Ninja Gaiden - again

[therealjohnpeat]

I wrote enough about NG in the other thread but I can summarise here I think.

It's a bit broken for players who don't want to put in some time and replay stuff more than you really should have to - it can be frustrating - you will turn off your 'Box and do something else many times

BUT

When it's working it's superb and I really cannot think of another game which has rewarded me so richly when it all went right...

Returning to games like KOTOR and PGR2 just reminds me how it's possible to complete those simply by putting in time - not necessarily effort - this just isn't possible in NG.

Also - get your mitts on the Torrent Download (see other thread or Suprnova for a link) of the Boss Battles - they are seriously fantastic to watch - they really show how the game should be played (and how it can be bent occasionally)

JP

[Okotta]

I'm downloading that Torrent file as I write this, but it's a little slow getting it.

DL speed is only around 10 kb/s and I'm on a 512 / 256 DSL connection, so it should be a lot faster - maybe a lot of people had the same idea as me and started downloading at the same time?

Is there another place, besides http://www.master-ninja.com/download/ where I can get the boss video?

And - is Alma in fact the hardest boss in the entire game?

[kerraig UK]

JP - the game is NOT broken. It is hard for sure but it is never unfair. I sometimes turn Ocarina of Time off out of frustration. Would you say thats broken too?

[Lovelyman]

I'm downloading that Torrent file as I write this, but it's a little slow getting it.

DL speed is only around 10 kb/s and I'm on a 512 / 256 DSL connection, so it should be a lot faster - maybe a lot of people had the same idea as me and started downloading at the same time?

Is there another place, besides http://www.master-ninja.com/download/ where I can get the boss video?

And - is Alma in fact the hardest boss in the entire game?

Torrents go faster if more people are downloading (and hence seeding)

[therealjohnpeat]

That Torrent is slow - which is down to the usual stupidity of people choking their outgoing bandwidth whilst leeching at full speed and then disconnecting when it's done rather than allowing people to continue d/ling (e.g. selfishness).

It took me over 2 days to get it but it's worth the wait I can assure you

As for the term 'broken' - I use that term to describe a game which has one or more faults which will drive many players away from it - and NG has a few things which qualify I'm afraid - the most obvious being.

Lack of savepoints (Level 4 being the classic example)

Lack of a Training Arena - you have to learn your moves on the job which usually involves a lot of replay

I don't remember anything in Ocarina which made me switch off in disgust - nor do I remember having to play for 40mins+ just to save what I'd been doing

End of the day I think a lot of people will get this - get their arse handed to them - take it back/trade/sell/rent it - wheras with a bit more 'love and attention' they could have enjoyed the story on 'Easy' - trained up on 'Normal' and then flipped out on the harder difficulties...

Just my 10p tho

JP

[Okotta]

I just downloaded all the Boss movies and you're right - they're absolutely amazing to watch!

This guy is really good

[Lazychu]

I definately need to try that glitch on the first Chapter 10 boss on my next run through.

[TheSlugFormerlyKnownAsNap]

The game gets better and better now that I've the controls sussed out. The horse-riders and boss (chapter 2) were a piece of piss after I finally took some time practising my arrows using the targetrange, and now with the counter-attacks firmly in place I'm a pretty tough son of a bitch. Now I'm up against the big fat guy on top of the airship, hopefully I'll have him sliced to bits in no time

[Robo_1]

the save point is pretty close

I must have missed one then, as I'm saved at the bit before the great hallway (with the skeleton key). Every time I have to fight the bitch I have to slog through the water section, those three bastard hard black Ninjas and fight my way through the Library. Have I missed a save point somewhere as I find this to be Ninja Gaidens Achilles heal. Making the game as hard as it is is fine, but making it dull as fuck by forcing players to continually re-tread old ground, just to get to the rock hard boss battles just isn't on. If you're going to make the bosses as hard as they are, then there should be a save point directly before the encounter, to allow people the chance to practice without being forced to waste 5 - 10 mins doing mundane shit that is both boring, frustrating and incredibly repetitive.

Don't get me wrong, I think NG is a fantastic game, the scale of it, the combat and the level design is all top shelf stuff, but why make a difficult game needlessly harder by restricting save points, and forcing players to re-do so much?

Oh and just in case anyone missed them, when you get back to the Monastery and you're on the green broken ledge directly above the great hall, then on either side of the ledge is a platform you can jump to which has health and devil charges stored. There is also a thin walkway directly beneath each end, which also has health etc. Just in case anyone missed them

Anyway, back to it!

[Okotta]

After I fought the black ninjas, and did the fight in the library and opened the safe a second time, I just went back through the water and saved again.

Then I only needed to go through the water, and straight on to the boss, when I died at the boss

[TheSlugFormerlyKnownAsNap]

This game is pure sex up your arse. After playing and finishing Prince of Persia the last few days I was afraid it would feel clunky and unfair, but it's more like it's big brother on steroids (when it comes to combat that is, PoP reigns supreme with it's environmental puzzles and challenges). When you get the hang of it, it's incredible what you can pull off. It's like watching a John Woo film without the dodgy dialogue.

[Ian_S]

This game is pure sex up your arse.

It is a bit of a bugger, isn't it?

I can't really understand why everyone likes it so much either. I just haven't 'clicked' with it at all. It's not broken or anything, but it does feel a bit clunky to me, especially on the platforming bits. Having a camera that's always at a distance low behind you makes it awkward to judge where the edge of the platform is, and it's impossible to get Ryu facing the right direction unless you block and shuffle round slowly on the spot. It's tiresome. And the number of times he's run up a wall instead of along it, or wall-ran right over a platform and fallen down the other side at a crucial moment makes me want to cry.

The combat in this was only really any fun in the early levels when it was against a handful of ninja in open spaces. The later levels (I'm on 13 now) have been a joyless grind.

[dreamylittledream]

For me its a bit of love one minute hate the next.

I think I'm okay with the combat and since the bloke with the horse I haven't found the bosses too challenging...having said that I'm on chapter 7 now and dreading the arrival of Alma.

However whilst the combat is ace and fluid the platformy bits are frustrating in the extreme...unlike in POP you don't feel entirely in control of Ryu when jumping/wall running around...the section with the maces I've just gone through are teeth grindingly annoying.

But its not too hard I reckon....I'm making progress and I'm hardly the worlds most talented gamer.

[Lazychu]

The trouble with the platforminf is that he just seems to have no weight when you're trying to wall run and jump about and he's just too twitchy. Combine that with the low and camera and it's often a recipe for extreme annoyance.

[dreamylittledream]

The trouble with the platforminf is that he just seems to have no weight when you're trying to wall run and jump about and he's just too twitchy. Combine that with the low and camera and it's often a recipe for extreme annoyance.

This is true....and if the camera isn't lined up right he always jumps in the bloody wrong direction.

Thankfully it doesn't effect the fighting bits...even when the camera is in an odd position Ryu usually can take care of himself.

Anyway just met Alma and kicked her ass first time.....okay I did have a full bar of ninpo (but then again where was there to use it earlier in the level...the tentacle thing is a wuss) and I only used 3 potions. Either the game is getting easier or I'm getting better.

Anyway I'm reassured by the thought Alma is the toughest boss...I will defeat this game...oh yes!

[Lazychu]

Thankfully it doesn't effect the fighting bits...even when the camera is in an odd position Ryu usually can take care of himself.

And the auto aim is really good in combat, which helps a lot.

Anyway, just beat the chapter 11 boss 2nd time around. Not too bad actually, but now for some more platforming.

[bbbpol]

BTW - I have 4 small health potions; Hope that's enough for this battle

.

oh!!!- i've only got 1 health bar with no potions and no ninpo ....and no nearby savepoints!!!!!!

[Pow]

there's one thruogh a wee tunnel of water leading out of the room full of water with the lift back up to the monastery.

I fucked it up royal on very hard last night, saved in the wrong slot and had to kill her with only 1 full life potion, and a load of magic elixers. Took 22 tries (I counted), but I had a fantastic time doing it.

I'll agree that the platforming is shit, every time you get 'stuck' running along a wall and fall back to the bottom is a right cunt, but the combat more than makes up for it for me.

I'm now trying to kill 80 skeleton zombie things for some worthless prize, they're actually a bit challange on the harder difficulties, takes ages to get them off you if you if you forget to take off the head.

[bbbpol]

i've only tried about 10-15 times so far....( most i've done is half her life bar!)

..will try when get home after work..see if i can beat your 22 attempts!

[Wiper]

You're right though, unless he's damn good at it and dodges like fuck.

I beat her on my third go with no health potions (but four Ninpo slots + two thingy elixirs... the red ones). Worship me.

(Powered up art of Inferno + slashy slashy = easy boss.)

Oh, and if you want an easy way to beat the 40 fiend challenge (nets you an extra Ninpo thingy IIRC) just fight from the first floor - the normal fiends can't climb stairs, so you can deal with the bastardy flying ones one at a time, then when they stop spawning wade into the normal fiends (only ever two at a time, so it should be fairly easy). If that's too hard for you then just keep jumping and throwing the windmill shuriken at them from the stairs for an el-cheapo win.

Most annoying boss for me though had to be either the bone dragon (again only three goes, but that bloody platforming section before it took me about 10 minutes to complete every time. Fssking wallruns), while the tanks can piss right off. Oh, and the Radio tower section seriously pissed me off, until I realised you don't actually have to kill all of the bazooka wielding chappies (my aim with the strongbow = not shit-hot)

[dreamylittledream]

I beat her on my third go with no health potions (but four Ninpo slots + two thingy elixirs... the red ones). Worship me.

(Powered up art of Inferno + slashy slashy = easy boss.)

Oh, and if you want an easy way to beat the 40 fiend challenge (nets you an extra Ninpo thingy IIRC) just fight from the first floor - the normal fiends can't climb stairs, so you can deal with the bastardy flying ones one at a time, then when they stop spawning wade into the normal fiends (only ever two at a time, so it should be fairly easy). If that's too hard for you then just keep jumping and throwing the windmill shuriken at them from the stairs for an el-cheapo win.

Most annoying boss for me though had to be either the bone dragon (again only three goes, but that bloody platforming section before it took me about 10 minutes to complete every time. Fssking wallruns), while the tanks can piss right off. Oh, and the Radio tower section seriously pissed me off, until I realised you don't actually have to kill all of the bazooka wielding chappies (my aim with the strongbow = not shit-hot)

Could have been worse....you could have had to do that stupidly designed bit with the skeleton archers over and over again before getting to the boss. That bit was just plain evil...if you had no bloody arrows left anyway.

And the bow really does need a lock on....I've lost count of the vast number of arrows I've wasted by hitting pointlessly behind my target.

No matter tis all good

[Wiper]

Could have been worse....you could have had to do that stupidly designed bit with the skeleton archers over and over again before getting to the boss. That bit was just plain evil...if you had no bloody arrows left anyway.

And the bow really does need a lock on....I've lost count of the vast number of arrows I've wasted by hitting pointlessly behind my target.

No matter tis all good

Aye, that bit got on my nerves until I realised that by wall running down the steps they were much less likely to hit me. Then I was free to slash 'em to death.

Much worse was the bastardy bazooka people at end of corridor section just after destroying the radio tower. In the end I just took 'em all out with one fully powered up Art of the Inferno. Taught 'em a lesson that did

[Pob]

I love facing off against those heavily armed commandos, deflecting their fire, running rings around them before getting in close enough to slash the shit of of them and send them flying in all directions.

This games makes you feel like the ultimate badass - if only someone would make a Jedi game like this.

[Prine]

This games makes you feel like the ultimate badass - if only someone would make a Jedi game like this.

Dear lord

That would be fucking great

[MikeF]

I managed Alma on my third attempt

Have to say that thi sgame is easily the best I have played this year (I re bought my xbox just for this game)

Currently on Chapter 10 just about to face that electirc worm thing again.

[Vemsie]

Dear lord

That would be fucking great

Dante ----> ninjas -----> Jedi's

TRUFAX

[cassidy]

Alma' owning me at the moment. Not to worry only tried 2 times so far.

Will spend a bit more time on it tonight and then she shall fall.

Bloody amazing game.

[sid]

This game is a joke. I got it about an hour ago, and am stuck on the locked door section just after the first save point. Those white Ninja's are tough to beat, especially when you have multiples of them coming at you. Good grief.

That camera's a bit dodgy too.

just wait until he gets to through the next doors and then onto the horse guy.

itll break him

[cassidy]

I lied shes till owns me, after about 20 attempts last night no joy

Thasts wih full health and Ninpo. Nearly got her etohugh one motre hit and she'd have fallen. HARD boss

[Lazychu]

Ok, this a potentially game ruining section. Why the FUCK did they do this shite?

Chapter 14 - Cunting ghost fish

Ridiculous. I'm tempted to just walk away for good. Nice work Team Ninja.