Jump to content
IGNORED

Xbox Series X | S


djbhammer
 Share

Recommended Posts

I don’t know how much truth is in that video, but I did wonder after all the talk of Sony’s focus on their super fast drive, that surely MS would know that with the increase in texture sizes, they’d have to have something similar. There’d be no point them building such a powerful system if it was unbalanced and didn’t have the ability to run the software at the speeds they need to make full use of that power.

 

Obviously that’s just my take on it, from someone who doesn’t really understand how these things work. I think it seems logical though.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, JPL said:

I don’t know how much truth is in that video, but I did wonder after all the talk of Sony’s focus on their super fast drive, that surely MS would know that with the increase in texture sizes, they’d have to have something similar. There’d be no point them building such a powerful system if it was unbalanced and didn’t have the ability to run the software at the speeds they need to make full use of that power.

 

Obviously that’s just my take on it, from someone who doesn’t really understand how these things work. I think it seems logical though.

 

Yup. Check out the article.   They both understand the need for fast data transfer.  Both gone for a slightly different approach to handle it. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Wouldn't they have run tests to see just how fast the drive needs to be when dealing with all those massive textures, or is it a scenario that they can't really test until devs start building games for it?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

They no doubt have, but possibly in the sense that it allows you to do things in a way we have traditionally seen. So you can load these massive textures into memory in the same time that you would have loaded those smaller textures in the last gen, so you still get the same kind of loading issues potentially that you had before, and therefore the same restrictions on world building that you did previously. Sony are suggesting their architecture is designed to be so fast that you now don't even have to worry about loading in those textures to memory, you can just access them at the instant(ish) from storage that you actually need them.

 

How much of that actually comes to fruition is another matter.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 31/03/2020 at 00:00, bear said:

Gerbik was just joking that the images looked like something from Dreams right? People aren't seriously discussing the possibility of Dreams coming to Xbox based on him goofing around are they? 

I was referring to the thread title :)

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, metallicfrodo said:

They no doubt have, but possibly in the sense that it allows you to do things in a way we have traditionally seen. So you can load these massive textures into memory in the same time that you would have loaded those smaller textures in the last gen, so you still get the same kind of loading issues potentially that you had before, and therefore the same restrictions on world building that you did previously. Sony are suggesting their architecture is designed to be so fast that you now don't even have to worry about loading in those textures to memory, you can just access them at the instant(ish) from storage that you actually need them.

 

How much of that actually comes to fruition is another matter.

It seems a bit daft that they’d design a console with the same limitations as the current gen, albeit at a higher resolution, doesn’t it?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'd wager that both consoles will be fairly similar, one might be slightly faster than the other, but in the grand schemes no one will really notice... life will go on, games will come out and the world will continue to turn.

 

The Xbox will have some great exclusives, the PS5 will have some great exclusives and both will have oodles of the same game.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

31 minutes ago, JPL said:

It seems a bit daft that they’d design a console with the same limitations as the current gen, albeit at a higher resolution, doesn’t it?

Depends on what limitation it is you are trying to overcome. If the limit is x size of textures held in memory and they can be retrieved from storage in y time. And you have smashed those figures than you don’t have the same limitations.

 

What Sony suggest they have done is change the paradigm.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, metallicfrodo said:

They no doubt have, but possibly in the sense that it allows you to do things in a way we have traditionally seen. So you can load these massive textures into memory in the same time that you would have loaded those smaller textures in the last gen, so you still get the same kind of loading issues potentially that you had before, and therefore the same restrictions on world building that you did previously. Sony are suggesting their architecture is designed to be so fast that you now don't even have to worry about loading in those textures to memory, you can just access them at the instant(ish) from storage that you actually need them.

 

How much of that actually comes to fruition is another matter.

 

1 hour ago, metallicfrodo said:

Depends on what limitation it is you are trying to overcome. If the limit is x size of textures held in memory and they can be retrieved from storage in y time. And you have smashed those figures than you don’t have the same limitations.

 

What Sony suggest they have done is change the paradigm.

 

I think ultimately they're both claiming special magic sauce.  Take this from the DF article on the Series X

 

Quote

A technique called Sampler Feedback Streaming - SFS - was built to more closely marry the memory demands of the GPU, intelligently loading in the texture mip data that's actually required with the guarantee of a lower quality mip available if the higher quality version isn't readily available, stopping GPU stalls and frame-time spikes. Bespoke hardware within the GPU is available to smooth the transition between mips, on the off-chance that the higher quality texture arrives a frame or two later. Microsoft considers these aspects of the Velocity Architecture to be a genuine game-changer, adding a multiplier to how physical memory is utilised.

 

"Change the paradigm"......."A Genuine game changer".   Exciting tech. Bet devs are just loving all this tech being made available to them.  

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

20 minutes ago, rafaqat said:

 

I think ultimately they're both claiming special magic sauce.

Yep. I think I’m going to have to leave it here for now, as we’re venturing off into territory I’ve got no clue about.

 

I think it might be a bit of lockdown madness, but I‘m getting really impatient with the amount of bullshit being put out there from fanboys of both sides and I just want to SEE exactly what each approach can achieve, direct from the horse’s mouth. I’m sure both consoles will produce absolutely stunning games, but the misinformation being spread around is sucking all the joy out of it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I wonder how true Sony’s solution is. If you copy a large file to or from an SSD at some point the drive will slow down to manage the temperature even with a heat sink. So surely both consoles will have the same limitation and can’t just constantly stream data like it’s a cartridge because at some point the ssd will have to downclock.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

13 hours ago, djbhammer said:

I highly recommend watching the above interview posted by Revival.   Hour long, perfect for my work lunch break today at home.  Such a good open, honest interview, really enjoyed it.  Phil is the man. 8-)

He is the only "face" of the 3 console makers, that I truly believe actually plays games at home. Never believed Fils-Amiee played anything of note, and Jack Tretton looked like his wife had to keep reminding him what a PlayStation actually was. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I've not really been following the hype pre release for the SX (and PS5). Was there any talk this time round of digital only, or a digital only console being released?

 

Would like to know the percentage of would be buyers that would go for that sku ( i know i would), or post release actually have put a disc in.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, Pavey said:

I've not really been following the hype pre release for the SX (and PS5). Was there any talk this time round of digital only, or a digital only console being released?

 

Would like to know the percentage of would be buyers that would go for that sku ( i know i would), or post release actually have put a disc in.

 

meh. I'd pay the extra 30 quid or so to have it in.   We're mostly digital in our house but every once in a while a cheap physical game from 18 months back is available and it's good to have the option to buy that rather than the 50 quid digital version.  I'd prefer to option to still have that choice.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Digital only is inevitable sooner or later, but it will be a sad day when any games you’ve bought can be wiped away without your permission (although doubtless embedded in T&C’s you’ve had to accept) and when you can’t exchange your old stuff for new stuff or pick up used bargains. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If only someone proposed some way of exchanging digital content with other users secondhand, some new system that enabled new consumer rights for digital content equivalent with retail (like Microsoft literally did at the start of this generation, which gamers rejected wholeheartedly).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, RubberJohnny said:

If only someone proposed some way of exchanging digital content with other users secondhand, some new system that enabled new consumer rights for digital content equivalent with retail (like Microsoft literally did at the start of this generation, which was rejected wholeheartedly).

 

They absolutely didn't. They made a lot of vague noises about how they were investigating it, but each interview and statement contradicted each other one, and they at no point suggested that such a system currently existed, and most of their discussions were about how it would apply when you traded in the DRM-locked physical games that they wanted to implement. They did a survey many years later that asked if people would be interested in being able to relinquish their Xbox Store digital purchases for a whole 10% of the original value in Xbox Store credit but they clarified that it was purely an exploratory question.

 

There has been a lot of research in this direction and I believe there's a blockchain start-up that's got some ideas but even in the PC space with its multiple competing platforms - where you'd think there'd be the most eagerness for this - nothing has happened since 2013 to suggest such a system is likely to appear in the future, from Microsoft or anyone else.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

They took the existing disc-based system and made it worse with the only benefit being that you could play your game without the disc being in the drive. You couldn't loan games. You couldn't sell games on places like this. You were only going to be able to trade your game with the retailers that Microsoft had approved. And you needed to check-in your console online frequently. It was shat on for good reason and enabled Sony to get good PR for just releasing a "normal" console.

 

I don't remember anything about this being extended to pure digital purchases either.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 hours ago, wretcherd said:

And we might see an identical £/$/€ figure this time.

 

If we're lucky.

 

26 minutes ago, womblingfree said:

Digital only is inevitable sooner or later, but it will be a sad day when any games you’ve bought can be wiped away without your permission (although doubtless embedded in T&C’s you’ve had to accept) and when you can’t exchange your old stuff for new stuff or pick up used bargains. 

 

We're there though, you pick up a disk for that 18 month old game and it'll contain about 20% of the current version of the game.

 

9 minutes ago, RubberJohnny said:

That was literally the core concept.

 

Nope.  You could only sell a game once, you could only lend to someone you'd been friends with for 30 days and you could only do ANY of this with the specific permission of the publisher of the game, which they could decide on a game by game basis or even switch off entirely without warning at any time.

 

You could only sell a game to authorised retailers not each other and the console had to check in every 24 hours so if xbox live was down everything would stop.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue. Use of this website is subject to our Privacy Policy, Terms of Use, and Guidelines.