Disgaea Hour of Darkness

[Sabreman]

Just to be clear - can you turn off the speech altogether and just have text? I always prefer my big games with no speech.

[Juria]

No it's fucking shit.

I just died at what I think was the last battle of the first proper mission - Prince Vy something. The game made me sit through ALL the credits and then gave me an option to save - which I did thinking it would save experience points or something. NOPE! My save game is now at the very beginning of the game which means I have to do it all again including the tutorial.

What a load of shite.

you can save between each map. I thought La Pucelle was really really really hard until I realised that you can recouperate energy and save a lot. Oh, I think Danryu is mixing up La Pucelle and Disgaea in terms of the intro video.

[Guest]

What scum. US version for me then.

[Juria]

It is good to have the japanese speech. I think it's good anyway. the american speech is alright too if you're used to anime dubs But putting it on CD is unforgivable. My PS2 throws a fit when it reads from CD!

[JPickford (retired mod)]

you can save between each map. I thought La Pucelle was really really really hard until I realised that you can recouperate energy and save a lot. Oh, I think Danryu is mixing up La Pucelle and Disgaea in terms of the intro video.

I DID save between each map. But I also saved after Game Over which wiped my progress.

[Juria]

Then it should load it at that EXACT point, honest

[JPickford (retired mod)]

Hmm. On further investigation it DID keep my partys experience but I was right at the start of the storyline.

It only made be do one tutorial level and that one had a chequerboard of geo thinky so I killed everyone with one hit in a mega combo. Then I had the castle unlocked again.

Very odd. It also says CYCLE:2 on the save game. It's as though I've finished the whole game and I'm playing it through from the start again. Bug?

[Guest nomenclature]

I ain't never seen that happen. You certainly can start the game again after finishing the game, but other than that I have no idea...

[hub2]

Picked it up earlier and had a quick 10 minutes which turned into a lenghty 2 hours.

Initial impressions? Very confusing for a newbie to tactics type games (me) but I'm having fun none the less.

Graphics are just lovely and I'm enjoying the humour of the script and the voice acting isn't bad at all either imo.

Unfortunately I have three RPG's on the go at the moment, I might have to leave this a week or two before I truly get stuck in.

Anyhoo, thumbs up so far.

[Juria]

I've got Disgaea, la Pucelle, FFX-2 aaaand Xenosaga all on the go, that's just if you're not including GBA games too I would say most of them are on hold and Disgaea and La Pucelle move forward at 2 hours per week each

[ianinthefuture]

Hmm. On further investigation it DID keep my partys experience but I was right at the start of the storyline.

It only made be do one tutorial level and that one had a chequerboard of geo thinky so I killed everyone with one hit in a mega combo. Then I had the castle unlocked again.

Very odd. It also says CYCLE:2 on the save game. It's as though I've finished the whole game and I'm playing it through from the start again. Bug?

I did exactly the same. It's not a bug. The game ended because you lost to that demon guy, who then became head of the Underworld. Thus, the story ended.

I was glad to restart actually, as I'd only been playing a couple of hours and you keep all exp, items etc, which made it a bit easier for me. Still haven't beaten that shit Vywhatever though.

I really like it. Been looking for a tactical RPG like this for aaaaages.

[JPickford (retired mod)]

So basically If i fail in ONE battle I get sent back to the start and have play through about 6 levels (including tutorial) to get back to that point.

What sort of game designer puts you back in a position where all the characters are explaining stuff to you a second time? If this going back to the start is a deliberate design feature they should at least drop all the tutorial stuff.

What a load of crap.

[George Clooney]

I started playing it yesterday. The amount of stuff to do in it scares me.

[JPickford (retired mod)]

A couple of things are bugging me. The cursor control is rubbish. I keep losing the cursor where there are pits and holes in the map. Very frustrating.

Also it's hard to get a good clear view of the 'action' when lots of characters are crowded together. Good and Bad characters all looking very similar and using a similar colour palette makes this even worse.

The gameplay IS there but it's a shame it's buried under a clumsy and dated interface.

I don't think this is a patch on Vandal Hearts so far.

[tosser]

I too am a fellow newbie to this type of game.

Does anyone have any basic tips on how to get your characters levelled up? My Level 1 characters are so weedy they keeping getting their arses kicked with one hit. Is it necessary to keep playing the early maps over and over to get them reasonably strong?

Also I was wondering how this compared to FF Tactics Advance in terms of how accessible it is. Is FF any easier for newbies like me to get into?

[pancho]

A couple of things are bugging me.  The cursor control is rubbish.  I keep losing the cursor where there are pits and holes in the map.  Very frustrating.

Also it's hard to get a good clear view of the 'action'  when lots of characters are crowded together.  Good and Bad characters all looking very similar and using a similar colour palette makes this even worse.

The gameplay IS there but it's a shame it's buried under a clumsy and dated interface.

I don't think this is a patch on Vandal Hearts so far.

Saying Disgaea is inferior to vandal hearts on the strength of interface is a silly thing. The gameplay is many times more complex and involving than Konami's last gen efforts and I greatly prefer the interface, dialogue and story. Personally I think you'd have a hard time doing a direct comparison of the two games and seeing VH come out on top. Although I agree it is occassionally hard to get a good clear view of the action.

If nothing else it should have taught you the fundamental SRPG rule of keeping two leapfrogging saves on the go at all times.

[JPickford (retired mod)]

Saying Disgaea is inferior to vandal hearts on the strength of interface is a silly thing.

I didn't say that and I'm not being silly. I'm expressing MY OPINION based on MY EXPERIENCE.

I haven't found the game as involving or entertaining as Vandal Hearts SO FAR. And a couple of design flaws (including the interface) are hampering my enjoyment.

I disagree about keeping 2 saves. That may be a practical solution but it doesn't negate the design flaw. The player should NEVER be dumped back to the start of the game like that. Using a workaround does not remove the problem.

[George Clooney]

I too am a fellow newbie to this type of game.

Does anyone have any basic tips on how to get your characters levelled up? My Level 1 characters are so weedy they keeping getting their arses kicked with one hit. Is it necessary to keep playing the early maps over and over to get them reasonably strong?

Also I was wondering how this compared to FF Tactics Advance in terms of how accessible it is. Is FF any easier for newbies like me to get into?

The first map in the castle in the first chapter (I forget what it's called) is pretty good for levelling up level 1 characters. Get one character to throw the geostone onto the panel near where you start, get another character to whack the other geostone. Big chain reaction that wipes out all the panels, kills a load of the monsters, and gives you a load of bonus stuff after the mission, usually some bonus exp as well. the remaining monsters should be weak enough to kill with your lower level characters.

Or, if you attack an enemy with a strong character, and put weaker ones around them so that they team up, the exp gets shared.

[JPickford (retired mod)]

Just got to the third map in the ice level (second mission - chasing the angel assasin). This mission is a lot more interesting but the third map has me massively outnumbered. Hmm....

This is the bit I like about tactics games, getting slaughtered then figuring out a solution.

[ianinthefuture]

So basically If i fail in ONE battle I get sent back to the start and have play through about 6 levels (including tutorial) to get back to that point.

What sort of game designer puts you back in a position where all the characters are explaining stuff to you a second time?  If this going back to  the start is a deliberate design feature they should at least drop all the tutorial stuff.

What a load of crap.

The game finished. That's why it went back to the beginning. The save it offers you is a restart save, therefore I'm thinking you should bite the bullet and have (shock!) two saves! That way not only can you start the game again with your levelled up characters, but you can also carry on with your old save if you want - making a second attempt at defeating Mid-Boss! Wow!

Note in many blurbs for the game it mentions "multiple endings"? Well when you lose to Mid-Boss you see one of these many endings.

I'm going to end up repeating it about 40 times if I keep on writing.. So.. Yeah. I'm just bewildered you don't understand, is all.

[JPickford (retired mod)]

I still don't understand.

I had no idea that saving would put me back to the start. And I still don't understrand why that's a good idea.

[waddie]

I still don't understand.

I had no idea that saving would put me back to the start. And I still don't understrand why that's a good idea.

It doesn't do that normally. If you die elsewhere, you just get "Game Over" and back to the title screen. I believe losing to Vyers/Mid-Boss is considered a full game ending, just as if you completed the game. The save option may make more sense in that context. Doesn't make it right, of course, but so far I haven't seen a post-death save option anywhere except after dying to Vyers.

Spot on about the interface. The perspective and extreme height differences can make it a bitch to find the right square. Having to switch between d-pad and stick for different things for no readily apparent reason doesn't help, especially when the d-pad directions never seem to map intuitively to the resulting cursor movement.

Still, massive respect is due for the inclusion of "Skip story". Now if only they could just incorporate a line of sight/visibility system and replace the clunky move + action system with proper action points. Maybe switch all the swords and spells nonsense for a large variety of guns and grenades.

[JPickford (retired mod)]

Now if only they could just incorporate a line of sight/visibility system and replace the clunky move + action system with proper action points. Maybe switch all the swords and spells nonsense for a large variety of guns and grenades.

I'll buy that.

[routeburn]

I've got Disgaea, la Pucelle, FFX-2 aaaand Xenosaga all on the go, that's just if you're not including GBA games too I would say most of them are on hold and Disgaea and La Pucelle move forward at 2 hours per week each

My copy has been dispatched so I should get it on Tuesday. However, I'm in the same sort of boat as Juria.

I'm currently ploughing through FF-X, and am about 30 hours in (and loving it actually). However, I'm still about 2/3 of the way through Metroid Prime and 1/2 way through Shenmue II.

Given this weekend's sale at Gameplay, I'm now the proud owner of FF-X2 and Morrowind GotY.

So, with Disgaea on its way in addition to FF-X2 and Morrowind, I think I've got enough gaming time to last me for the next year or two. Can people stop releasing great games please?

[Jolly]

It's on a CD? Gah. I was going to get it tomorrow.

I may need to have a rethink. (Rez, Dancing Stage and fucking Frequency are cds too...Some of my favourite games and I have to steal a mates PS2 to play them.)

[Sidewaysbob]

Don't go near the "item world" until you have a leveled up team.

You have to go through 10 floors before you can escape. this takes about an hour, you can't heal anyone becuase they usually die on the first floor. goddamnit.

yes to the clunky controls, yes to the dieing and having to start again and yes to the confused screens with loads of characters on.

But it's definatly a game i'll be sticking too. I was leveling up my team in the castle last night, just a quick ten minutes after tea ... .at 1am the wife wanted to know when i was going to stop shouting at the TV.

As for FF tactics. much the same, but much harder and with a bit more depth. But skills i learnt on FFT, i'm using here. ie move as far as you slowest charater, use the landscape to cover weak characters, BUY BIGGER WEAPONS.

Hows everyone getting on woi the dark assembly, got any new laws passed yet ?

[Ryan]

I got through to lvl10 on Item World, and clicked "No" to the "Return to Castle" thing, coz I didn't know what it ment :-/

Died on the next stage

[Guest nomenclature]

If you kill the Item Boss on floor 10 you should then get a Mr. Gencys Exit. Using this will allow you to exit at whatever level you're on. Always keep one handy. The level of guys in the item world also depends on it's rarity, so you'll want to keep to cheap and cheerful items at the start.

[SteveH]

Only started playing this this afternoon - but I'm hooked already. Just one question, why do my characters sometimes do combos and sometimes not? I set them to surround and then attack a single enemy but combo'ing seems random?

Oh and the geo mod thing is wayyyyyyy over my head at the moment. But the lovely thing is, you need to know to make any progress.

[Guest nomenclature]

Comboing works by having each character attack the same enemy in sequence. Team attacks (I hope I've got combo and team the right way around here) are when you have a set of up to four characters standing adjacent to each other with one attacking. When you select the attacking character you should see some percentages in the top left hand corner. These are the chances of each adjacent character joining in the attack. This is dependent on things such as having the same weapon or one character being the pupil of another. This percentage goes up the longer the characters stay in the same place too.

Team attacks combined with move cancelling make up a big part of the tactics as you only need one character to initate the attack. Move other characters up adjacent before executing the attack but don't have them do anything, do the team attack, then you can cancel the movement of the adjacent characters and move them again. This isn't making much sense. Maybe I should lay off the beer.