World Cup Qatar 2022 - Desert Strike

[Azrael]

3 hours ago, Art Vandelay said:

Can we take a moment to discuss what has happened to Australian football? Looking at their squad I barely recognise anyone.

 

Bit more recognisable if you follow the SPFL, they've even got a Scottish striker in the squad now. 

[Gabe]

4 hours ago, Boothjan said:

 

Left back aside which due to injuries looks pretty weak and a few issues at CB, I'd disagree with this.

 

Probably the most balanced squad we've had for a long while.  Not perfect, but it's still decent enough.  (I don't think we've got enough quality to win it - even with a fully fit squad to choose from). 

I should've been clearer, in that it's a very offensive-minded squad and Southgate just isn't a particularly attacking manager (to say the least), so I'm not sure he's going to get the best out of it.

[glb]

England’s path to the quarter-finals should be as straightforward as it’s possible to be at a major tournament.

 

So they’ll no doubt finish bottom of their group and provide for many some much-needed pre-Christmas cheer.

[The Fox]

16 hours ago, feltmonkey said:

I really don't see the point of taking Philips. Is he good enough to justify taking him when he's injured, or at least nowhere near match fit? The group we have, we need to be on it from the first game. We can't afford a creaky start and a draw against Iran while players who haven't played in months try to get up to speed. Ward-Prowse would surely have been a better bet. He's a solid midfielder who can provide the best delivery of a dead ball in world football at the moment. Given England's difficulty in creating anything, that could have been useful.

 

Only one left back is a worry. Shaw is back to close to his best, and is a fantastic player, but if he gets injured I really hope the plan isn't to play Saka there. What a waste that would be!

 

I don't think the problem will be personnel though - it's the formation. This "3-4-3" formation which is in reality a 5-4-1.  We've been persisting with it since the end of Euro 2020 and this has coincided with a run of absolutely abject form. The 4-3-3 was working well. Why did we throw that out?

 

 

Historically, a lot of eventual winners underperformed in the group stage and barely scraped through. I don't think a slow start necessarily matters, really, as long as you qualify. Phillips probably won't start in the groups as they try to work him back to full sharpness, but I do think it makes sense having the potential for his added security in the knockout stages. Overall he's a much better player than Ward-Prowse.

 

I would hope the 'Saka at LWB' experiment died a death after the last two games, where we stunk the place out against Italy with that system, then he changed the game against Germany coming on in his regular role. Trippier is surely the backup left-back if anything happens to Shaw.

 

Another thing that often seems to happen with WC winners is changing system mid-tournament. I think he might start with a back 4 in the groups, but if he does use the back 3/5 and it doesn't work well, it might spur him on to be a bit braver and try 4-3-3 or even a 4-2-3-1 with Maddison at 10.

[Boothjan]

Pickford

 

Walker - Dier - Stones

 

Trippier - Rice - Bellingham - Shaw

 

Saka- Kane - Foden

 

I think that's a pretty decent side TBH. 

[Plissken]

It's very lightweight though.  As a graduate of the "every successful side has a bastard in it" school of thought*, I'm seeing a lack of essential shithousery.

 

I predict Kane is going to do nothing, not because he can't, or doesn't want to, but he's clearly absolutely knackered. 

 

* I aced every semester, and got an A

[The Fox]

I think the chances of Maguire not starting in a back 3 are slim, and the chances of Sterling not starting up front are even slimmer.

[feltmonkey]

4 hours ago, The Fox said:

 

Historically, a lot of eventual winners underperformed in the group stage and barely scraped through. I don't think a slow start necessarily matters, really, as long as you qualify. Phillips probably won't start in the groups as they try to work him back to full sharpness, but I do think it makes sense having the potential for his added security in the knockout stages. Overall he's a much better player than Ward-Prowse.

 

I would hope the 'Saka at LWB' experiment died a death after the last two games, where we stunk the place out against Italy with that system, then he changed the game against Germany coming on in his regular role. Trippier is surely the backup left-back if anything happens to Shaw.

 

Another thing that often seems to happen with WC winners is changing system mid-tournament. I think he might start with a back 4 in the groups, but if he does use the back 3/5 and it doesn't work well, it might spur him on to be a bit braver and try 4-3-3 or even a 4-2-3-1 with Maddison at 10.

 

Regarding Phillips, I think I'd be more on board with his selection if he was a key player who bought a lot to the team on the pitch. I do think he's quite a good player, but in this England team, with this formation, him starting would be detrimental to the team. A midfield of Rice and Phillips in front of a back three with probably Shaw and Trippier as wing-backs would be stodgy as fuck. 

 

Talking of Trippier, considering his ability, his previous performances for England, and Alexander-Arnold's terrible form, he's probably going to start at right wing-back, so I think it would be strange to have him also acting as the cover at left wing-back. Even moreso if we switch to a back four - TAA can't really function in one of those.

 

I wonder if Southgate would switch formation mid tournament. It depends what he considers to be failure I guess. If we get out the group with two 0-0s and a 1-0 win with an own goal from a corner, then it's working, isn't it?  The idea is to get out of the group then do enough to win the knock-out games, and would he see that as evidence that there is anything wrong? I think he's a really good international manager, partly because of this mindset, but I don't know if he's able to make a gambler's change to try to improve things that are just barely working. That was the problem in the Euros final, in a way. Even then, I can't say he was wrong to play that the way he did, apart from the hindsight that we lost the shoot-out.

[Stopharage]

I was well chuffed that Maddison got in the squad. He's been terrific for us over the last year and has the ability to conjure up something from nothing. He'll also win a load of free-kicks when/if he's on. 

 

There's a decent series on Audible just been added called ' How to Win a World Cup' with Gary Lineker and Cesc Fabregas. Great rapport between them both and some interesting stories shared. 

[Fry Crayola]

7 hours ago, The Fox said:

Historically, a lot of eventual winners underperformed in the group stage and barely scraped through

 

I don't think that's true. Italy 1982, sure, and an argument could be made for Spain in 2010, but who else?

 

I certainly wouldn't include West Germany 1954, who may have required a playoff but they engineered that against a weak Turkey, playing a weaker team against Hungary. And the format was fucked anyway, because each team only played two matches in a four team group. They'd have strolled through in a normal format.

[glb]

Also, have England at any point under Southgate shown any kind of tactical flexibility by design? They pretty much shit the bed if anyone in the side even mentions a position that isn’t their own.

 

Suspect the first half-decent midfield they face will play them off the park and straight to the nearest airport.

[Stopharage]

This is well worth a watch. Seems to be based on David Conn's excellent Fall Of The House of Fifa book. One episode down and it's as infuriating as you'd expect. 

 

 

[g wings]

To save you all the bother of watching I just accurately simulated the World Cup (i.e. I played Virtua Striker) and France waltzed their way to the final and then trounced Brazil…

 

[glb]

31 minutes ago, g wings said:

To save you all the bother of watching I just accurately simulated the World Cup (i.e. I played Virtua Striker) and France waltzed their way to the final and then trounced Brazil…

 

That’s so 1998 man!

 

France’s squad is an embarrassment of riches though, wonder when they’ll have their inevitable meltdown.

[g wings]

1 hour ago, glb said:

That’s so 1998 man!

 

France’s squad is an embarrassment of riches though, wonder when they’ll have their inevitable meltdown.

All I know is that we scored lots of “rainbow goals”

[Art Vandelay]

I do like that it’s France with the reputation of having squads that meltdown even when you consider the inevitable psychodrama England used to provide before every major tournament. 

[glb]

1 hour ago, Art Vandelay said:

I do like that it’s France with the reputation of having squads that meltdown even when you consider the inevitable psychodrama England used to provide before every major tournament. 

No one in the England squad has (yet) told Southgate to, ahem, “Go fuck yourself, you dirty son of a whore,” as Anelka is alleged to have done before the 2010 tournament. That was probably their peak “Frenchness”, with another talented squad that ended up flouncing away from a training session to instead sulk on the team bus.

 

Although France have won tournaments in the modern era, so maybe England should be more flouncy. There was more drama when the WAGs were involved. World Cups were a shit E4 reality show with those shenanigans.

[Stopharage]

Hope we don't see any injuries over the weekend's fixtures.

 

Wonder whether there is ever any chat about putting a few reducers on a World Cup opponent, ie.Adams on Kane later. I can imagine the 1990 Argentina team would have given it a go, they were a nasty bunch. 

[Hamus]

2 hours ago, Stopharage said:

Hope we don't see any injuries over the weekend's fixtures.

 

I've noticed that there is currently a lot of media chat around how having the World Cup now means there are all these injuries.

Also Harry Kane is tired! And this means that players don't get much of a break before the world cup, they're going to be at injury point after all these games.

 

Rewind a few months and what we got was

"The Player's won't be tired like at the end of a season"

and

"They're all going to be hitting form at the right time, it will be a great World Cup!".

 

Top journalism all round, as they shake their heads at the travesty of it all while cheering the goals.

[merman]

3 hours ago, Stopharage said:

Hope we don't see any injuries over the weekend's fixtures.

 

Wonder whether there is ever any chat about putting a few reducers on a World Cup opponent, ie.Adams on Kane later. I can imagine the 1990 Argentina team would have given it a go, they were a nasty bunch. 

 

 

Maddison off with a hamstring injury...

[The Fox]

On 11/11/2022 at 18:21, Fry Crayola said:

 

I don't think that's true. Italy 1982, sure, and an argument could be made for Spain in 2010, but who else?

 

I certainly wouldn't include West Germany 1954, who may have required a playoff but they engineered that against a weak Turkey, playing a weaker team against Hungary. And the format was fucked anyway, because each team only played two matches in a four team group. They'd have strolled through in a normal format.

 

You're right - "barely scraped through" was hyperbolic on my part, but I do think if you look at performances in the early stages for a lot of recent winners, it's still fair to say that they weren't initially playing well.

 

France 2018 - absolutely awful in the group stages. No real attacking cohesion at all, and only scored 3 goals. Giroud introduced to the starting XI as a result.

 

Germany 2014 - easy win against Portugal after Pepe's silly first half red card, but then struggled against Ghana and USA, and needed extra time to eke past Algeria in the knockouts.

 

Spain 2010 - lost to Switzerland in their opener and really struggled to create chances. Del Bosque refused to drop Alonso and play 4-3-3 (probably for political reasons), so instead dropped Torres for Pedro and moved David Villa to centre forward. Struggled to score goals all tournament, but had a water-tight defence.

 

Italy 2006 - laboured through the group stages, drawing to USA and making hard work of beating Ghana, and were extremely fortunate not to lose to Australia in the first knockout game.

 

France 1998 - Got 9 points in an easy group, but changed system as they weren't quite clicking. Henry was used as the main attacker earlier on. When Zidane came back from suspension after his stupid red card against Saudi Arabia, the system changed to him and Djorkaeff playing off Guivarch. Needed a Golden Goal to beat Paraguay in the knockouts.

[Boothjan]

On 11/11/2022 at 13:06, Boothjan said:

Pickford

 

Walker - Dier - Stones

 

Trippier - Rice - Bellingham - Shaw

 

Saka- Kane - Foden

 

I think that's a pretty decent side TBH. 

 

Jermaine Jenas agrees with me.

 

Not sure if I like that TBH.

 

 

[The Fox]

That would be my team too if we really must play 3-4-3, but you just know it'll be something horrible like

 

Pickford

Walker, Stones, Maguire

Trippier, Rice, Phillips, Shaw

Mount, Kane, Sterling

[Hamus]

5 hours ago, Boothjan said:

 

Jermaine Jenas agrees with me.

 

Not sure if I like that TBH.

 

 

 

That's basically how I play PES 2021 in the Master League.

3-4-3

Probably switching to 3-2-5 in the second half to really smash the goals in.

Guess this means we are gonna win it!

[Stoppy2000]

On 11/11/2022 at 22:48, g wings said:

To save you all the bother of watching I just accurately simulated the World Cup (i.e. I played Virtua Striker) and France waltzed their way to the final and then trounced Brazil…

 

I've never understood the appeal of this game - it looks quite nice but it is awful to play.

[John0]

My personal goal for the world cup will be to not get into any online political arguments for the whole thing

[Gabe]

The official England team photo has a real 'Spice Boys' vibe to it. 

[feltmonkey]

23 hours ago, The Fox said:

That would be my team too if we really must play 3-4-3, but you just know it'll be something horrible like

 

Pickford

Walker, Stones, Maguire

Trippier, Rice, Phillips, Shaw

Mount, Kane, Sterling

 

Urgh, that line-up would certainly make it easier to boycott the tournament.

 

I wonder if Rashford will enter the equation. He's one of the most in-form attackers in the squad. He might be a good option off the bench, but he'd need to be brought on fairly early. He always delivers as a half-time substitute, but Southgate doesn't tend to change things until quite late in games.

 

Sterling's form is so bad he really shouldn't be at the front of the forward-line queue, but he probably still will be, as he's generally been a good tournament player, and was brilliant at Euro 2020.  Foden is a strange one - obviously a very good player, but completely ineffective for England. He can't play without the Man City system and players around him - his decision-making goes completely out the window and he tries to do too much himself. Sometimes your best players aren't the right players for the team. If we can get good performances from him, then he'll be a great asset, but if we're putting him in there and hoping he'll suddenly start delivering, and he doesn't, then we've wasted one of the three positions in the team that have any license to consider attacking.

 

I think Grealish will continue to be an option as a sub, which is probably correct. He really only does one thing - carry the ball and attract defenders to him. He doesn't provide goals, or even assists, but he's great when he's sent on to disrupt a defence.

[g wings]

2 hours ago, Stoppy2000 said:

I've never understood the appeal of this game - it looks quite nice but it is awful to play.

Nah. You’re playing it wrong! 

In all seriousness it’s no Pro Evo but it has a charm and it’s all about the outrageous goals.

 

My son and I are playing through the whole World Cup (including every pool game) on FIFA23 😂

[Stoppy2000]

21 minutes ago, g wings said:

Nah. You’re playing it wrong! 

In all seriousness it’s no Pro Evo but it has a charm and it’s all about the outrageous goals.

 

My son and I are playing through the whole World Cup (including every pool game) on FIFA23 😂

I might set one up on Sensible Soccer. See how that plays out...