Hogwarts Legacy - Not as good as Dog Kid University

[HarryBizzle]

Is this an open world game? There’s bits of footage where you’re flying over the countryside with a very Ubisoft looking mini map.

[macosx]

Great reviews, looks like Avalanche nailed it

[djbhammer]

5 minutes ago, HarryBizzle said:

Is this an open world game? There’s bits of footage where you’re flying over the countryside with a very Ubisoft looking mini map.

Yep, open world and apparently the map is pretty big.

[Delargey]

14 minutes ago, Lying Cat said:

 

Oh, you were a Librarian? Name every book.

 

(don't).

 

Oook

[Mr C]

Looks fantastic but didn't expect it to review this well. My daughter has been waiting so long for this she'll be thrilled when she finally gets to play it 

[David Kenny]

I was hoping this would be shit. Not because I have any interest in playing it either way (I don't), but because I have two young Harry Potter obsessed daughters. They're completely unaware of its existence at the minute but I can imagine them hearing about it from their friends, and I'm honestly not sure what to say to them if they ask for it. They currently have no idea about J.K. Rowling's views about trans people, and I've avoided bringing it up, but they are both very aware and very supportive of the idea that someone can be transgender. So I think the knowledge that a woman they hugely admire isn't supportive of that idea is going to hurt.

 

They're still not getting it obviously.

[Alex W.]

47 minutes ago, HarryBizzle said:

 

I think Johnny Vignocchi used to work there when they did the Disney Infinity games and they put a lot of effort into them back then. You can sort of see the throughline to something like this but it definitely seems like a very different (and much bigger) game to what they’ve done before. 

I recall Disney Infinity being very well received as a set of pretty well made little standalone games on top of the toy box aspect, so it’s nice that the team are getting to stretch their legs. Maybe not so much on a property with so much baggage though, oof.

[gospvg]

The studios work on Toy Story 3 (Xbox 360 - 2010 release) was impressive and even now to this day my girls will still go back and play it.

Similar to @David Kenny my daughter is a huge potter nerd.

 

However I will be having the conversation with her about JK Rowling and then let her decide on the game.

[Lying Cat]

10 minutes ago, David Kenny said:

I was hoping this would be shit. Not because I have any interest in playing it either way (I don't), but because I have two young Harry Potter obsessed daughters. They're completely unaware of its existence at the minute but I can imagine them hearing about it from their friends, and I'm honestly not sure what to say to them if they ask for it. They currently have no idea about J.K. Rowling's views about trans people, and I've avoided bringing it up, but they are both very aware and very supportive of the idea that someone can be transgender. So I think the knowledge that a woman they hugely admire isn't supportive of that idea is going to hurt.

 

They're still not getting it obviously.

 

Surely the "buy second hand" is the best way to detangle that? You can fulfil your ethical desire not to support JKR or her products financially, your girls get to play the game that they really want to and don't need to be burdened with the complexity lurking behind it. The game itself is extremely unlikely to be pushing JKR's views as part of it's actual narrative.

 

Perhaps I'm wrong?

[MidWalian]

The Toy Story 3 game was pretty good. Played it on the PS3 with my son at the time and later bought it on Xbox back compatibility to play with my daughter.  It held up well.

 

I'll be skipping this though.

[Majora]

4 minutes ago, Lying Cat said:

 

Surely the "buy second hand" is the best way to detangle that? You can fulfil your ethical desire not to support JKR or her products financially, your girls get to play the game that they really want to and don't need to be burdened with the complexity lurking behind it. The game itself is extremely unlikely to be pushing JKR's views as part of it's actual narrative.

 

Perhaps I'm wrong?

 

It features a trans character apparently, albeit one that sounds very minor in the scheme of things. 

 

Quote

During the quest, Sirona explains how Lodgok has always been kind to her, explaining how even when her classmates took time to “to realize I was actually a witch,” Lodgok recognized her identity immediately even after years apart.

 

After the player-character asks Sirona about her bond with Lodgok, she replies:

 

“Hadn’t seen him in years when he came in a few months ago. But, he recognized me instantly. Which is more than I can say for some of my own classmates. Took them a second to realize I was actually a witch, not a wizard.”

 

 

https://www.gamerevolution.com/news/934065-hogwarts-legacy-trans-character-transgender-sirona-ryan

 

[Rex Grossman]

16 minutes ago, Majora said:

It features a trans character apparently, albeit one that sounds very minor in the scheme of things. 

 

Which it could be argued makes it more progressive on this matter than 99.999999999% of all videogames.

[Jamie John]

If I pirate this then does everyone win?

 

(Except the hundreds of hardworking people who made it, whose views likely don't correspond with JKR's at all, I mean.)

 

 🤠

[ulala]

23 minutes ago, Rex Grossman said:

 

Which it could be argued makes it more progressive on this matter than 99.999999999% of all videogames.

 

yeah, that JKR and her world is quite progressive...

 

Great for Trans, Jews, the Irish. The Pattel sisters being the ugly duds with weird dresses.

 

"progressive"

 

/s

 

 

[Strafe]

Presumably Eurogamer and Gamespot have boycotted this? The former at least usually mentions when they aren’t planning on publishing a review.

[Floyd]

89 on metacritic (xbox) so far. That's very good going

 

[mikeyl]

The whole point of a boycott is to lose out. If it’s shit it’s not an inconvenience. (Of course it’s still gonna be shite because it’s about Harry fucking Potter).
 

I boycotted the Russia World Cup in 2018 because Wales didn’t qualify.

[fragglerock]

36 minutes ago, Jamie John said:

If I pirate this then does everyone win?

 

Not really, because you will still likely talk about it and signal boost the 'wizarding world' to others.

[bradigor]

1 hour ago, gospvg said:

The studios work on Toy Story 3 (Xbox 360 - 2010 release) was impressive and even now to this day my girls will still go back and play it.

Similar to @David Kenny my daughter is a huge potter nerd.

 

However I will be having the conversation with her about JK Rowling and then let her decide on the game.

 

This is the best! Thank you!

[Rex Grossman]

50 minutes ago, ulala said:

 

yeah, that JKR and her world is quite progressive...

 

Great for Trans, Jews, the Irish. The Pattel sisters being the ugly duds with weird dresses.

 

"progressive"

 

/s

 

 

 

My point is that games unfortunately don't do progressive. Even a token effort puts it above much of the rest.

[Ork1927]

4 minutes ago, Rex Grossman said:

 

My point is that games unfortunately don't do progressive. Even a token effort puts it above much of the rest.

Although other RPGs might have throw away bits of dialogue that suggest a minor NPC character is trans that aren’t reported as the creator of the IP isn’t very vocal on Trans rights.

[Rex Grossman]

2 minutes ago, Ork1927 said:

Although other RPGs might have throw away bits of dialogue that suggest a minor NPC character is trans that aren’t reported as the creator of the IP isn’t very vocal on Trans rights.

 

I mean, possibly they do but I've not personally noticed many people saying a particular big budget games is quite progressive. They all reek of tokenism.

[K]

I was surprised to see a trans character in the most recent Need for Speed game, which seemed odd to be brutally honest, purely on the basis that discussing a person's gender identity seemed like something you probably wouldn't get into while ramming cars into oncoming traffic during the course of a 140mph police chase. It felt a bit tokenistic.

[Mogster]

Tell Me Why had a Trans main character, which I remember being handled well as these things go. Then of course there's Celeste.

[Strafe]

NFS had hilarious dialogue. The player character lamenting that the evil mayor was bringing in more cops to crack down on racers, like they were a displaced people, marginalised for no reason instead of psychopathic speed addicts causing multiple pileups every day.

[jonny_rat]

I've never really seen the point of fretting over whether the inclusion of minority groups is token or otherwise, unless it gives you the whiff of inclusion to hide deficiencies elsewhere. If it's just characters doing their thing in the game, fine, good stuff.

[David Kenny]

2 hours ago, gospvg said:

The studios work on Toy Story 3 (Xbox 360 - 2010 release) was impressive and even now to this day my girls will still go back and play it.

Similar to @David Kenny my daughter is a huge potter nerd.

 

However I will be having the conversation with her about JK Rowling and then let her decide on the game.

I would like to do this, but my kids are 8 and 10. I'm not sure they're going to be able to appreciate the subtlety of Rowling's brand of transphobia. If she was openly spouting hateful things about trans people it would make my life easier frankly, but her "concern" about women only spaces and people using self-identification to invade women's bathrooms might on the face of it seem harmless. I need to think carefully about how I can explain that this type of language, and especially the association of trans people with a threat to women, is so damaging to trans people.

 

I probably won't bring it up unless they ask about the game so I'm just thinking out loud here.

[K]

It just feels a bit like publishers are superficially trying to get brownie points with different marginalised groups when (to use the NFS example again) a woman who you've just met, who is one of your opponents in an illegal underground street racing syndicate, decides to start telling you about how difficult it was presenting as a man in their community. Nobody would ever say that in that context, surely? It's jarringly incongruous, not to mention not exactly being an especially sensitive or insightful way of presenting the subject of race and gender. I get that representation is hard and that its inevitable that people will make mistakes, but this felt like a really low effort way of trying to broaden the appeal of a game.

[ulala]

29 minutes ago, Rex Grossman said:

 

My point is that games unfortunately don't do progressive. Even a token effort puts it above much of the rest.

 

It's a bit odd to hold up a game that's a world created by a transphobe as "progressive" for trans people!

 

You cannot make this up, i cant believe what im reading.

 

Hell, all trans people should buy this according to your logic, yeah, represent!!

 

/s

 

 

 

[Rex Grossman]

There is also the danger that having a trans character in Hogwarts Legacy only exacerbates things. 

One side saying "You're boycotting a game with a trans character, you hypocrites!"

The other saying "Stop using token representations of marginalised communities to make yourself seem less hateful!"