Black Panther - Wakanda Forever - November 2022

[Twinbee]

It was a funny old film. Angela Bassett was spectacular, her depiction of grief and dignity was really compelling. 
 

But it was weird to watch a superhero movie that doesn’t actually have a superhero in it. 
 

And yes it clearly sags a lot in the middle. 

[Festoon]

Also, 20% of this was unacceptably dark. It might be fine in a colourists suite, but it's taking the biscuit when scenes are between 0-20% IRE.

[ryanm]

Still reeling at

Spoiler

 "you don't think my mother's life is worth eternal war?!"

being answered with "yes of course it is" rather than something like "I complete accept that it is very sad for you and offer all possible sympathy, but catch yourself the fuck on. Eternal fucking war, for one person? Here, have sit down with this collection of Siegfreid Sasson and Wilfred Owen and have a wee think about what that means".

[Festoon]

6 hours ago, ryanm said:

Still reeling at

  Reveal hidden contents

 "you don't think my mother's life is worth eternal war?!"

being answered with "yes of course it is" rather than something like "I complete accept that it is very sad for you and offer all possible sympathy, but catch yourself the fuck on. Eternal fucking war, for one person? Here, have sit down with this collection of Siegfreid Sasson and Wilfred Owen and have a wee think about what that means".

 

They did it because tgey were angry.

[probotector]

Wakandans are clearly the bad guys yet again.

 

Basically a facist state, I was on the UN side. 

[instasis]

This film was a huge disappointment, but a fitting end to Phase 4, in so many ways.

 

Spoiler

Namor is just a replay of Killmonger, and poorly executed to boot. He's the physical embodiment of the internal turmoil the nation finds itself in but, rather than become a catalyst for Wakanda as a nation to figure out what it wants to do about anything, he just becomes a piss poor antagonist who echoes Wakanda's own ambitions with a slightly different angle. Rather than return the mercenaries to the UN, he kills them. That's it. That's the difference.

 

Killmonger was waaay more nuanced, the internal conflict of Wakanda waaay better handled. I thought Namor's winged feet were stupidly brilliant, and the whole "I'm a mutant" line was the only thing of importance for the MCU that came from the entire film.

 

 

 

Actually, that's not true. He was also the catalyst for Wakanda pressing the BIG RED RESET BUTTON on their burned Magic Berries, thus negating a thing of actual importance from the previous film and returning us to a status quo of sorts. That was fucking annoying, though I understand that Boseman's death clearly meant they needed to do something here.

 

Ironheart was shit. She flew to the stratosphere twice, and both times all I could think was "How did you solve the icing problem?". Bottom tier replacement hero, absolute disgraceful introduction.

 

I dunno WTF the Power Rangers super suits were about, but they looked fucking terrible and were barely used to boot. That whole final sequence on the boat was atrocious - poorly shot, poorly choreographed, was a stupid plan anyway ("Let's attack the fish people ON A BOAT"), had no sense of peril or excitement and just URGH. Bad bad bad.

 

Enough has been said about the cinematography but I'd extend this to most of the "not real world" set design too. Just terrible in every way, and looked more like a TV show than most Marvel TV shows.

 

The special effects were broadly mostly terrible throughout. Just....what? The entire sub-plot with the UN and Bilbo Baggins could be excised with almost no impact on the film except a much more acceptable run time. 2hrs 45m for a film that achieves so very little is an impressive feat.

 

 

 

Angela Bassett and Danai Gurira were both fantastic. Loved every moment they were on screen.

 

I'd say roll on Phase 5, but at this point it could very well go either way. Think I've burned out on MCU now but, let's be honest, it was a good run!

[Alex W.]

How did the Martin Freeman/Julia Louise Dreyfus subplot not get written out? Or Ironheart? (Who really got the short end of the stick here.) They had to have them in the final cut because they’d tied important plot details in to them but they were completely vestigial.

[El Spatula]

I liked Namor a lot. The rest was average. Although comics Namor would have pummeled Black Panther into a smear given he's twatted Hulk before.

[Festoon]

I liked that the Wakandans have the boat from Hotel Transylvania 3.

 

[HarryBizzle]

On 03/02/2023 at 22:36, Moz said:

He looked terrible! Moreso the costume than the actor. I was picturing the actor being shown his costume and going "haha good one".

 

I think he's got the same swim nappy as my toddler.

[Festoon]

It's fascinating, the pandemic bought Marvel time in terms of following Endgame - and they're producing bizarre, similtaneously over-and-undercooked bollocks like this. There's not a single recogniseable human emotion in these films, despite the quality of the likes of Angela Bassett. Talk about underserving world class talent.

[NecroMorrius]

On 05/02/2023 at 11:23, Festoon said:

I liked that the Wakandans have the boat from Hotel Transylvania 3.

 

 

Thought this was a shot from the movie given how out of focus it is!

[Flanders]

Haven’t watched a Marvel film in a while but chucked this on for an hour last night and was kind of shocked at how poor it was. Everything just looks so inert and flat, you’d never believe this film was by the same person who directed Creed, which was such a wonderfully kinetic and alive piece of work. 
 

Now that we’re past the initial wave of emotion around Chadwick Boseman’s passing, the decision not to recast the main character was simply an error. It absolutely kneecaps this film. 

[womblingfree]

Saw this yesterday. Some great bits, some dumb bits, but overall the great bits won over for me.

 

Namor has always been a fucking prick, and he certainly was in this. Loved the dark, gloomy menace of his kingdom as well.

 

First half dragged a bit, first sight of Namor’s ankle wings was absurd and took a while to get going. Picked up in the second half, although I hated the Wakandan boat. It was such a crap design. Loved the Transformer suit, and the final fight on the beach though.

 

Very moving ending and epilogue. Not a dry eye on the sofa.

 

Edit: Martin Freeman and Elaine were beyond pointless.

[Alex W.]

Was Namor’s kingdom meant to be menacing? They did an awe and wonder bit where he was showing off their city and then it’s just his cozy little grotto. It was a bit dim but he seemed to keep it nice.

 

Kind of a dick move for the king of a society that can’t breathe air to put his throne room in an air cave tho.

[JohnC]

I didn’t think it was meant to be menacing. Thought they were showing that these are normal people with normal lives too, not some kind of monsters. 

[Festoon]

2 hours ago, Flanders said:

Haven’t watched a Marvel film in a while but chucked this on for an hour last night and was kind of shocked at how poor it was. Everything just looks so inert and flat, you’d never believe this film was by the same person who directed Creed, which was such a wonderfully kinetic and alive piece of work. 
 

Now that we’re past the initial wave of emotion around Chadwick Boseman’s passing, the decision not to recast the main character was simply an error. It absolutely kneecaps this film. 

 

Marvel movies have often been inert and flat-looking though. That's why the quips were so important.

[Festoon]

I've just remembered that everyone's suits have NAN0B0tZ now, as they all do the gloopy face reveal thing.

 

And the power suit looks like a Zora.

 

And the Panther suit looks like someone got at the mask with the sequins.

[monkeydog]

4 minutes ago, Festoon said:

I've just remembered that everyone's suits have NAN0B0tZ now, as they all do the gloopy face reveal thing.

 

The plausible flip up Ironman mask was a happier time for superhero helmet aficionados.

 

I can't decide which hate more, the current NANOb0tZ gloop or middle years of helmets folding impossibly like Ant-Man's.

[MansizeRooster]

T'Challa literally gets Poochie'd in the first 5 minutes of this film. Ludicrous.

[Festoon]

19 minutes ago, MansizeRooster said:

T'Challa literally gets Poochie'd in the first 5 minutes of this film. Ludicrous.

 

Well, the actor was dead, so what could they do? The first 5 mins were the only good bits.

[probotector]

2 hours ago, BubbleDragon said:

Best bit was….

  Hide contents

Killmonger. Like told you so.

 Worst bit was…

  Hide contents

The rest of it.

 

Pretty much this.

 

Plus the underwater montage 

[Festoon]

1 hour ago, probotector said:

Pretty much this.

 

Plus the underwater montage 

 

That went on and ON And ON AND ON.

[Bacon Horsemeat]

The anime suits were hilarious. More Gundam than Ironman inspired.

 

 

[choddo]

I seriously thought they were trying to carry off a Sonic & Knuckles vibe with those suits.

 

WTF was that “sonic (small s) antifish weapon except for the really good fighty fish it doesn’t work on” thing?

[teddymeow]

On 05/02/2023 at 00:10, Twinbee said:

It was a funny old film. Angela Bassett was spectacular, her depiction of grief and dignity was really compelling. 
 

But it was weird to watch a superhero movie that doesn’t actually have a superhero in it. 
 

And yes it clearly sags a lot in the middle. 

 

I'm an hour in and my concentration is severely wavering.

 

I knew it wouldn't be the same without Boseman but this is missing a central point of focus that he brought.

[Bacon Horsemeat]

19 hours ago, choddo said:

 

 

WTF was that “sonic (small s) antifish weapon except for the really good fighty fish it doesn’t work on” thing?

 

that was another thing, I just couldn't guage the power of the fish people. I get sea Icarus (cos he's got wings, lul) is super invincible, but during their intro, the scientist empties a clip into one blue guy and he doesn't flinch. A few seconds later, a single bullet kills and sends the other ones flying.

[teddymeow]

Finished it. Had to take a break, make a cup of tea, then crack on.

 

It was "okay". 

 

I was bawling mid-credits though! 😭

[Mogster]

My wife and I are slowly getting through this, but it's a bit of a slog. It's missing everything that made the original so good, and like someone else said it's all just so flat, in every way. 

 

We've just got through

 

Spoiler

the sequence where Namor is showing off Talokan

 

and it's clearly supposed to wowing the audience with some amazing sights, only it's not. At all. Aquaman managed to do basically the same thing far better back in 2018.

 

I really thought Disney would have made absolutely sure that this was a good movie. The first was one of my favourites of the MCU, and also an unexpectedly impactful movie when it came to representation. It really needed a strong follow-up, and this definitely isn't it. So far anyway.

[Festoon]

7 hours ago, Mogster said:

My wife and I are slowly getting through this, but it's a bit of a slog. It's missing everything that made the original so good, and like someone else said it's all just so flat, in every way. 

 

We've just got through

 

  Hide contents

the sequence where Namor is showing off Talokan

 

and it's clearly supposed to wowing the audience with some amazing sights, only it's not. At all. Aquaman managed to do basically the same thing far better back in 2018.

 

I really thought Disney would have made absolutely sure that this was a good movie. The first was one of my favourites of the MCU, and also an unexpectedly impactful movie when it came to representation. It really needed a strong follow-up, and this definitely isn't it. So far anyway.

 

It stays flat as a pancake.