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Babylon 5


sandman
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When it was on Channel 4 I tried to get into Babylon 5 from around Season 4. I felt I had missed too much and couldn't reallly understand all the back story.

Anyway, I missed Season 1 coming out on DVD completely, but Season 2 had a much bigger advertising push ( strangely, the same thing repeated itself with Seasons 3 and 4 ) so I picked up Seasons 1 and 2 at the same time.

I haven't looked back since.

I just watched the last 3 episodes of Season 3 last night and they are, quite simply, some of the best TV ever produced IMO.

I love Seasons 3 and 4 of Star Trek TNG, but Seasons 2 and 3 of Babylon 5 surpass even this IMO. Perhaps Season 2 of The X Files is better, but only just.

Of course, if you're not into Sci Fi then you won't like Babylon 5. But, for those who are and haven't given it a go then I suggest you stop what you are doing and head down to HMV post haste.

The 5 year story arc is unprecedented in modern TV as far as I know. The story itself is the best Sci Fi tale ever on TV. The characters are fantastic, the different races well thought out and the scripts extremely good.

Are there any other fans out there or am i on my own on this one?

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Yeah I like it, but niggles make it less essential, mainly the way that the Shadow/Vorlon war was ended by Sheridan talking to them like they were naughtly school kids.

Also, [spoilers] Season 5 was badly written crap, Ivanova should not have left (MJS's purely responsible), Bill Mumy's character was under used, etc [/spoliers]

But Walter Keonig as Bester was creepily effective and remains one of the best characters in the whole thing.

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Yeah I like it, but niggles make it less essential, mainly the way that the Shadow/Vorlon war was ended by Sheridan talking to them like they were naughtly school kids.

Also, [spoilers] Season 5 was badly written crap, Ivanova should not have left (MJS's purely responsible), Bill Mumy's character was under used, etc [/spoliers]

But Walter Keonig as Bester was creepily effective and remains one of the best characters in the whole thing.

It has to be said, all in all, it's a bloody good show. And Evil Chekov is *fantastic*! Keonig needs to do more baddies.

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When it was on Channel 4 I tried to get into Babylon 5 from around Season 4. I felt I had missed too much and couldn't reallly understand all the back story.

Anyway, I missed Season 1 coming out on DVD completely, but Season 2 had a much bigger advertising push ( strangely, the same thing repeated itself with Seasons 3 and 4 ) so I picked up Seasons 1 and 2 at the same time.

I haven't looked back since.

I just watched the last 3 episodes of Season 3 last night and they are, quite simply, some of the best TV ever produced IMO.

I love Seasons 3 and 4 of Star Trek TNG, but Seasons 2 and 3 of Babylon 5 surpass even this IMO. Perhaps Season 2 of The X Files is better, but only just.

Of course, if you're not into Sci Fi then you won't like Babylon 5. But, for those who are and haven't given it a go then I suggest you stop what you are doing and head down to HMV post haste.

The 5 year story arc is unprecedented in modern TV as far as I know. The story itself is the best Sci Fi tale ever on TV. The characters are fantastic, the different races well thought out and the scripts extremely good.

Are there any other fans out there or am i on my own on this one?

Or save a tenner or so by ordering it from amazon!

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I still think Space: Above and Beyond is one of the better Sci-Fi series, I really enjoyed it. I've watched a couple of episodes of Babylon 5, but wasn't too impressed...

The thing with Space: Above and Beyond is, in my opinion, that it was just different than the other Sci-Fi series, which made it more interesting.

Sadly, it wasn't too popular it seems ;)

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Space: Above and Beyond was great, I really enjoyed it. I wonder if it will ever arrive on DVD...

However, B5 is better. The two War story arcs were some of the best TV, ever, but sadly the stuff before, after, and in between was merely good most of the time.

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Harlan Ellison played a huge part in making Babylon 5 what it is which is always forgotten about. Londo was my favourite character for his ruthless pursuit of power and descent into darkness. Mr Morden was just too fantastic for words, Garbaldi Some of the writing and characterisation on the show was utterly fantastic.

There are really too many standout episodes to mention, Severed Dreams, In the Shadow of Z'ha'dum, The Coming of Shadows, Messages from Earth, Z'ha'dum, the entire Cartagia saga, The Mars revolts and...

In parts it was one of the most authentic SF universes created.

Parts of it haven't aged well though diue to the budget constraints. I watched most of the TV Movies apart from the awful Soul Eater one with President Bartlet and the Legends of the Rangers spin off. The spin off with Gary Cole, Crusade was crap even though he was ace.

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Yes, I like it too. I didn't get to see it regularly on TV until about mid Season 3, but I had seen enough to know what was going on before that. But now I have the first 4 seasons on DVD and awaiting the 5th.

I also liked Space Above and Beyond too. It was a bit annoying not finding out what happened to everyone after the last episode when the shit kinda hit the fan.

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Yes, I like it too. I didn't get to see it regularly on TV until about mid Season 3, but I had seen enough to know what was going on before that. But now I have the first 4 seasons on DVD and awaiting the 5th.

I also liked Space Above and Beyond too. It was a bit annoying not finding out what happened to everyone after the last episode when the shit kinda hit the fan.

Yeah, they cut the funding :/

Apparently they deliberately did this (the ending that is, not the funding ;) ), so as to keep a kind of "open" ending IIRC... even though the humans probably losed, it wasn't so explicitly shown.

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I have watched a lot of TV (too much perhaps) and B5 is still far and away the best show I have ever seen. What it tried to and mostly managed to achive is fantastic considering it had a buget of less than half of any Star Trek series.

The fact that all 5 seasons of the show were planned out (dispite some hicupps along the way) helped give constant direction to the show unlike virtually every other TV show out there.

And a movie coming out too? hmmm...

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. I've watched a couple of episodes of Babylon 5, but wasn't too impressed...

I have got to say that is B5's biggest failing, it requires you to watch a good chunk of it before you can really begin to see what makes it so great. This might even have somthing to do with the buget, as it really can look a bit cheap and nasty compared the slickness of Enterprise or TNG or Stargate.

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I loved B5 but it did go off the boil a bit after the Shadow war ended. There was some very bad episodes (TKO anyone?) but watching it again on DVD it's held up quite well overall. The Shadows are one of the best alien races ever created, they are very different from humans and feel really, well alien I suppose. Not just another man in a latex mask type alien either. Their ships were cool to.

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If anyone has season 4 on DVD make sur eyou check out the 'No surrender, no retreat dvd suite' as part of the extras on disk 6. Basically it's a montage of some of the best scenes from that year with an excellent remix of Babylon 5 music played over the top of it. Get a big tv, a greta speaker system, turn up the volumn and play it and it is just incredible.

Best.Extra.Ever

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Absolutely fantastic up until mid season 4 when the funding for the fifth season was taken away meaning JMS had to cram the entire conclusion into the last few episodes. Further compunded when they then decided that they WOULD make season 5 resulting in a somewhat aimless final year.

The building of the story arc was one of the best things ever though.

<Londo>Ahhhh! Mister Morden!</Londo>

Fishy

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Truely the greatest show ever made. For many of the reasons that have been mentioned above. The fact that JMS had the whole 5 year story planned out was fantastic, meaning that you only really begin to understand the real importance of stuff that happend in the first season much later in the show.

Yes the first half of the fifth season is a let down (although I would say that it gets very good towards the end). This is of course due to having to finish series 4 just in case there was no season 5. I doubt that series 3 and 4 however will ever be matched by a TV show again. Partly for the reason that I don't think we will see a writer write an entire Season as JMS did with season 3 again.

I'm currently on my 3rd viewing through. Watched it all religiously on channel 4, then bought the Videos (which is when my wife started watching them) And then she(!) insisted that we get the DVD's and we are currently watching them now (just watched s4:ep3 wow!!!) The beauty is the fact that although the characthers are all so different at the end of the show both mentally and emotionally from who they were at the beginning and yet it is totally believable. Londo is fantastic in his kind of Roman Tragic role, early on he just seems like a comedy charachter but later.... Fantastic writing!

The fact that you have to have watched the entire thing to understand anything is a barrier to entry but it wouldn't be the series it is if it wasn't, if that makes sense.

I've convereted at least 4 hardcore trek fans to this, and to hear them turn round after dismissing it and saying that it is the best thing they have ever watched is very satisfying. Not in a I told you so, just in a I'm glad you enjoyed it way.

Additionally if you have seen the whole series you should watch the (TV) movies. In The Beginning is fantastic, although you know a lot of it already as is Call to Arms. The other two Thirdspace and River of Souls are really just extended episodes but are fun never the less.

What I found slightly disappointing about the Season 1 DVD is that it doesn't have the pilot episode (which is included in the Video box set). It's actually contains of lot of stuff that you really should see (you get to meet Lyta for example) and is actually refered back to a lot in the series. You can get it as a stand alone DVD from Amazon for 7.97 (it's called the Gathering)

As I said 'Greatest Series Ever' tm. And Bester.... well only Darth Vader is a better baddy in sci-fi histroy!

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What I found slightly disappointing about the Season 1 DVD is that it doesn't have the pilot episode (which is included in the Video box set). It's actually contains of lot of stuff that you really should see (you get to meet Lyta for example) and is actually refered back to a lot in the series. You can get it as a stand alone DVD from Amazon for 7.97 (it's called the Gathering)

The Gathering is classed as one of the TV movies. All five are getting released in a box set.

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When it was on Channel 4 I tried to get into Babylon 5 from around Season 4. I felt I had missed too much and couldn't reallly understand all the back story.

Anyway, I missed Season 1 coming out on DVD completely, but Season 2 had a much bigger advertising push ( strangely, the same thing repeated itself with Seasons 3 and 4 ) so I picked up Seasons 1 and 2 at the same time.

I haven't looked back since.

I just watched the last 3 episodes of Season 3 last night and they are, quite simply, some of the best TV ever produced IMO.

I love Seasons 3 and 4 of Star Trek TNG, but Seasons 2 and 3 of Babylon 5 surpass even this IMO. Perhaps Season 2 of The X Files is better, but only just.

Of course, if you're not into Sci Fi then you won't like Babylon 5. But, for those who are and haven't given it a go then I suggest you stop what you are doing and head down to HMV post haste.

The 5 year story arc is unprecedented in modern TV as far as I know. The story itself is the best Sci Fi tale ever on TV. The characters are fantastic, the different races well thought out and the scripts extremely good.

Are there any other fans out there or am i on my own on this one?

The scripts are terrible.

"Now, get the hell outta my galaxy!" Indeed.

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I enjoyed Babylon 5 at the start and the 1st Season was solid. But with Uni and such it meant I missed out on episodes and it got all too politically interwoven for me to keep up :D

I met Bruce Boxleitner at a signing a few years back in London and got his autograph. Nice guy he is.

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The scripts are terrible.

"Now, get the hell outta my galaxy!" Indeed.

[disgustingly bad English accent]

That's a bloody awful lot of ships.

[/disgustingly bad English accent]

Disclaimer: I like it. It's one of the best-plotted sci-fi series I've ever seen (not that I've seen them all, or even many), but the writing leaves a lot to be desired in many places. JMS should've got some help writing it - didn't he write every episode from season 2 on?

Also, the bar was raised so high with seasons 3 & 4 that season 5 couldn't have hoped to be much better than it was. Fair play to 'em though, they didn't have a huge amount left to do by that point.

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The whole get outta my galaxy was crap however there are some turely brilliant moments of dialogue (which far outway the bad, of which that line is by far the worst. Although my wife wants to find Sheridan's dad and punch him as she is feed up with all the things that Sheridan seems to waffle on that his father told him :unsure:

My favoutie bit in the whole series I think is when Vir looks around and then waves up at Morden's head on that pike on Centari Prime. That fact that that scene was set up in Series 2 and you had to wait 2 whole seasons for the 'punch line' was fantastic

Who are you?

What do you want?

Genius

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I never liked B5 at the start... i thought Sinclair was a bit shonky...but with time it sorted itself out.

I just like the fact that it was more or less a political/civil war thriller...rather than pure sci fi twonk. Characters were bumped off...there was non of this "oh he's a huge character"...so ergo he is gonna get the girl and kill the baddie etc etc.

Id like to watch it all from the start again...im sure i missed a few along the way. The only thing i really hated was the doc (Stephen Franklin)... i thought he was a really shite actor and kinda let things down a few times.

58805881KaMELu_ph.jpg

Dr Franklin and his 8th wife yesterday...

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Good to see there are some fans out there

I agree that Franklin was a shite actor and let the side down.

I'm looking forward to the box set of the movies as I haven't seen any of them yet - yum yum B)

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Thought it was great.

Had its fair share of shocking bits (horrendous budget/awful dialogue at the Key moment of the ENTIRE series) but made up for it by having at least a thousand more good bits.

Can't believe none of you have mentioned G'Kar...superb acting. For me the best bit of the whole show was him and Londo. He was a great actor.

and despite being a 'fan'...couldn't bring myself to watch much of the last 'series'. Twas an entire year (from what i could see) of everything that made the show so crap.

Quality show overall though.

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and despite being a 'fan'...couldn't bring myself to watch much of the last 'series'. Twas an entire year (from what i could see) of everything that made the show so crap.

Quality show overall though.

You really should watch the last series, although the first half is a bit crap (okay very crap) the second half begins to get back to the level of season 3. And the last episode is one of the most emotional that I have ever seen.

After having spent five years of my life watching it and reading about it really felt like a real loss, and watching Deleen reach out at the end was very tear jerking. Both times through the Mrs has been in tears from the mid way point of that episode trough to the end, and I mean really blubbing. She has never ever cried at any other TV show or Film.

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The spin off with Gary Cole, Crusade was crap even though he was ace.

:o:o:D:o:o:o:o:o

I really liked Crusade but the series suffered from TV exec interference right from the start such as B5 season 5.

Compare the first 13 eps of Crusade to the first series of B5 and just imagine what JMS could have done...

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and despite being a 'fan'...couldn't bring myself to watch much of the last 'series'. Twas an entire year (from what i could see) of everything that made the show so crap.

Quality show overall though.

Season 5 is *not* bad, it really, really is'nt. The first half although not fantastic is as good as all but the best eps of season 1 and 2. And the second half holds its own next to the best of 3 and 4.

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