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Formula One 2021 - DRAMA - #Michael Messy


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3 minutes ago, Blue said:

Indeed. I'd have liked to see that lap. 

 

Max wouldn't have been close enough by the end of the main straight, to overtake Lewis. Even if the cars were jumping out of the way, they would have gone though the first corner on the racing line, holding Max up enough.

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6 minutes ago, Sidewaysbob said:

It is worth noting, that the FIA will elect a new president on Friday, the new chap may want to make a few changes just to put a marker in the sand. 

 

But the result will stand. 

 

Do we know anything about the main aims of either candidate? Do they run on a platform, or is it just a popularity/lobbying contest.

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1 minute ago, Sidewaysbob said:

 

Max wouldn't have been close enough by the end of the main straight, to overtake Lewis. Even if the cars were jumping out of the way, they would have gone though the first corner on the racing line, holding Max up enough.

So be it, Lewis gets a deserved win, but who would bet against Max having one chance for the win in such a scenario?

mexos probably. He's not very good at predicting F1. 😁

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1 hour ago, Dudley said:

 

 

Then Red Bull would sue, and win.

 

They won by complying with the race director's orders.  Mercedes could in theory pursue this as far as suing for provable financial losses from the decision but they have no mechanism to overturn the decision.

 

No-one, least of all the teams and FIA are served by it becoming a bad thing to obey race direction.  "A safety car has been called"  "Ok Lewis keep going full speed, the incident is in turn 8 and we disagree with the SC so we'll just ignore it".

 

Sorry, I should have made it clear that I didn't expect it to happen, Max will remain champion; it opens up an even larger can of worms if they took it off him. As you said, RB weren't at fault, it's entirely on the FIA and there needs to be some admission of guilt, be it 'officially' or behind closed doors.  However, Lewis and Merc also aren't at fault, they did everything they could but have been shafted by a ridiculous decision that was made by a rogue race director, for whatever reason, and that isn't right; Lewis should be champion.

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33 minutes ago, Blue said:

So be it, Lewis gets a deserved win, but who would bet against Max having one chance for the win in such a scenario?

mexos probably. He's not very good at predicting F1. 😁


You going to take that George / Lew bet or wot! :eyebrows:

 

 

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One of Autosport's takes on the 'fiasco'. It is pay wall so I will quote some of it. 

 

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/the-call-masi-shouldve-made-to-ensure-the-2021-finale-had-the-integrity-f1-deserved/6884791/

 

Quote

OPINION: The 2021 Formula 1 season finale was the campaign in microcosm – packed with thrills and controversy. But it lacked integrity, even when there was an option for officials to maintain it. The championship, its worthy champion, his defeated rival and the rest of the competitors and its fans deserve better.

 

The way in which the last laps of Abu Dhabi finale played was wrong in basically every sense. Not that that means Verstappen or Red Bull deserve to lose the title or race win as a consequence – they did nothing wrong.

 

Taking the laps limit out of consideration, race director Michael Masi should have ordered all lapped cars to overtake the safety car – as is usually the case. There’s ambiguity in the words “any cars” in Article 48.12 of F1’s sporting rules concerning this practice, but just removing the cars between Hamilton and Verstappen in the queue was uncomfortably against what has come before.

 

But it is the rest of Article 48.12 where there is much more of any issue, as it states “once the last lapped car has passed the leader the safety car will return to the pits at the end of the following lap” and therefore indicates the race should have finished under the safety car – with the laps remaining now back in as a factor because the order for unlapped cars to come through was only issued on the penultimate lap.

 

It’s no wonder Hamilton called it real time: “This has been manipulated.”

 

There is a pervading sense that things have just been made up as situations arise and that F1’s extensive sporting rulebook is now pretty pointless if one regulation can apparently supersede another and the race director can overrule rules if he deems it necessary – which were the key justifications for Mercedes’ second protest over the safety car debacle being thrown out.

 

At the time of writing, Mercedes is still considering the merits of a full appeal over the decisions to dismiss its race protest. There isn’t any substance to the accusation Verstappen overtook under the safety car, but there is a real problem in how the lapped cars were allowed to overtake and how the FIA essentially cleared Masi’s call afterwards.

 

The next stage for this saga would be for an FIA International Court of Appeal hearing, but it could yet go beyond that to the Court of Arbitration for Sport. That would be massive. If the saga continues and does go as far as CAS, it isn’t a given that Mercedes’ appeal would be unsuccessful. 

 

I broadly agree with most of the article but not the following bit:

 

Quote

F1’s rules simply do not seem equipped to cover what happened last Sunday and that isn’t a good thing.

 

I disagree. The Rule Book could have dealt with Sunday. We have got the Red Flag procedure which could have been used, or they either finish under the safety car which is well established precedent or simply continue the race without letting lapped cars through which would also be in keeping with the rules.  There were plenty of legitimate options available, they simply chose none of the legitimate options and went for an ill-legitimate option. 

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18 hours ago, rgraves said:


And the fact that the safety car came in so quickly. The rules state it should come in the following lap, and I’d say it’s almost certain that merc had that in mind when they made their strategy call. It all stinks to high heaven and I’m amazed anyone can even begin to try and justify the brazen, rule book ignoring, farce of it.

 

I’m no fan of the FIA - but I still believe Mercedes got their strategy wrong, even before you take into account the safety car. And by the time the race director made the decision to call the safety car in it would have been too late for Mercedes to make an extra stop anyway. One decision didn’t directly affect the other, if you see what I mean.

 

if you go back through this thread and others, everyone disliked the race ending under the safety car regardless of the result. So, the race director wanted to end in racing conditions once the track was clear.

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With hindsight perhaps we can say that Mercedes made the wrong strategy call. At the time, they made what was the correct call according to the rules of the sport. They had no way to know that the rules were about to be changed.

 

Ultimately it looks like Masi had painted himself into a logically impossible corner. 
 

Before the race he is supposed to have told everyone that in the event of a late incident, he was not going to red-flag the race and stage a restart.

 

He is also supposed to have told everyone that the race would not end under safety car but would definitely finish under green-flag conditions. 
 

It doesn’t take a rocket scientist to see that both promises are not simultaneously possible. And sure enough, Latifi finds the wall, and Masi finds himself trapped by his own over-promising and lack of foresight. 

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Spa this year finished behind a safety car and the Masi had no problem with that. While it’s harsh and unlikely they’ll take the title off Max it’s still been stolen off Hamilton. I wonder if they’ll do what the IOC do in these situations and dream up some kind of award to give Hamilton to make up for it. 

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4 minutes ago, sammy said:

It will be interesting to see how Netflix frame the whole shitshow.

 

I'd love it [/Keegan] if Masi did all this to make it exciting for Netflix, only for Netflix to frame the whole season as his omnishambles with him as the big bad.

 

Disclaimer: I've never watched the Netflix show so I have no idea if this is even feasible.

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What I found interesting is that i read that Masi wasn't Whitings replacement, not in full anyway, Whiting was "executive director" of Formula 1, with "race director" being only one of his hats, Masi has the role of race director and has the ability to make sure the stewards keep to the rules of the sport, allowing him to make decisions in line with that but the role of executive director was never filled after Whitings death 2019, though there is someone stepping into the role for 2022.

 

So the end result will be Masi stays as Race Director but this new person in the Executive role will be there to make sure decisions are made in a more consistent and transparent (lol, FIA, F1 and Transparent aren't words that go together) manner 

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3 hours ago, merman said:

 

I’m no fan of the FIA - but I still believe Mercedes got their strategy wrong, even before you take into account the safety car. And by the time the race director made the decision to call the safety car in it would have been too late for Mercedes to make an extra stop anyway. One decision didn’t directly affect the other, if you see what I mean.


Could you then explain how they got it wrong? And what they should have done? 

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20 minutes ago, Blue said:

 And the award for Best driver of the year who didn't win the championship goes to...


Max. :ph34r:

 

Sainz has to get a lot of credit and a nomination imo. Mr invisible changed teams, dealt with it pretty bloody well and look where he finished. 

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36 minutes ago, Blue said:

Console yourself that at least Lewis will get best driver of the year who didn't win the championship again next year!

 

 

Hahahah. You seem quite sure. I don't have a bloody clue.

 

So we have you on the record, who do you think, if not Lewis will win it then?

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10 minutes ago, mexos said:

 

 

Hahahah. You seem quite sure. I don't have a bloody clue.

 

So we have you on the record, who do you think, if not Lewis will win it then?

 

I have no clue either of course. Who will even have the best cars next year!? Let's hope there's more than one team contending at least. As far as George and Lewis go, I'm just going for an outside bet for the fun of it. I mean who thought Max would really outscore Checo by more than 100 points this year, or outqualify him so dramatically, but here we are. I think George will be hungry. Very hungry. Can see him pushing Lewis to the limit and maybe, just maybe he's got the talent to win out. Charity wins whatever happens so it's all good and gives us an extra little point of interest to rag each other about. :D

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3 minutes ago, Blue said:

 

I have no clue either of course. Who will even have the best cars next year!? Let's hope there's more than one team contending at least. As far as George and Lewis go, I'm just going for an outside bet for the fun of it. I mean who thought Max would really outscore Checo by more than 100 points this year, or outqualify him so dramatically, but here we are. I think George will be hungry. Very hungry. Can see him pushing Lewis to the limit and maybe, just maybe he's got the talent to win out. Charity wins whatever happens so it's all good and gives us an extra little point of interest to rag each other about. :D

 

:hat:

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