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Interesting that Juventus has been confirmed for PES as an official licensed team, meaning ‘Piemonte Calcio’ will be in FIFA20 instead. I’ve not played FIFA for years, has that happened with a major team before?

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8 hours ago, Patronsaint said:

Interesting that Juventus has been confirmed for PES as an official licensed team, meaning ‘Piemonte Calcio’ will be in FIFA20 instead. I’ve not played FIFA for years, has that happened with a major team before?

 

They (PES) had exclusive rights to the Nou Camp stadium, not sure if they still do. Various partnerships and things but not sure if any to the extent that they can't appear in FIFA - maybe some South American teams.

 

I still think it's a bit of a silly thing to focus on. Juventus would have been edited in five minutes anyway, why spend the money other than to fuck over FIFA which is no good for anyone really.

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I've played PES 2019 lite extensively now and I'm staggered anyone can suggest it is back in any way. 

I've grown to like the myclub aspect, the levelling of players is brilliant fun and gives good longevity for those that want to stick with a team. 

 

However, on pitch, at times it's absolutely broken. The tackling and marking systems are hopeless. They are unresponsive and marking is so sloppy. It doesn't feel like AI can deal with through passes at all. 

 

The pace feels like they have forced it to be slow. Lack of pressure on attackers, huge gaps and shocking movement by AI teammates into decent spaces to receive the ball are infuriating. 

Also, when making a pass, if your route his blocked before your kick the ball, you cannot change the passing direction! Once chosen you are absolutely locked into that pass!

 

Physicality feels paper thin. Options to shield and push just do not feel good enough. Also there are notable delays in animation links when moving to actually kick the ball. And sometimes you just need a tiny flick of the leg to make a 4 yard pass but you still get a slow pass animation and get tackled!

 

Argh!

 

But despite all this, I am still compelled to play it. I do like levelling the players and am enjoying using the Japanese players. However, not all of the players are in the myclub database so I can't even sign Honda! But he's in the base game!

 

Sorry, I know this is about 2020, so I will link it. Despite all these issues, I've like my club enough to keep an eye on 2020. If the players are all in the database, as they should be as they are actually in the game as free agents, I may actually get it. 

 

And to add, licences. It has the Japanese license. So yes, that does interest me. Licencing is important. 

 

 

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21 minutes ago, GamesGamesGames said:

Snagging casual Ronaldo fans I suppose. Probably saw a good deal there.

Doesn't he have outstanding legal issues which could be a worry....?

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1 hour ago, Stoppy2000 said:

Doesn't he have outstanding legal issues which could be a worry....?

 

The case was dropped by the accuser about a month ago, in fact. 

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2 minutes ago, Stanshall said:

 

The case was dropped by the accuser about a month ago, in fact.

It seems the case is still active just the civil part has been dropped. Unlikely to amount to anything I suspect. 

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45 minutes ago, Stoppy2000 said:

It seems the case is still active just the civil part has been dropped. Unlikely to amount to anything I suspect. 

Pity, they could have released DLC for jail yard footy :lol:

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How likely is it that the awful UI will get sorted?Over the last few years I've bought a couple of editions of pes with the intention of reliving my iss days with some mates and its been such a headache to figure out how to get multiplayer going (menu upon menu) that we've given up. I don't play fifa but imagine it all functions with a lot more polish? 

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For me, as much as the gameplay is streets ahead of FIFA, the sad fact is that if it wasn't so easy to patch (option file) and make all the kits and names right, I reckon I'd end up preferring FIFA.  That sort of stuff really adds to it to me, and having Merseyside Blue in a plain blue shirt, for example, would just be rubbish.

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Demo is out and it’s very good. Definitely the best of the current gen. 

 

It’s slower and weightier and, after a game getting used to it, I like the new camera that lets you see more of the pitch as well as looking more like TV. 

 

It’s also fixed some PC issues, so far at least I haven’t had the stutter and it’s not making my PC fans go mad. 

 

Hopefully the full game wont change too much. 

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Playing the demo for this (and FIFA) always seems pointless - the final released version gets changed so much it's like the difference between playing the yearly iterations..

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It’s far from awful, it’s actually very decent.

 

Sure, it’s an iterative update of PES2019, but considering that was the best playing football videogame of the last few years that’s not a particularly bad thing. 

 

As Chooch says, will be interesting to see what the final game looks like, as the demos tend to be braver than the final retail releases. 

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It's the best PES for years, if not ever. That's not saying it's amazing or free of faults, but it's the most footbally. FIFA fans are never going to like it for that reason alone. I don't mind FIFA occasionally, it's flashy presentation and licences have a nice effect on my child-brain, but it's fuck all like football. Life would be much easier if it was a better game but it's not, and so PES's esoteric menus and pop-up licence agreements in demos and other bullshit still have to waded through to get to a decent game of football.

 

The weight and inertia on the players is great but they had that maybe last year or the year before (on that online beta they did) and fucked it for the full game. Game speed is the best it's ever been too. Shooting is different (not sure if better or worse yet, weightier and slower) and they've 'fixed' advanced through balls to respond more predictably to input now but having got used to the how they were, to devastating effect, they feel broken to me.

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5 hours ago, Jazz Glands said:

It’s far from awful, it’s actually very decent.

 

Sure, it’s an iterative update of PES2019, but considering that was the best playing football videogame of the last few years that’s not a particularly bad thing. 

 

As Chooch says, will be interesting to see what the final game looks like, as the demos tend to be braver than the final retail releases. 

Exactly this. I remember one demo version of Fifa which felt amazing. Proper tricky AI and realistic movement from team mates. The dribbling was also a bit trickier. Full game came out and it was the same damn thing as the year before. 

Has PES got decent keeper animations yet? Always remember them being really limited. 

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Goalkeeper animations are pretty much the same as 2019 as far as I can see, unfortunately. The weird top corner one-handed floating dive animation has needed sorting for a long time.

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PES is nothing like football. I don't understand why people suggest otherwise. It has been such a mess, only the very forced slow pace which doesn't feel natural at all make it apparently realistic. 

 

 

Anyway, 2020 is vastly improved over 2019. So many tweaks have seen it become a far more enjoyable experience. Yes, animations are very hit and miss, yes it still has too much of a digital control background and yes the engine clearly isn't up to what is needed in a simulation. But it just feels leaps ahead of last year's effort. I'm actually very surprised and impressed. 

 

And PES 'fans' need to stop calling those that do not accept whatever Konami put are way as it's a bad thing. We are not FIFA fans, we just want a well rounded football game and many of us came from PES in the first place, back on PS1 and PS2 when there was a clear quality gap in its favour. 

 

It seems to me that Konami are reluctant to implement any ideas from FIFA. The knock on first touch for example is clumsy with the double tap of R. The directions available still feel like there is only 16 and the animation is never smooth here. They need to take the best ideas from FIFA, the same was EA took the best of PES into its own game. 

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26 minutes ago, nakamura said:

PES is nothing like football. I don't understand why people suggest otherwise. It has been such a mess, only the very forced slow pace which doesn't feel natural at all make it apparently realistic. 

It's almost like people have different opinions!

 

I'm not sold on this new demo so far, I love 19 and feel like I can play in the Norwich style of lots of neat short passes and quick movement. Need a bit of getting used to the new one, but the slower pace is leaning a bit towards 'sluggish' for me.

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PES 19 has massive flaws that are easily demonstrable to anyone that is prepared to listen. From poor tacking to AI that allow crazy amounts of space on behind to the inability to play just the slightest touch to knock it on to a player. But as proven time and time again, the PES community are not prepared at any level to listen to any suggestions where the game needs improvement. 

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The problem football games have that other games don't is that there's a real world sport to compare it to. I know NFL, and I'm sure NHL and NBA games, get the same hyper criticism because they're not the same as playing or watching the real thing. 

 

People complained that the number of fouls in PES was way too low because a ten minute videogame wasn't throwing up the numbers you'd get in a real life 90 minute match. That's why the refs are super fussy this year. It's silly. People need to understand that it's a videogame first. The criticisms are valid, as are those of FIFA and ultimately it comes down to what approximation of football you prefer. Neither will be a true simulation and if it was people wouldn't like it.

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I bought FIFA for the first time since 2003 this year and the goalkeepers in that are awful. PES keepers aren't perfect but at least it looks like they are reacting to where the ball is going whereas in FIFA they don't move their feet at all and tend to dive on the spot as the ball flies past. 

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I dug out my old xbox to play PES 5 and its amazing how much better it is compared to modern football games.

 

Its just so much more fun.

 

(Im probably a bit biased though as old PES is the one game i was utterly obsessed with and actually competed in)

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I can go back as far as ISS Pro 98 and still have an enormous amount of fun, to the point where I occasionally catch myself wondering where the last twenty years of development have gone. There's a lot that the newer games (in both FIFA and PES) are doing that didn't even exist at the time, but the feel is more or less the same. Those older classics I guess have the advantage of not having to match a higher graphical fidelity with increased levels of realism in AI and gameplay - it's the uncanny valley but for simulation accuracy. Blocky headed, stilted footballers didn't have to perform like people.

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They’ve tried to make player movement less mechanical and more unpredictable with every iteration. Playing this new one it’s more clear again, you want to zip the ball around like pinball but the ball falls behind a player receiving and he’s twisting awkwardly and the next pass is bouncing high and wild and slow and the move breaks down. They want to show the human flair in football and the bend on the ball in passes, i’ve definitely noticed especially in one through ball i did from Pogba to Rashford where before it’d be more straight and this time dropped on top of Rashford away from the defender. The half volley he did was pretty similar to last years but again a little but flair to it. 

 

Keepers who do the modern side volley kick out now take a second to adjust. There are additional 1 second extra animations everywhere that add up to feeling like real humans are moving fluidly and often chaotically around a pitch in all directions as opposed to robots on a grid. It doesn’t neccessarily make it more fun. For me as long as i can feint and dribble around opponents and do quick one touch passing moves i like it.

 

Every time it feels like they move a step closer towards their goal of absolute human fluidity yet a year later after 1000 matches you don’t notice it as you want to move the players like efficient robots and gradually compensate for the intricacies and fallibilities. Then the new one comes out and you go; oh. The developers want you to have fun, they want you to control these professionals who play at the highest level and can control any pass and deliver any through ball to the nearest cm. But equally make it always feel like you’re controlling humans however good you get at it. That must be a difficult balance that i think they focus on every year as their main objective. 

 

I’d like more keeper animations though just for variation. It can be predictable knowing exactly every time whether they’ll save it. Like the near post low shot from a tight angle, they’ll always reach down like the best of Banks and tip it wide. 

 

The default stadium camera against AI is quite strange. I just use dynamic wide, which online defaults to. 

 

Still only 3 formation line up save slots though. They just never look at it. It’s not even hard. Can’t believe no one has ever mentioned it. I’m surprised they still even offer them. 

 

Also Bayern are back! Just after Robben leaves! Hope Dortmund are in it. 

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