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I must admit I've lost track of what's going on. I guess I'm not paying enough attention to all the religious gumpf.

Can someone summarise: Why did whats-her-face see the faces of the five in the temple built 4000 years ago by the thirteenth whose-they-are? I could understand them wanting to get the Eye of Jupiter to help them find Earth, but didn't really understand why her-there knew there would be this Cylon vision/prophecy/whatever as part of the temple... anyone?

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Ok, so... Final Five speculation:

This is clearly all being set up to make us think that Starbuck is one of the Final Five. Moore in interviews talks about a surprising fate for her character. We know that she finished her Season 3 (at least) filming commitments after Ep 15. We know that Lucy Lawless recognised one member of the Final Five. Starbuck painted pictures of the Eye of Jupiter in her appartment (can anyone go back to Ep 1 of Season 2 and check to see whether they're there?).

Now, Galactica is never this obvious, so I personally think we're being led down the garden path. We're meant to think it's Starbuck. Baltar still thinks it could be him. I'm guessing that it's neither, and that when the revelation comes it's going to be a real shock. But I can't work out who it is... Surely it can't be Adama, Lee or Roslin. So who does that leave that's an important enough character? Colonel Tigh? I can't believe it's him either... Maybe Tom Zarek?

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I thought that was a great episode, and tied up a few things that were bothering me from previous eps.

Grace Park acted her socks off in this episode. On the other hand I'm quite glad to see Lucy Lawless go, as I don't think I ever found her particularly convincing. Tricia Helfer is much better at being Baltar's significant other.

Starbuck painted pictures of the Eye of Jupiter in her appartment (can anyone go back to Ep 1 of Season 2 and check to see whether they're there?).

They're there. An eagle-eyed (a.k.a slightly obsessed) member of the SciFi forum noticed the similarity as soon as Ep11 was broadcast and posted some screencaps on the forum.

In other news apparently there was quite a jump in ratings, particularly with female audience members.

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On the whole, a brilliant episode, quite amazed by how much they packed in there, however

this whole final five thing is getting a bit silly now. I can understand how the humans wouldn't know who they are, but it seems that the Cylons can't even remember what the model types they made now! And, apparently, the only way to find out who they are is to go to some temple 4000 years old? What a load of bollocks.

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See, here at work, we figured on it being someone that deana had a bit of a run-in with, which is why she

apologised to them

and seeing how her documentary film was going to be

anti-military at the beginning

we also think that it's

tigh

it wouldn't be starbuck, why would they bother taking her ovary and then later convincing her that she was a mother, unless it was all a big LONG-WINDED ruse?

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Can't be Adama, really. Maybe Apollo, but not The Big Man himself.

Still, I do find it utterly ridiculous that the cylons haven't a clue who the Final Five are, but the hybrids somehow do.

Nice to hear about the ratings jump, though.

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I must admit I've lost track of what's going on. I guess I'm not paying enough attention to all the religious gumpf.

Can someone summarise: Why did whats-her-face see the faces of the five in the temple built 4000 years ago by the thirteenth whose-they-are? I could understand them wanting to get the Eye of Jupiter to help them find Earth, but didn't really understand why her-there knew there would be this Cylon vision/prophecy/whatever as part of the temple... anyone?

I'll take that as a no then.

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I'll take that as a no then.

Well, the whole "five pillars" and "five everything-else" things involved with the temple correspond with "the final five", leading me to believe that the Cylons themselves were somehow involved in the construction of the temple. Which is interesting, as it's part of the human scriptures. Also, if it does turn out that Starbuck's a Cylon, then her drawings of the Eye in her appartment tally with the Cylons being involved in it somehow.

Perhaps when they finally get to Earth they'll find that humans and Cylons have lived in peace there for thousands of years. Or something.

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Concerning that mysterious Cylon...

Adama is a Cylon"

Leoben was said to mix lies with truth, making him dangerous. However, for him to know such a thing, he'd have to know who the final five were, which wouldn't really make sense. Anyway, how are we to know that there's only one hidden Cylon? Maybe Roslin's a Cylon, and her visions linked to their ability to project. Maybe Starbuck's a Cylon too, for the same reason. Maybe Adama is too, meaning lee is a half-Cylon. Baltar could well be one too, leaving one more. I call Tyrell, because he suspected as much back in the first season.

Of course, I'm no doubt wrong. It would be quite a coincidence to have three of the five living on the same ship after all. Still, those are my suspects.

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Well, the whole "five pillars" and "five everything-else" things involved with the temple correspond with "the final five", leading me to believe that the Cylons themselves were somehow involved in the construction of the temple. Which is interesting, as it's part of the human scriptures. Also, if it does turn out that Starbuck's a Cylon, then her drawings of the Eye in her appartment tally with the Cylons being involved in it somehow.

Perhaps when they finally get to Earth they'll find that humans and Cylons have lived in peace there for thousands of years. Or something.

I thought the Cylons were a relatively recent invention? You're suggesting they were around four thousand years ago?!

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I thought the Cylons were a relatively recent invention? You're suggesting they were around four thousand years ago?!

They keep talking about this whole cycle thing and that it has happened before according to the religious texts. So while the current Cylons are a recent creation, there may or may not have been others 4,000 years ago. It's not all that clear yet and half buried in religion and stuff.

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They keep talking about this whole cycle thing and that it has happened before according to the religious texts. So while the current Cylons are a recent creation, there may or may not have been others 4,000 years ago. It's not all that clear yet and half buried in religion and stuff.

Indeed - "All this has happened before, and all this will happen again".

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Adamas other son Zak perhaps?

How could any of his sons be pure Cylons? Even if he is himself, I very much doubt his wife was, meaning his kids couldn't possibly have been among the final five. Unless either of them was adopted. :)

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Just saw a couple of bits of trivia on Wikipedia. I'll have to go check the DVD later for these.

# During Laura Roslin's visit to her doctor about her breast cancer, a Firefly-class transport flies past the window, from the TV show Firefly and movie Serenity. The special effects company Zoic Studios was responsible for the effects of both shows.

# In one of the final shots of the miniseries, one can make out in the distance the Starship Enterprise, from Star Trek: The Original Series.

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Didn't the miniseries begin after a 40 odd year truce after the end of a 1000 years war with the Cylons? Or am I mixing the original series up?

No that's correct. I'm not sure about the length of the original war, but we do know that the humans created the Cylons, fought them for a while then the Cylons disappeared into space... 40 years later they're back and they seem to have built up a religious mythology that couldn't possibly have been mythologised in the space of 40 years.

Which makes me think there's a secret ruling class of Cylons who created the current Cylon 'species' - the Cylon gods, if you will.

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They keep talking about this whole cycle thing and that it has happened before according to the religious texts. So while the current Cylons are a recent creation, there may or may not have been others 4,000 years ago. It's not all that clear yet and half buried in religion and stuff.

Maybe it's all some weird time loop thing and the all the stuff that is happening now is what they base the written texts on, build temples on and other stuff.

Nah.

We're up to 12, right?

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How could any of his sons be pure Cylons? Even if he is himself, I very much doubt his wife was, meaning his kids couldn't possibly have been among the final five. Unless either of them was adopted. :lol:

Why do the final five have to be 'pure cylon' the current group managed to produce Hera, therefore if they are reliving/retracing the 'scriptures' then there is a high chance that another mixed race child occured in the past and thus had the same symbolic relevance.

I was trying to imagine a character that could invoke a WTF response when revealed, the choice of Zak would blow away the central characters emotionally (Adama, Starbuck, Apollo.) Besides it's scifi this genre comes with a built in improbability drive! (IP Factor 1 : 3471447 - It's all a Dream!)

Something has been bothering me though, can Hera be reincarnated, being half cylon and all? Since there seemed to be a flap concerning her seeing a human doctor.

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Something has been bothering me though, can Hera be reincarnated, being half cylon and all? Since there seemed to be a flap concerning her seeing a human doctor.

I very much doubt it.

After all she's the product of the Sharon model cylon and Helo getting it on during season 1 on Caprica. As she's not a cylon "model" of any kind there won't be any spare Hera bodies for her consciousness to be resurrected into in the first place.

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I very much doubt it.

After all she's the product of the Sharon model cylon and Helo getting it on during season 1 on Caprica. As she's not a cylon "model" of any kind there won't be any spare Hera bodies for her consciousness to be resurrected into in the first place.

They could have cloned her when she was on the cylon base ship, she could have a cylon biased consciousness, who knows.

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Why do the final five have to be 'pure cylon' the current group managed to produce Hera, therefore if they are reliving/retracing the 'scriptures' then there is a high chance that another mixed race child occured in the past and thus had the same symbolic relevance.

They have to be pure Cylons in order to be classed as a "model" surely? Hera's half-Cylon, but she's never been considered to be one of the numbers.

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