Hogwarts Legacy - Not as good as Dog Kid University

[Strafe]

8 minutes ago, Dig Dug said:

 They put their career and livelihood first. Whether or not they felt they could risk quitting and looking for work elsewhere is irrelevant.

 

[gooner4life]

https://www.cdkeys.com/hogwarts-legacy-xbox-series-x-s-uk £52.99 for a uk xbox series code

[carlospie]

15 minutes ago, gooner4life said:

https://www.cdkeys.com/hogwarts-legacy-xbox-series-x-s-uk £52.99 for a uk xbox series code

Cheers! 

[yakumo]

4 hours ago, cultofweaver said:

 

Not really. The cunts who were in the wrong on that game are still the cunts who are in the wrong on this game. There's just more useful idiots willing to side with them this time.

Well bullying streamers and reviews and creators of this game  really honestly hurts trans rights and the trans community. It's the same methods the right wing used against TLOU2 and feels hypocritical. 

 

 

[yakumo]

44 minutes ago, Unofficial Who said:

 

It's thanks to your excellent post in this thread https://www.rllmukforum.com/index.php?/topic/320785-voting-with-your-wallet/

that I found out about the current owners of SNK which changed my mind on a purchase.

Saudi Arabia has a significant stake in Nintendo too, well you know their stance on LGBT+. 

[Dig Dug]

57 minutes ago, Strafe said:

It’s an irrelevant detail. Whether they had the choice and choose not to take it or didn’t have the choice and had to stay regardless they have a credit in the game. The spin doesn’t change that they helped build it.

 

They can’t choose how other people will take that but they can personally choose to make peace with it and move on instead of trying to excuse it somehow.

[Strafe]

I don’t think they should have to justify it myself but if they do then putting their own career and livelihoods ahead of Rowling’s batshit antics seems like a decent reason.

[MidWalian]

23 minutes ago, yakumo said:

Saudi Arabia has a significant stake in Nintendo too, well you know their stance on LGBT+. 

 

6%. They are a public company so anybody can by shares if they are up for sale. Not sure how easy it would be to refuse the sale of them.

[Dig Dug]

20 minutes ago, yakumo said:

Saudi Arabia has a significant stake in Nintendo too, well you know their stance on LGBT+. 

6% in Nintendo and $1-3 billion each in Activision, Take 2 and EA. The Saudi investment Fund and other oil states are going to continue to diversify the states wealth in public trading.

 

It’s easy to draw the line under SNK as they own the company outright. Partial investment is a muddier field and I can see them doing it on purpose to deter western boycotting because let’s be honest, boycotting Nintendo over 6% of publicly traded funds is a hard sell.

 

Even I’m staring that fact in the face and sooner or later it’s going to be something I either act on or admit I don’t care about.

[Majora]

14 minutes ago, Dig Dug said:

It’s an irrelevant detail. Whether they had the choice and choose not to take it or didn’t have the choice and had to stay regardless they have a credit in the game. The spin doesn’t change that they helped build it.

 

They can’t choose how other people will take that but they can personally choose to make peace with it and move on instead of trying to excuse it somehow.

 

Oh fuck off. Sorry but this has really pissed me off. It's absolutely not an 'irrelevant detail' if someone stayed at Avalanche for financial reasons or because they have a family to support.

 

Truth is, you know absolutely nothing about the personal, financial and family lives of the people working there and as nice as it might be to sit aloofly on your high horse and dismiss those factors as irrelevant, they're absolutely not.

 

People hold their nose and do all kinds of things they might not ethically agree with 100% to ensure they don't get into financial difficulty or can continue to provide for their loved ones. Really annoyed me seeing you looking down your nose at the choices of hundreds of people you don't know anything about.

 

[deerokus]

I mean if there's a sidequest where the school announces a ban on transgenderism and you have to go hunt them all down, then you can have a go at the developers.

[Kayin Amoh]

I think Rowling should be getting lapping rainwater out of a skip for inflicting this series and all its resulting horrors upon us, but I'm not sure having a bunch of game developers quit their jobs during one of the worst financial periods in living history, feeding their families every couple of days on a concoction of tears and carrot pie, is a worthwhile sacrifice when Rowling's still going to roll about in whatever billions she's amassed over the years laughing her ass off.

 

Commando should be five hundred times more popular in any sane world. People should be dressing up with their young 'uns as John Matrix and Bennett at festivals, but this is the world we live in, and people have to make do.

[Dig Dug]

15 minutes ago, Majora said:

 

Oh fuck off. Sorry but this has really pissed me off. It's absolutely not an 'irrelevant detail' if someone stayed at Avalanche for financial reasons or because they have a family to support.

 

Truth is, you know absolutely nothing about the personal, financial and family lives of the people working there and as nice as it might be to sit aloofly on your high horse and dismiss those factors as irrelevant, they're absolutely not.

 

People hold their nose and do all kinds of things they might not ethically agree with 100% to ensure they don't get into financial difficulty or can continue to provide for their loved ones. Really annoyed me seeing you looking down your nose at the choices of hundreds of people you don't know anything about.

 

If they stayed to support themselves or their family then they picked self-preservation. I have already said as much before. I am not looking down on these people I am stating the fact of the situation. Their choice was work or fuck themselves. They choose to work as most people would have. To take the stance against the game would have been to lose something they don’t consider affordable to lose. To take a stance against anything in life often means losing out on something, it’s s case of the degree in which you have to lose that often makes or breaks.

 

That is the situation many would have no doubt been in and made peace with. They are making the game and do not have the means to object to it even if they wanted to.

 

That’s the deal with the devil we sometimes make in life. They held their nose and got it on them, fine. But if you get it on you then you get it on you, don’t act like you didn’t get it on you or that it doesn’t count when it gets on you because it is a pointless gesture designed for no purpose other than to bullshit people and save face.

[Uncle Nasty]

You're massively overthinking it @Dig Dugso much that you've stopped making sense.

 

If you played the game, you'd realise that it transcends the problematic views of its creator and goes a long way to repairing the damage. Avalanche have taken the source material and presented it with such care, inclusivity and love that in this case, it is possible to separate the art from the artist. The game is the very definition of a safe, cosy, whimsical space that doesn't exclude anyone. Consider it a reboot of sorts. The devs want everyone to enjoy this world and be a part of it. I see this game as an olive branch and a way for people who previously loved the IP to get back into it.

 

Any outsider finding out about the controversy and then actually playing the game would find the discussion/boycott/fallout around it utterly perplexing. It's the warmest, most gentle game you could imagine. Safe for everyone.

 

The idea that anyone should feel guilty about working on it, reviewing it or playing it is utterly absurd once you've actually played it

 

[Zael]

Except for yknow, funding a massive transphobe.

[Rikku]

Hi! Just me, not sure if you can see me down here from your high horse @Dig Dug But just consider that if you are a single mum, who doesn’t receive a penny from the Government or the kids dad, that maybe just maybe, it’s not really choosing self preservation to take any job you can fucking get and sticking with it when you, and only you, are responsible for raising a little human? 
 

That’s me! And yes, I work for a gaming company.  A morally questionable one at that. 

[Festoon]

5 minutes ago, Uncle Nasty said:

You're massively overthinking it @Dig Dugso much that you've stopped making sense.

 

If you played the game, you'd realise that it transcends the problematic views of its creator and goes a long way to repairing the damage. Avalanche have taken the source material and presented it with such care, inclusivity and love that in this case, it is possible to separate the art from the artist. The game is the very definition of a safe, cosy, whimsical space that doesn't exclude anyone. Consider it a reboot of sorts. The devs want everyone to enjoy this world and be a part of it. I see this game as an olive branch and a way for people who previously loved the IP to get back into it.

 

Any outsider finding out about the controversy and then actually playing the game would find the discussion/boycott/fallout around it utterly perplexing. It's the warmest, most gentle game you could imagine. Safe for everyone.

 

The idea that anyone should feel guilty about working on it, reviewing it or playing it is utterly absurd once you've actually played it

 

 

Except for the fact part of the money funds and extends the IP of the transphobic creator.

[Uncle Nasty]

Just now, Zael said:

Except for yknow, funding a massive transphobe.

 

The money is so insignificant to Rowling's wealth that it won't even register. Her wine cellar is probably worth more than this forum's collective property and income, depressing as that may be. I know what you're saying, but I just think the money is a nothing to her at this stage. Just a blip that she won't even notice.

 

 

[Zael]

1 minute ago, Uncle Nasty said:

 

The money is so insignificant to Rowling's wealth that it won't even register. Her wine cellar is probably worth more than this forum's collective property and income, depressing as that may be. I know what you're saying, but I just think the money is a nothing to her at this stage. Just a blip that she won't even notice.

 

 

 

I'm sorry I don't mean to shit on people playing the game but just the idea that this video game is so good it goes "a long way to repairing the damage" a long way to repairing JKR turning people against Scotlands Gender Reform Bill, inciting hatred to her millions of followers, funding a rape centre that excludes trans people.

 

The idea that a video game can go a long way to repairing that is just absolutely wild. 

[Isaac]

12 minutes ago, Uncle Nasty said:

If you played the game, you'd realise that it transcends the problematic views of its creator and goes a long way to repairing the damage.

 

 

This is the worst take in this thread in all 84 pages, by quite some margin.

[Stoppy2000]

13 minutes ago, Uncle Nasty said:

You're massively overthinking it @Dig Dugso much that you've stopped making sense.

 

If you played the game, you'd realise that it transcends the problematic views of its creator and goes a long way to repairing the damage. Avalanche have taken the source material and presented it with such care, inclusivity and love that in this case, it is possible to separate the art from the artist. The game is the very definition of a safe, cosy, whimsical space that doesn't exclude anyone. Consider it a reboot of sorts. The devs want everyone to enjoy this world and be a part of it. I see this game as an olive branch and a way for people who previously loved the IP to get back into it.

 

Any outsider finding out about the controversy and then actually playing the game would find the discussion/boycott/fallout around it utterly perplexing. It's the warmest, most gentle game you could imagine. Safe for everyone.

 

The idea that anyone should feel guilty about working on it, reviewing it or playing it is utterly absurd once you've actually played it

 

Have these views been part of the PR campaign or are you just making up your own justifications for playing it? 

[Graham S]

18 minutes ago, Uncle Nasty said:

You're massively overthinking it @Dig Dugso much that you've stopped making sense.

 

If you played the game, you'd realise that it transcends the problematic views of its creator and goes a long way to repairing the damage.

 

The last part of this is nonsense.

 

It doesn't come close to repairing the damage. What a bizarre thing to say.

[El Spatula]

This whole thread is painful. A lot of high horses being sat on. I'm also not playing the game due to the whole Rowling is a fucking idiot thing but the heavy handed judgment being handed out like groundhog Day is a bit much. 

[Dig Dug]

Will make an extra point on this should anyone think I’m heartless or lack empathy.

 

I have empathy to spare, I have enough of it that I know I can not give people like the devs any more than I have.

My empathy extends to that these people were tasked with something that is going to help along the cause of a billionaire who has a malicious agenda against a marginalised group of people. For some of them it may be a deal with the devil they can’t turn down even though they aren’t happy about it.

 

Now if you worked on this game, you get to wake up this morning from your bed in the United States (or wherever the affiliate studios are) knowing it is selling millions, is the most viewed twitch game of all time, has been highly rated by critics, will get nominations for game of the year, and will look very good on your professional CV.

 

You went in as a hired, college/university educated professional and worked with a level of security knowing what we all now know that this game was a safe market bet that is too big to fail.

 

If you were in a position where walking away from this project was not something you could afford at the individual level, then I can emphasise with that because it always sucks when we don’t have agency over our own lives.

 

However, if you have all of the above and then want to run it all back publicly because you’re unhappy that being involved with this hurts your social rapport, then quite frankly, too bad. Be honest and accepting about that L you’ve taken, it’s far more dignified.

 

If I give more empathy than that then it makes the empathy I have towards the groups who the IP holder has harmed less meaningful. “I’m sorry that JKR has directly made your life harder but you need to understand, the developers are suffering as well, we need to take a moment for their pain also.”
 

I don’t consider this a situation where we can or should have it both ways. Sucks if you feel like working on the game wasn’t a choice but at least you didn’t go outside this morning scared that someone is going to assault or murder you for your gender not matching the one assigned to you at birth. Nor do they likely have to wake up that morning having to find the resolve to get through day 432 of their 1,400+ day long waiting list for gender affirming medical treatment which may or may not become longer if the IP holder goes on the warpath again.
 

If you’re a worker you might wake up in the morning scared that the company may take away the career path you’ve worked several years on, if you’re trans you might wake up wondering if your state is going to instate that enforced detransition bill that may take away the life changes you’ve worked several years on.

 

So yeah, I have empathy enough to know that it’s not possible to extend empathy to people past a certain point because it directly conflicts with empathy spared towards others.

 

If you have your reasons, then you have your reasons. But outside of edge cases almost all attempts to spin your engagement with the game be it as a consumer, player, streamer, dev etc is going to be little more than cognitive dissonance.

[Graham S]

1 hour ago, Graham S said:

The last part of this is nonsense.

 

It doesn't come close to repairing the damage. What a bizarre thing to say.

I mean, ignoring everything JKR herself has actually done, the mere fact of releasing this game has unleashed a wave of transphobia across the gaming community. People have been bracing for it for ages. Even here, which I should re-iterate has been very supportive on the whole, I'll be thinking very differently of a few people, and if this game had never existed, that's something that need never have happened.

 

I'm struggling to imagine how amazing this game must be to put everything else back in the box. It must be something like that song Bill & Ted composed.

[earlymodernsteve]

Sneakily posting at work so can't link, but there are some eye-raising details on Twitter about a depiction of a musical horn that is more steeped in anti-semitic minutiae than can be easily explained away.

[T Pot]

29 minutes ago, Uncle Nasty said:

 

The money is so insignificant to Rowling's wealth that it won't even register. Her wine cellar is probably worth more than this forum's collective property and income, depressing as that may be. I know what you're saying, but I just think the money is a nothing to her at this stage. Just a blip that she won't even notice.

 

 

 

Exactly. If this game tanks then she won't notice the small amount of missing cash. But the hundreds of people who lose their jobs will be facing real hardship.

[Zael]

I don't see how that argument holds any water. I'm not going to tell a vegetarian they should be supporting their local butcher. 

[T Pot]

11 minutes ago, Zael said:

I don't see how that argument holds any water. I'm not going to tell a vegetarian they should be supporting their local butcher. 

 

That's not what you're doing though. You're telling someone who likes a bit of meat to not buy from the local butcher because the owner of the building is a complete wanker. 

[Zael]

1 minute ago, T Pot said:

 

That's not what you're doing though. You're telling someone who likes a bit of meat to not buy from the local butcher because the owner of the building is a complete wanker. 

 

Not really no. It's like a vegetarian saying don't buy meat because it's bad for the environment and your response is "ah but what if the local butcher goes out of business?"