsession though, is it? More just a question of saying why is this character always a white male? It's especially relevant with a character who can *literally* change into another person, in-story and have it be accepted.

Its not just Doctor Who, it's raised with other characters. James Bond always confuses me the most. The Doctor has always been very male archetypes but retained a certain continuity. I think that breaks if you make The Doctor female. The idea that the Doctor is somehow asexual has been nuked by the new series.

Someone will do it eventually though.

[Alex W.]

I think with Bond you have the excuse that half the fanbase (apparently) assumed it was just a code name for a bunch of different agents. I say apparently because I've never met anyone who thinks this but apparently people were upset by Skyfall giving him a single, slightly bizarre life.

[Mr Cochese]

Surely no-one gives a fuck about continuity in Bond. There's a guy in a dinner jacket who kills people and then makes a bad joke - that's all you need to know.

[Alex W.]

I think some people get a bee in their bonnet about having a canonical fictional universe that a set of stories take place in, as opposed to their being works of fiction that share ideas.

[Mr Cochese]

That's such a dreadful, robotic way to approach storytelling. In the oral tradition you'd always have numerous interpretations of the same stories and characters.

[Alex W.]

Preaching to the choir man. I really wish Disney had reset the Star Wars canon by making everything explicitly and equally canonical, including the stuff that contradicts the other stuff or exists in many mutually exclusive versions.

[kensei]

That's such a dreadful, robotic way to approach storytelling. In the oral tradition you'd always have numerous interpretations of the same stories and characters.

I think the fictional universe adds something done right. The idea that there are some under discovered depths under the surface adds structure yo the world and having a consistent set of rules rather than calvinball can aid storytelling.

There are benefits to the other way too. But I think it's ultimately Tolkien's influence over fantasy and sci Fi that means it tends towards canon. James Bond though? Seems mad.

[SeanR]

Its not just Doctor Who, it's raised with other characters. James Bond always confuses me the most. The Doctor has always been very male archetypes but retained a certain continuity. I think that breaks if you make The Doctor female. The idea that the Doctor is somehow asexual has been nuked by the new series.

Someone will do it eventually though.

a sexual tyrannasaurus!

[Lag]

I think you need some kind of consistency or continuity or the stories lose value and veer towards being meaningless. If Blofeld is killed in one adventure only to be the mastermind in a subsequent adventure, people will think it's more of a comic book. No-one killed off King Arthur and then ignored his death, it was a big deal. Captain Scarlet can be killed and resurrected in every adventure because it's a fundamental part of the continuity that he is.

[HarMGM]

Any form of continuity in Doctor Who is going to be the deathknell of the programme. The lack of it allows for it to go from a space adventure inside a robotic cyclops to a big silly romp with Robin Hood in the span of a week. More importantly, lack of continuity in the show has allowed it to radically alter both the premise of the show and the characterisation of its main character, which also feeds back into how the plot is dealt with.

Put another way, continuity will always ensure that Peter Parker will eternally remain a down on his luck teenager who can't catch a break. Continuity will ensure that Batman will always remain a rather brooding loner, even in his 'The Brave and The Bold' incarnation. Whilst that can have its appeal and allow for some real meaty storytelling and fleshing out characters, introducing that into a 50 year old show influenced by 50's sci-fi, Dan Dare and classic British children's literature isn't what i'd consider a good idea. Mainly because Doctor Who's roots make it far more anthalogy based in terms of storytelling. The Twilight Zone for kids, with Peter Capaldi instead of Rod Serling. It allows for the Doctor to go from Cosmic Hobo, to Gothic Horror Bohemian and allows for the storytelling to go completely mental and experimental. Offering up stories in which the fourth wall itself becomes a setting for drama.

I think you need some kind of consistency or continuity or the stories lose value and veer towards being meaningless. If Blofeld is killed in one adventure only to be the mastermind in a subsequent adventure, people will think it's more of a comic book. No-one killed off King Arthur and then ignored his death, it was a big deal. Captain Scarlet can be killed and resurrected in every adventure because it's a fundamental part of the continuity that he is.

Why? If the story is good enough than does it really matter if Blofeld is back next time around? The Final Problem is still a cracking Sherlock Holmes story even if it was retconned to hell and back. The same with the Death of Gwen Stacey still being a great Spider-man story, despite having had countless retellings and sequels which became shittier and shittier. A good story is just that, a good story.