PlayStation 5 - Next gen is expensive

[Alex W.]

Something something, “Where we’re going, we don’t need eyes to see”, something something, 3D audio.

[MansizeRooster]

7 minutes ago, Alex W. said:

10:53 pm BST. Mark Cerny strides back on stage with a cheeky smile.

 

”But there’s one more thing we wanted to share with you. The PS5 includes revolutionary new power management combined with a state of the art cooling system. We’re very excited to reveal to you that the new PS5 cooling system is...”

 

He turns and gestures at the back of the stage as curtains pull open.

 

”tHE vOIDdd”

 

A searing absence spills out across the stage, through the cameras, and in to gamer homes across the world. Mark Cerny’s leering grin and one hundred million horrified gasps are frozen in place for eternity as the universe’s kinetic energy is leached in to a dimension of pure entropy.

 

You went full Lovecraft. You never go full Lovecraft.

[PaB]

1 hour ago, sid said:

‘09:00 pm’

 

the actual fucking state of this

 

 

Yeah imagine getting all excited because you thought it was at 9am...

 

 

[teddymeow]

[rafaqat]

17 hours ago, Alex W. said:

TBF selling 1.65 TB of storage as 2 TB would be very on brand.

 

But yeah, their presentation said basically said "this is what we can afford to put in there and actually expect people to buy the console".

 

Will be interesting to see how many next gen games will fit on that.  I know with the speed of the SSD's no data needs to be duplicated but are there any numbers out there for how much space that saves?

 

We're used to our 2TB external srives etc that work as fast (or faster) as the internal drive.   825GB could be a bit of s shock

 

[MattyP]

1 hour ago, skondo said:

Love to see something from Fumito Ueda. I’ve read he’s working on something and Epic Games are involved. Will give me something to look forward to on PlayStation 6.

Well at least whatever it is will hit the PC too hopefully! Although to be honest I was a touch disappointed with TLG. Sometimes I think his visions are grander than the target hardware can support.... Remember struggling with the lumpy frame rate on SoTC on PS2. Took me until PS4 remaster to finish that.

 

Hopefully Sony will continue to invest in games like these for me it's one area they are particularly good at the more arty abstract games. Flower, Journey etc etc.... 

[Alex W.]

15 minutes ago, rafaqat said:

 

Will be interesting to see how many next gen games will fit on that.  I know with the speed of the SSD's no data needs to be duplicated but are there any numbers out there for how much space that saves?

 

We're used to our 2TB external srives etc that work as fast (or faster) as the internal drive.   825GB could be a bit of s shock

 

That would be a good thing for them to address tonight. They talked about the degree of friction caused by having to reinstall or redownload games based on people’s play patterns, so I think it’s going to be “enough for what you’re playing just now” rather than “enough for everything you own”.

 

Actually re-watching that section, Cerny talks about how if you have an “extensive PS4 library” it can live on an external HDD. Not to harp on about BC but it’s another bit of evidence that the extent of backwards compatibility isn’t much of a worry for them. They wouldn’t be talking about putting in a big old HDD for your PS4 games if only 90 of the games ever released for the console worked.

[Steven]

1 hour ago, skondo said:

Love to see something from Fumito Ueda. I’ve read he’s working on something and Epic Games are involved. Will give me something to look forward to on PlayStation 6.

 

Ico skins for Fortnite

[footle]

1 hour ago, Alex W. said:

Something something, “Where we’re going, we don’t need eyes to see”, something something, 3D audio.

 

If you're wearing headphones as instructed, you can't hear the whiney fans.

[Alex W.]

Just now, footle said:

 

If you're wearing headphones as instructed, you can't hear the whiney fans.

But enough about Xbox owners...

[David Kenny]

5 minutes ago, MattyP said:

Well at least whatever it is will hit the PC too hopefully! Although to be honest I was a touch disappointed with TLG. Sometimes I think his visions are grander than the target hardware can support.... Remember struggling with the lumpy frame rate on SoTC on PS2. Took me until PS4 remaster to finish that.

 

Hopefully Sony will continue to invest in games like these for me it's one area they are particularly good at the more arty abstract games. Flower, Journey etc etc.... 

Are any of his games available on PC?

[Vemsie]

15 minutes ago, David Kenny said:

Are any of his games available on PC?

No, but his new one will be as he's not working at SCEJ anymore.

[SeanR]

at what point, during the presentation, will this happen?

 

 

everyone take a 5 minute slot.

 

Mine: 2120

[teddymeow]

With regards to storage then I'm hoping for the 825GB as standard with an expansion slot for whatever extra NVMe storage you want to put in. Then USB to allow for archiving of PS4 games.

 

Funny thing is, I've just Googled what an NVMe drive looks like and it isn't a "drive". It's like a PC RAM stick. I assumed it was a similar size to a normal HDD just without the moving parts.

[Down by Law]

Anything from Sega that isn't Yakuza 7 please! 

 

Virtua Fighter 6 COME ON

[SuperCapes]

NVMe storage is tremendously small, and the performance of even the first generation drives are excellent.

 

I am lucky enough to have a 4th gen on a Ryzen Motherboard with Read Writes of 5kMbs, but gaming has not been optimised to utilise this yet, so I am one happy geordie idiot knowing Sony and MS are pushing these crackers speeds! 

[SeanR]

5kMbs?

 

isn't that the same as 5Gb/s?

 

[edit]

are you sure you mean 5000 megabits per second?

[footle]

4 minutes ago, SuperCapes said:

NVMe storage is tremendously small, and the performance of even the first generation drives are excellent.

 

Problem is that it's also ridiculously expensive for the type of stuff Sony are pushing. I do like the idea that it's commodity though - eventually it should become affordable. Whereas the ridiculous prices of bespoke Microsoft hard drives on previous consoles was quite off-putting.

[Harrisown]

2 hours ago, skondo said:

Love to see something from Fumito Ueda. I’ve read he’s working on something and Epic Games are involved. Will give me something to look forward to on PlayStation 6.

New console and everything is cool. I’m kinda excited but I would lose my middle aged shit if something got announced.

 

[footle]

Just now, SeanR said:

5kMbs?

isn't that the same as 5GB/s?

 

Yep. FAST.

[Pob]

9 minutes ago, teddymeow said:

With regards to storage then I'm hoping for the 825GB as standard with an expansion slot for whatever extra NVMe storage you want to put in. Then USB to allow for archiving of PS4 games.

 

 

Why wouldn't the USB drive be for archiving PS5 games as well?

 

One thing I'm surprised about is that neither platform owner has mentioned anything about smart transfer of moving games from HDD to SSD. Either you simply won't be able to store new-gen games on a USB HDD (I mean 'store' in the sense of shelving it for future retrieval, not actually playing the game off it of course) or the user will have to manually manage their SSD and HDD storage. It seems like the kind of thing the OS should be handling without the user needing to think about it.

 

Given that most people are going to use up < 1TB storage space pretty quickly, and will not want to fork out £££ for an SSD expansion, I would've thought this aspect would get more focus.

[rafaqat]

4 minutes ago, Pob said:

 

Why wouldn't the USB drive be for archiving PS5 games as well?

 

One thing I'm surprised about is that neither platform owner has mentioned anything about smart transfer of moving games from HDD to SSD. Either you simply won't be able to store new-gen games on a USB HDD (I mean 'store' in the sense of shelving it for future retrieval, not actually playing the game off it of course) or the user will have to manually manage their SSD and HDD storage. It seems like the kind of thing the OS should be handling without the user needing to think about it.

 

Given that most people are going to use up < 1TB storage space pretty quickly, and will not want to fork out £££ for an SSD expansion, I would've thought this aspect would get more focus.

 

I guess everyone wants the focus to be on how fast it is.  Why dilute that message with "you can archive stuff and the OS will handle it etc". That'd draw attention to the fact that the next gen HDD's are small.

[Alex W.]

Just now, Pob said:

 

Why wouldn't the USB drive be for archiving PS5 games as well?

 

One thing I'm surprised about is that neither platform owner has mentioned anything about smart transfer of moving games from HDD to SSD. Either you simply won't be able to store new-gen games on a USB HDD (I mean 'store' in the sense of shelving it for future retrieval, not actually playing the game off it of course) or the user will have to manually manage their SSD and HDD storage. It seems like the kind of thing the OS should be handling without the user needing to think about it.

 

Given that most people are going to use up < 1TB storage space pretty quickly, and will not want to fork out £££ for an SSD expansion, I would've thought this aspect would get more focus.

I think the simple answer is that your next gen games go on the SSD and that’s it. Delete them or redownload or reinstall them if you need more space but keep your saves there. There’s been no focus on “archiving” games because they simply won’t offer that. 
 

Archiving would be faster for many people but it’s probably a logistical headache they don’t want. Ten-minute unarchiving before you can boot the game would fly in the face of what the SSD is supposed to offer. Maybe it’ll appear further down the line.

[Pob]

10 minutes ago, Alex W. said:

I think the simple answer is that your next gen games go on the SSD and that’s it. Delete them or redownload or reinstall them if you need more space but keep your saves there. There’s been no focus on “archiving” games because they simply won’t offer that. 
 

Archiving would be faster for many people but it’s probably a logistical headache they don’t want. Ten-minute unarchiving before you can boot the game would fly in the face of what the SSD is supposed to offer. Maybe it’ll appear further down the line.

 

I get that redownloading is pretty quick these days compared to USB transfer speeds but it just seems like an issue that most people will run up against sooner rather than later. I'm not looking forward to the idea of having to redownload a game to play it. Even if there wasn't much different in the time taken to get it back onto the SSD, there are considerations of download caps, affecting other people using the household broadband, plus it seems wasteful from an energy usage POV.

 

Also, it shouldn't be any kind of manual 'archiving' - that's my point. Whichever way you do it, you're going to a lengthy progress bar while it copies across and reinstalls, but that should be the extent of it. Surely it'd be quicker and more convenient coming across from a USB hard drive?

[teddymeow]

15 minutes ago, Alex W. said:

I think the simple answer is that your next gen games go on the SSD and that’s it. Delete them or redownload or reinstall them if you need more space but keep your saves there. There’s been no focus on “archiving” games because they simply won’t offer that. 
 

Archiving would be faster for many people but it’s probably a logistical headache they don’t want. Ten-minute unarchiving before you can boot the game would fly in the face of what the SSD is supposed to offer. Maybe it’ll appear further down the line.

 

That seems to be the way Microsoft are doing things.

 

Internal & External Xbox Series X Storage

 

Internal SSD and the SSD expansion cards for Series X games. External HDD for other Xbox formats as well as archiving of Series X games. If you want to play a Series X game off the HDD you need to move it back to the SSD.

[JoeK]

9 minutes ago, Pob said:

 

I get that redownloading is pretty quick these days compared to USB transfer speeds but it just seems like an issue that most people will run up against sooner rather than later. I'm not looking forward to the idea of having to redownload a game to play it. Even if there wasn't much different in the time taken to get it back onto the SSD, there are considerations of download caps, affecting other people using the household broadband, plus it seems wasteful from an energy usage POV.

There’s your problem right there. You need to be denying everyone else the internet.

 

The kids should be reading Enid Blyton, and your other half should be enlightened enough to be going out to her high paying job and not getting in until late.

 

You are then free to delete and download to your heart’s content. 
 

Just make sure you've stocked up on Rustlers microwave stuff to cook for the family as and when required!

[Pob]

3 minutes ago, teddymeow said:

 

That seems to be the way Microsoft are doing things.

 

Internal & External Xbox Series X Storage

 

Internal SSD and the SSD expansion cards for Series X games. External HDD for other Xbox formats as well as archiving of Series X games. If you want to play a Series X game off the HDD you need to move it back to the SSD.

 

Cool that's the bare minimum that I expect. This still seems odd to me:

 

Quote

If you're willing to go with a normal external USB 3.0 hard drive, that'll be much cheaper, but you'll need to move your Series X games around if your library is hefty enough. 

 

Why do I, the user, need to babysit that? Shouldn't the OS archive off games I've not played for ages to make room for a new game, with the option for me to take manual control if I so wish? Perhaps this is such an obvious QOL feature that they've not even bothered to mention it.

[Alex W.]

12 minutes ago, Pob said:

 

Cool that's the bare minimum that I expect. This still seems odd to me:

 

 

Why do I, the user, need to babysit that? Shouldn't the OS archive off games I've not played for ages to make room for a new game, with the option for me to take manual control if I so wish? Perhaps this is such an obvious QOL feature that they've not even bothered to mention it.

 

The trouble with automatic archiving is that inevitably the console's going to archive something that the player wanted to keep on there, and they'll get mad that the computer did the wrong thing. Always safer to have the computer do less than to automatically do something bad. Unless you use the words "machine learning" or "algorithms" in which case people will let you do it.

[Corranga]

6 minutes ago, Pob said:

 

Why do I, the user, need to babysit that? Shouldn't the OS archive off games I've not played for ages to make room for a new game, with the option for me to take manual control if I so wish? Perhaps this is such an obvious QOL feature that they've not even bothered to mention it.

 

Because, you the player will know best. For example, maybe you’ve just completed a game and want to go back to an old staple, but your console has preloaded that new game you’ve preordered that’s our next week. It would archive the old game, you’d arching the one you’ve just finished...

 

The copy time could be quite long (though possibly not as long as downloading, broad band speeds depending) then add potential for a mega update... It’s a solution, but it’s not really ideal.

Of course what we do know is 1TB is going to be filled up pretty quickly especially with 4K assets, so hopefully whatever solution is in place is easily manageable and not too restricting, along with expansion of course

[Alex W.]