Lost - The Full Series Thread

[The Grand Pursuivant]

Are we looking at a Godzilla-style showdown?

Lost is smokey, Jacob is Anubis?

[MK-1601]

I think there's been enough hints, subtle and not so subtle, for us to assume that Locke is smokey. Richard's "there's something different about you" line, combined with Locke disappearing whenever the smoke monster appears, definitely feel like a clumsy way of saying it without explicitly revealing it. I like your last point. I'd like it if he controlled smokey and was having a fuck about.

Surely that could be misdirection though?

...

I think there are too many elements in the show at the moment that are assumed to be resolved: Ben's seemingly limitless resources circa 2004-7, Alpert's agelessness, Claire's fate, Christian's status, Dharma's real motives (it still seems Chang at least knows more than he's letting on). We don't even have enough information to speculate about Jacob, we know less about him now that we did about Ben or Widmore or whoever aaaages after they'd been introduced. There was never any payoff for Walt's abilities either.

I think it's very likely that there are more people timejumping (mentally or physically) or otherwise acting outside of what we're being shown than we currently know about. Who hasn't been in it for a while who was never verified as dead?

[Goose]

Why do Richard's group (Locke's group now I guess) keep moving around the place? They are, we assume, either natives of the place or made up of natives and new-comers (relatively speaking) yet they're never in the same place twice. Surely if this is your island, and with the truce in place, why do they continue to move to different places on their island. Before Dharma, during and after they seem to be camped at a different place each time we see them.

[Anne Summers]

Why do Richard's group (Locke's group now I guess) keep moving around the place? They are, we assume, either natives of the place or made up of natives and new-comers (relatively speaking) yet they're never in the same place twice. Surely if this is your island, and with the truce in place, why do they continue to move to different places on their island. Before Dharma, during and after they seem to be camped at a different place each time we see them.

I was thinking this was a bit odd as well, but then Richard in this week's episode revealed that there's another group at the temple, didn't he? Perhaps that's their sort of overall base of operations? There might be some interesting characters there that we haven't seen yet. The whole question of what the Others actually know about the island is a bit confusing. I have to keep reminding myself that Juliet is basically an Other, right? So surely she should know a bit about Jacob and the island. At the very least she must have known Richard, and realised he was a bit odd. But it seems like none of them have ever seen Jacob, so they are all pretty clueless really, just blindly following orders Wizard of Oz-style, as someone else pointed out.

I'm a bit disappointed that Richard seems fairly clueless as well. He seems completely thrown by all the time-travel stuff, so I guess he isn't from the future or anything like that.

One thing I can't remember clearly - Did we ever find out what happened, and why, to the tail section survivors who were taken by Others when they first crashed? Didn't some of them reappear at the Hydra station? Do we know what they were doing there yet? and presumably they are at the Temple now, with the rest of the Others, if they are still alive?

[Kramer]

I'm a bit disappointed that Richard seems fairly clueless as well. He seems completely thrown by all the time-travel stuff, so I guess he isn't from the future or anything like that.

Well, we know he's from the 'past' - it's been mentioned time and again how old Richard is. The way they always say 'very, very old' and the fact he doesn't remember birthdays - still doesn't quite give away whether he's from The Black Rock Era or Ancient era............yet.

One thing I can't remember clearly - Did we ever find out what happened, and why, to the tail section survivors who were taken by Others when they first crashed? Didn't some of them reappear at the Hydra station? Do we know what they were doing there yet? and presumably they are at the Temple now, with the rest of the Others, if they are still alive?

Cindy and the kids were at Hydra station in Season 3 and possibly at one of the Others camps, but otherwise - that hasn't been explained yet.

[Anne Summers]

Well, we know he's from the 'past' - it's been mentioned time and again how old Richard is. The way they always say 'very, very old' and the fact he doesn't remember birthdays - still doesn't quite give away whether he's from The Black Rock Era or Ancient era............yet.

Cindy and the kids were at Hydra station in Season 3 and possibly at one of the Others camps, but otherwise - that hasn't been explained yet.

Yeah I understand that he's lived for a long time - but there has always been some speculation that he might actually be even spookier than that, he might be a time traveller from the future, or some kind of "spirit of the Island", or Jacob, or whatever. But I guess not.

Just been reading up about Cindy and the tail survivors at Lostpedia. I'd forgotten that they seem to have totally integrated into the Others. I hope we get an explanation about why they were taken, perhaps they were on Jacob's list?

[Goose]

I read a odd idea this morning on that DarkUFO site - pure speculation - that the variable is actually

Hurley

. Hang on, let me get what the guy wrote - I'm not quite buying it but it's certainly an interesting take -

The Variable is Hurley.

Since the very beginning of LOST, this has been true. We've never seen it so clearly until now, because we've never really had reason to scrutinize it. But let's examine the evidence for a minute, and then you guys can make your own assumptions. Here's what I'm saying:

* Hurley almost didn't make Flight 815. In fact, the woman at the counter tells him: "I don't think you're supposed to be on this flight, dear".

* When Ben sees Hurley on Ajira 316, he looks him in the eye and tells him: "Hugo, who told you to come?"

* In Left Behind, episode S3.15, Hurley stands on the beach with Sawyer sitting behind him. He then looks out into the ocean, and says "I'm not supposed to be here".

* In Locke's vision where Boone's wheeling him through the airport, Hurley's the only person not getting on the plane. Everyone else is boarding the flight, but Hurley is not a passenger: instead he's stamping tickets at the gate.

* In S1, Hurley knew he wouldn't die on the bridge. He just had a 'feeling' he'd be alright - and he was. At the end of S3 Hurley knew he could get that 30+ year old van to start... and he got it started. He drives the van into Pryce through a hail of gunfire, without ever taking a single bullet.

* Jack, Kate, Sawyer, and Hurley all get captured by the Others. But Hurley was the one person they let go.

Hugo has always been lucky: rolling the dice, winning at horseshoes, never missing at basketball, winning the lottery. He eternally makes his own luck... and if this is the case, it stands to reason that he can make his own future. Hugo makes his own kind of music - he's been doing this both on and off the island. He's untouchable, unreachable, and the island can't affect him for a very simple reason: he's not supposed to be here.

Think about Hurley's distractions, too. The island tried to bribe him with a storeroom of food, but Hugo blew it up. It tried to offer him romance, but then his potential girlfriend gets shot. It even tries to get him to kill himself... by using Dave to almost convince Hurley to jump off a cliff. Didn't work.

And yes, where ARE Cindy and the kids?

Let me ask a different question - during a Q&A recently, Lindelof mentioned a story that would NOT be tied up or finished off. A very minor one from a long time ago relating to a character no longer on the show. Would people consider it a spoiler to post it in here?

[Pob]

Yeah I understand that he's lived for a long time - but there has always been some speculation that he might actually be even spookier than that, he might be a time traveller from the future, or some kind of "spirit of the Island", or Jacob, or whatever. But I guess not.

Just been reading up about Cindy and the tail survivors at Lostpedia. I'd forgotten that they seem to have totally integrated into the Others. I hope we get an explanation about why they were taken, perhaps they were on Jacob's list?

Jacob's list...that's something that Zeke mentions, right? Could that list simply have been Ben's list that he drew up to cure his tumour, and he told the Others that Jacob had made it?

It seems to me that Ben was never really supposed to be the leader of the Others and has been pulling the wool over everyone's eyes, claiming to be doing Jacob's bidding, impressing them by summoning the smoke monster etc.

[Anne Summers]

I wouldn't, but some would, so put it in the spoiler thread because I want to know!

[Goose]

Done - it is only a very minor thing and would probably just tie up one very small loose ending.

[Chaz]

I read a odd idea this morning on that DarkUFO site - pure speculation - that the variable is actually

Hurley

. Hang on, let me get what the guy wrote - I'm not quite buying it but it's certainly an interesting take -

The Variable is Hurley.

Since the very beginning of LOST, this has been true. We've never seen it so clearly until now, because we've never really had reason to scrutinize it. But let's examine the evidence for a minute, and then you guys can make your own assumptions. Here's what I'm saying:

* Hurley almost didn't make Flight 815. In fact, the woman at the counter tells him: "I don't think you're supposed to be on this flight, dear".

* When Ben sees Hurley on Ajira 316, he looks him in the eye and tells him: "Hugo, who told you to come?"

* In Left Behind, episode S3.15, Hurley stands on the beach with Sawyer sitting behind him. He then looks out into the ocean, and says "I'm not supposed to be here".

* In Locke's vision where Boone's wheeling him through the airport, Hurley's the only person not getting on the plane. Everyone else is boarding the flight, but Hurley is not a passenger: instead he's stamping tickets at the gate.

* In S1, Hurley knew he wouldn't die on the bridge. He just had a 'feeling' he'd be alright - and he was. At the end of S3 Hurley knew he could get that 30+ year old van to start... and he got it started. He drives the van into Pryce through a hail of gunfire, without ever taking a single bullet.

* Jack, Kate, Sawyer, and Hurley all get captured by the Others. But Hurley was the one person they let go.

Hugo has always been lucky: rolling the dice, winning at horseshoes, never missing at basketball, winning the lottery. He eternally makes his own luck... and if this is the case, it stands to reason that he can make his own future. Hugo makes his own kind of music - he's been doing this both on and off the island. He's untouchable, unreachable, and the island can't affect him for a very simple reason: he's not supposed to be here.

Think about Hurley's distractions, too. The island tried to bribe him with a storeroom of food, but Hugo blew it up. It tried to offer him romance, but then his potential girlfriend gets shot. It even tries to get him to kill himself... by using Dave to almost convince Hurley to jump off a cliff. Didn't work.

And yes, where ARE Cindy and the kids?

Let me ask a different question - during a Q&A recently, Lindelof mentioned a story that would NOT be tied up or finished off. A very minor one from a long time ago relating to a character no longer on the show. Would people consider it a spoiler to post it in here?

Very interesting theory, I reckon there might be something in that.

Combining all those things he mentioned, plus the numbers, I definitely think there's far more to Hurley (and that he was turn out to be far more important) than we expect.

[squirtle]

It would also, to some extent, explain why Hurley sees dead people from the island - Ecko, Charlie etc.

[makkuwata]

I didn't pick up on it first time round, but when Eloise says she's taking Jack and Kate to the bomb Widmore clearly says something along the lines of "I'm worried about you. About your condition. What's happening Ellie?" while putting his hand on her tummy.

Oof!

[Janson]

Being stuck in an infinite time loop seems possible. Fucking scary though!

[Droo]

There is something very eerie about that!

[Popo]

Surely if the same people are looping through time they would age regardless and die eventually?

Like the compass - it was new when Richard gave it to Locke, who then gave the same one back to Richard later, when it had rusted, so Richard could give it to past Locke - ie, the original incident - only it would continue to rust as it passed hands over the years, forever stuck in a loop.

[Yoshimax]

This program has hit such a crescendo now in terms of pacing it's scary.

[Sponge]

Surely if the same people are looping through time they would age regardless and die eventually?

Like the compass - it was new when Richard gave it to Locke, who then gave the same one back to Richard later, when it had rusted, so Richard could give it to past Locke - ie, the original incident - only it would continue to rust as it passed hands over the years, forever stuck in a loop.

It would be interesting to see shots of the compass from all the different episodes it's been in, to see it's condition deteriorates, or not. I wonder if Richard's line about it rusting has more importance to it than I originally gave it credit for (not much, a throw away line).

Anyway, the characters can't be in an infinite time loop because we've already seen their origins. Unlike the compass which, somehow, never had an origin.

[whizzo]

Im thinking its a time loop in the way that there actions now will cause the crash which starts the whole thing rolling.

[squirtle]

Im thinking its a time loop in the way that there actions now will cause the crash which starts the whole thing rolling.

Well, inadvertently it will cause the crash because they're going to be responsible for the incident somehow which causes the numbers to be pushed every 108 minutes etc etc. Not so much a time loop just a bit of non-linear cause and effect. Or something.

[Capwn]

So, Thursday...Is it going to be worth me getting up at 5am to watch this before work? Will I be able to continue the day without watching it?

[Goose]

It will probably appear a bit later than normal being a double episode, it'll take longer to upload.

[CactuarBill]

So, Thursday...Is it going to be worth me getting up at 5am to watch this before work? Will I be able to continue the day without watching it?

I've got to wait for my housemate before I watch it. That's after 6pm, I'll go mad.

[oli]

I finally got round to watching the latest episode, I really hope we get some kind of explanation or backstory about Richard before the end of next season. Surely that can't be one of the things that the writers will just gloss over?

[Pob]

I was an explanation for his experimentation with long hair circa 1975.

[mercenarri]

We most definitely will get Richard information, unless they're bringing back more flashbacks in the final season. They've mentioned his "very, very old" line a few times now that if they leave him out it would be criminal. They've touched upon the temple, the tunnels and the caves this season, so I think Richard has something to do with the underground, the four-toed statue, and the original native tribe.

Though apparently Richmond is an "adviser", I think it was Ben who said this in the latest episode. Dunno what that could mean though, some sort of Island's advice giver.

[zxcvbnm]

I liked the shot of Richard doing the ship in a bottle - I take it that was the Black Rock?

[PK]

I've been a bit dismayed that Richard's been quite shaken by the time travel stuff, I preferred him when it seemed like he was all-knowing.

Can't wait for the Incident though, I'm not sure it'll have anything to do with the bomb - surely that's going to end up being the failsafe that Desmond eventually sets off underneath the Swan's computer room?

[oli]

I liked the shot of Richard doing the ship in a bottle - I take it that was the Black Rock?

Yeah I think it was the black rock

[squ1ffy]

I've been a bit dismayed that Richard's been quite shaken by the time travel stuff, I preferred him when it seemed like he was all-knowing.

Can't wait for the Incident though, I'm not sure it'll have anything to do with the bomb - surely that's going to end up being the failsafe that Desmond eventually sets off underneath the Swan's computer room?

Great point - I was wondering what the 'fail safe' could be as it is obviously something very undesirable (or they'd flick it right from the start).