Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles: Shredder’s Revenge

[Captain Kelsten]

I’m genuinely curious why everyone raves so much about streets of rage 4. I played it and it didn’t seem any better or worse than this or the recent battle toads game. It’s alright. What did I miss, as clearly I missed something? 

[Naysonymous]

I raved about Streets of Rage 4 because I grew up with the first three and it tickled the very bit of nostalgia I was looking for.  I'm not sure how it played if you had no affinity for the series because I did.  Turtles is going for the same thing.  My first impressions are it doesn't quite hit the same heights as Streets of Rage 4, but I've only played single player on this so far so I'll reserve judgement. 

[Tomdominer]

Haven't played turtles, but Streets of Rage 4 has bangs of depth in relation to combos and juggling. I think that's what sets it apart from the older games (and most scrolling beat em ups) and its probably why it works in a modern market.

[Down by Law]

14 minutes ago, Doctor Shark said:

I’m genuinely curious why everyone raves so much about streets of rage 4. I played it and it didn’t seem any better or worse than this or the recent battle toads game. It’s alright. What did I miss, as clearly I missed something? 

 

Replay value for one, going for S-Ranks on hard is a significant but super rewarding challenge. The combo system is fine tuned to near perfection. Every characters plays very differently and learning all of them is really fun.

 

Also every stage has amazing music, the graphics are excellent and the DLC survival mode is supremely playable and addictive.  Most of the enemy designs are an extension of SoR2 which is the genre's high point for a lot of people 

 

Literally only thing I dont like is the final bosses are weak from a designed standpoint but the gameplay is so good it don't matter none.

[Skull Commander]

8 hours ago, Doctor Shark said:

I’m genuinely curious why everyone raves so much about streets of rage 4. I played it and it didn’t seem any better or worse than this or the recent battle toads game. It’s alright. What did I miss, as clearly I missed something? 

The fighting engine is SOR4 is perhaps the best I've ever encountered in a 2d beat 'em up, and every fighter changes the way it plays. I absolutely love SOR 2 but 4 just takes it up multiple levels without shitting all over the history of the series. Add in the brilliant graphics and the amazing soundtrack and it's easily a best of genre. 

 

By comparison I thought Battletoads was a bit of a mess and felt inferior in everyway. 

[Captain Kelsten]

Well, that’s nice and all but we all know Batman Returns was the best side scrolling beat em up of the 16 bit generation. 

[Kayin Amoh]

Two small nitpicks on SoR 4:

 

The retuned final level has a section where loads of Big Ben variants continually storm the place. Their hyper armour is a pain to deal with.

 

The combo counter breaks way, way too fast. To get truly high scores you need to do weird shit to propel yourself into the next group of bad guys that you can't do on the fly, you'd need to plan ahead for it and that's not great design. Turtles does a much better job of this.

 

That's about it!

[BadgerFarmer]

Coming back to TMNT today and there's certainly a sense of 'now what?' after finishing the story. I'm ticking off some of the challenges, but the 'don't get hit' ones are clearly ridiculous so I won't be finishing them all.

 

I've also now realised that a successful taunt fills you special metre, which opens up a weird tactical possibility.

 

Anyway, I need to get some MP sessions going, I think. If anyone's playing on Switch and fancies a go, let me know.

[Goemon]

1 minute ago, BadgerFarmer said:

Coming back to TMNT today and there's certainly a sense of 'now what?' after finishing the story. I'm ticking off some of the challenges, but the 'don't get hit' ones are clearly ridiculous so I won't be finishing them all.

 

I've also now realised that a successful taunt fills you special metre, which opens up a weird tactical possibility.

 

Anyway, I need to get some MP sessions going, I think. If anyone's playing on Switch and fancies a go, let me know.

Did you playthrough on hard?

[matt0]

This is as big a step up in complexity from the old TMNT games as SOR4 was from SOR2+3 but it's starting from a simpler base and keeping a young audience in mind - so it's not got the depth of SOR4, but it's still got a fair amount going on:

 

You've got air juggles which you can extend with dashes and basic combos, you've got a more fleshed out dodge roll and hit recovery system, charging heavy attacks with hit armour, specific enemies that are vulnerable to specific attacks, foot soldiers with weapons that have different stances that can be countered with different moves, special metre management etc. You mix all of that up with the standard meat and potatoes crowd control game play - there's a lot going on.

 

The game defaults to the easiest difficulty setting and I think a lot of the detail in the combat might get lost on the lower difficulties (especially in story mode) but it can still get reasonably involved if you want to get through those levels without soaking up hits. There really weren't many 90s era beat-em-ups with this much going on. Maybe only AvP, Sengoku 3, SOR 2+3 (obviously) and at a push Capcom's D&D games.  There's no cheap enemy attacks / quarter-munching game design either, everything is telegraphed and can be dodged or countered.

 

I've bludgeoned my way fairly artlessly through most of the story mode on "Okay" difficulty (normal?). I only had to retry one level, but I did have to engage with the mechanics more the further I went in. I wouldn't say it was that much easier than SOR4 on normal. I'm probably going to go through Story again on "Gnarly" difficulty (hard), but then there's no where to go after that, where SOR4 gave you more difficulty settings to keep pushing against. I had a quick go on arcade mode on Gnarly. I managed to get most of the way through the second level on one credit - it looked like in single player you get 3 continues - so that's where the real challenge will be.

[BadgerFarmer]

40 minutes ago, Goemon said:

Did you playthrough on hard?

Not yet. I'll get to it.

 

I did just manage to get a 4-player game going with randoms. As you might expect, it was basically mayhem, but good fun, and very smooth on Switch. High-fiving teammates to donate health is a nice touch.  

[deerokus]

This doesn't seem to have much variety on the regular enemies, I think that's the issue. My favourite games of this style really have a lot of visually different enemies.

 

It's a good game and the aesthetics are amazing, but this genre does get boring quickly usually. Apart from Cadillacs and Dinosaurs obviously.

 

 

I should go back to SoR4, I put it down for some reason and forgot to pick it up again.

[Quest]

This is basically a (pizza) party game as far as I'm concerned. The story mode if fine, but I went through the whole arcade mode in one sitting with six players and that's where the real fun is. 

[Goemon]

I think people who find this dull need to play hard mode.

 

I played the first 3 stages barely losing a life on my first attempt on normal, yet playing on hard it’s taken me multiple attempts to barely scrap through the first stage. I think the AI is more aggressive and they hurt a lot more so you can’t be freely button mashing as it can go south FAST!

 

Thinking about it like this, I’d consider normal to be the fun multi-player mindless jaunt and hard to be where you need to figure out how you’re going to tackle sections.

 

When you need to figure bits out it teaches you how to make use of the moveset properly in order to survive, which overall makes it far more interesting.

[drmick]

I'm enjoying the SoR comparison banter. Where does Castle Crashers rank then for those of you have played all three?

[Treble]

15 minutes ago, drmick said:

I'm enjoying the SoR comparison banter. Where does Castle Crashers rank then for those of you have played all three?

 

I dunno, I've always been mystified by the praise for Castle Crashers, which I always thought was bang-average. So it won't surprise you to hear I rate this high above CC.

 

Shredder's is nowhere near SOR4, but doesn't aspire to be. It's a mix of homage and direct sequel to the arcade game & TiT (lol) so it's all smash bashy, 90s Konami in the vein of that, X-Men and The Simpsons. 

[dataDave]

23 minutes ago, drmick said:

I'm enjoying the SoR comparison banter. Where does Castle Crashers rank then for those of you have played all three?

 

So am I. Finally, some sense. I only ever truly loved SoR1, but the scoring system on 4 is almost up there with Bayonetta (not really, but it tries). Sometimes it's like it's missing a taunt mechanic to enable you to chain waves of enemies together, or at the very least a dash for all the characters. I really enjoyed working out the weaknesses for all the regular enemies, in fact, I'm not done doing that yet. The crowd control and resetting is so satisfying as well. The more you dig the more control you have over everything in the game (not just your character directly).

 

Castle Crashers was fun at the beginning, especially for being one of the first scrollers with online multiplayer, but in the end it didn't warrant the grind to unlock everything.

[Benny]

Played a bit of this earlier with four players and it feels MUCH more suited to that and was riotous fun.

 

I think Streets of Rage 4 is a much better one or two player only game as the mechanics get a bit lost with more players, whereas this is the opposite: with more than two players the sheer Saturday morning cartoon chaos really shines.

 

Thumbs up if you have a few friends who like beat em ups then.

[DarhkFox]

This is a bit good isn't it ! 

 

These games are made for replayability - SOR4 was the same.

 

So much love put into these games.

[Azrael]

Completed one playthrough last night with my brother and we both had great fun with it. 

[carlospie]

This games great what are you fools on about. Me and my son just finished it in two sittings and we had a riot. Splinter for life.

 

Also if you use RB to taunt you get a super bar. On bosses we just spammed this endlessly made it even more fun. 

[MNFRMTMRRW]

I am loving it.

[Vespa Alex]

On 17/06/2022 at 12:26, Naysonymous said:

I raved about Streets of Rage 4 because I grew up with the first three and it tickled the very bit of nostalgia I was looking for.  I'm not sure how it played if you had no affinity for the series because I did.  Turtles is going for the same thing.  My first impressions are it doesn't quite hit the same heights as Streets of Rage 4, but I've only played single player on this so far so I'll reserve judgement. 

SoR4 was the first I’d played, and I really enjoyed it. I’m a big fan of Final Final fight and other side scrollers but somehow missed these. 

[Naysonymous]

Time/place thing?  Streets of Rage was originally a Sega exclusive series, basically an answer to Final Fight which was on the SNES but was widely accepted as being better than the game it was trying to ape.  Streets of Rage 2 is a real high point in the genre and one of the best 16 bit titles ever made.  I've not played it since I had a Megadrive plugged into a CRT in my bedroom (so like nearly 30 years I guess) but I can't see why it wouldn't hold up today.  Definitely worth revisiting if Turtles and SOR4 are hitting the spot. 

[Vespa Alex]

Probably. I went from an Amiga 500 to pubs and having a girlfriend so had a bit of a gap in my gaming history but I spent a lot of time and money on older consoles and games afterwards. Must just have missed them. 

[b00dles]

You need to get hold of mame with all of the cps2 games. So many side scrolling beat em ups, most of them bloody great. 

 

You've never seen so many roasted meats hidden inside destructible objects. 

 

Punisher and aliens vs. Predator are great. As are all of them, really

[Calashnikov]

While we’re on an old school belt scrolling tangent, anycunt else a fan of SNK’s Sengoku games? Now those are some rad bastarding games, man ✌️😎 

 

[Phantoon]

On 17/06/2022 at 12:22, Doctor Shark said:

I’m genuinely curious why everyone raves so much about streets of rage 4. I played it and it didn’t seem any better or worse than this or the recent battle toads game. It’s alright. What did I miss, as clearly I missed something? 

Basically what other people have said here, but aside from the added mechanical depth (which is huge) it feels like Streets of Rage 2. You can play it like that if you want, but the new stuff adds so much to it and detracts nothing. It's a brilliant bit of design.

[Moodmon]

11 minutes ago, Phantoon said:

Basically what other people have said here, but aside from the added mechanical depth (which is huge) it feels like Streets of Rage 2. You can play it like that if you want, but the new stuff adds so much to it and detracts nothing. It's a brilliant bit of design.

 

This.  I have played SoR2 way too many times.  Jump into SoR4 and it is like a comfy pair of slippers.  Only you turn the slippers over and if you want you can engage roller skate mode.

 

When you realise what you can do with combos - Blaze is one of the best examples with her Blitz being an OTG, then being able to string her air special into itself for corner carry and damage.  Spamming your super?  Just don't get hit, get your life back.  Amazing addition.

 

I recently played an English patch/hack of Bare Knuckle 3.  The mechanical additions are nice, but the environments feel very samey, very grey.  SoR2 takes you on a trip.  From streets, amusement park, boat, jungle fortress.  It sounds by the numbers but the way it carries you along without needing to say anything.  SoR4 is similar.  Mostly sticks to the same city and you don't get the massive difference of colour palette that helps SoR2 to really pop, but it does take you on a journey, it feels like you are progressing.  Turtles does a real good job on this as well.  Beat em ups are relatively simple at heart, you need the graphics and audio to get it all together.

 

That's a thing that SoR2, SoR4 and Shredder's Revenge all share.  Sound design and music and top notch.  Everything has heft, you feel like you are making a connection when your fist/katana/hockey stick hits someone.  Revenge maybe slightly more muted but no point having stuff super loud and crunchy in a six player game.

 

Obligatory mention to SoR2 having one of the bests OSTs of all time.

[Phantoon]

11 minutes ago, Moodmon said:

Obligatory mention to SoR2 having one of the bests OSTs of all time.

No argument here. SoR4 has a good soundtrack, but it's the one bit where it struggles compared to its ancestor.