The Saturn Appreciation Thread

[Colonel Panic]

A Brooks adapter will let you use newer controllers with your Saturn and Dreamcast. 

[MikeBeaver]

If anyone is interested in the ( excessively long, almost 2 hour ) video I done whilst modding a Saturn, then here you go :-

 

 

 

[Shimmyhill]

@MikeBeaver - I watched that last night, well I say that it was around 0130 this morning and while there was some speed up im paying for watching it at such a silly hour…. Is that the beast im buying? 

 

I wish I had picked up soldering properly, I used to have to do a bit of it in an old job years back but became a PCB swapper so never practiced it enough even tho I had pro level gear at the time  

[Haribokart]

What games are you looking forward to trying @Shimmyhill?

[Shimmyhill]

1 hour ago, Haribokart said:

What games are you looking forward to trying @Shimmyhill?

 

Im going to try and only buy a game or two and actually play them - I really want to play Nights and Guardian Heroes as while ive played them I haven’t done it on my own in one go if that makes sense - always played on a mates or a bit on 360.

 

Outside of that I want to pick up the arcade ports, Daytona (I knowbut its got ridiculous nostalgia on Saturn) VF games, Sega Rally etc and would love Virtua Cop and gun but assume would need a CRT for that…

 

I actually have pretty limited knowledge of the Saturn as played via a friends and all PAL - anything you or others can suggest would be good (pref not Saga as seen the price of that )

[Ketchup]

Daytona gets such a bad rap that it doesn't fully deserve. It has 40 cars on the track, even modern games don't do that many. It plays pretty much like the arcade version and it's just a shame the pop in is what ruins it. The frame rate, at least when it isn't pal isn't the worst either. In my mind it's not a bad port, just has some issues which are quite over blown. Whilst i like the look of CCE and thats how the original should have been, its handling is not the same for some reason and makes it a worse game.

[MikeBeaver]

3 hours ago, Shimmyhill said:

@MikeBeaver - I watched that last night, well I say that it was around 0130 this morning and while there was some speed up im paying for watching it at such a silly hour…. Is that the beast im buying? 

 

I wish I had picked up soldering properly, I used to have to do a bit of it in an old job years back but became a PCB swapper so never practiced it enough even tho I had pro level gear at the time  

That is indeed your very Saturn, and some of my tidiest wirring work so far I think, all nicely routed and with cable shrink on it

You'll also notice I have a copy of Daytona that I am more than happy to shift 😛

 

As for soldering skills.... erm.... I picked mine up by just doing this sort of stuff.

[Shimmyhill]

1 hour ago, MikeBeaver said:

That is indeed your very Saturn, and some of my tidiest wirring work so far I think, all nicely routed and with cable shrink on it

You'll also notice I have a copy of Daytona that I am more than happy to shift 😛

 

As for soldering skills.... erm.... I picked mine up by just doing this sort of stuff.

 

I imagine I shall be leaving your cave of treasures with more than I come to pick up….. is there a USA version of Daytona, I hear its better  

[Shimmyhill]

On 01/01/2023 at 20:00, Spartan said:

Mines the kaico version, bought it ages ago for around £100. I suspect the second one in your post is basically the same as the kaico one as it's a clone of the original OSSC as it is. I've run my Saturn through it without issue out of the box. From memory I've had to tweak it's settings for the Jaguar and Neo Geo CD ive got but they have quirks.

 

Just make sure to use a good quality RGB scart lead with the Saturn. OEM or one by RGC. The OSSC won't accept composite video, only RGB.

 

I just use a good quality manual scart switcher with mine from the 90s/2000s.

 

I went with the Kaico one - combo of having £80 in MS points > Amazon voucher and having a HDMI GC adaptor from them - UK based and seem decent, im sure the other one would have been the same….

 

On 02/01/2023 at 08:54, Colonel Panic said:

A Brooks adapter will let you use newer controllers with your Saturn and Dreamcast. 

 

Does this let you use an analogue stick in Nights etc?

[Colonel Panic]

50 minutes ago, Shimmyhill said:

Does this let you use an analogue stick in Nights etc?

Yep! 

 

Quote

Switch the input mode on Saturn

The default controller input setting of Wingman SD is “3D Control mode”. When using a standard controller, you can switch to ”Standard mode” manually. The following instructions are based on the Xbox One controller. For those using an other controller, please refer to the Corresponding Buttons List.

Switch to “3D Control mode”:

Press VIEW + Y, the Console Green LED is permanently on.

Switch to “Standard mode”:

Press VIEW + A, the Console Red LED is permanently on.

Switch to “Arcade mode”:

Press VIEW + B, the Console Red LED and Green Led are permanently on.

 

https://www.brookaccessory.com/detail/62472958/

[Lyrical Donut]

1 hour ago, Shimmyhill said:

 

I imagine I shall be leaving your cave of treasures with more than I come to pick up….. is there a USA version of Daytona, I hear its better  

 

Ideally you want to find yourself a copy of Daytona: CCE. 

[Shimmyhill]

46 minutes ago, Lyrical Donut said:

 

Ideally you want to find yourself a copy of Daytona: CCE. 

 

Isnt CCE regarded as inferior in the gameplay department. 

[megamixer]

I have CCE (on a CD-R) and I personally don't really enjoy it. It has more content and is a lot more polished than the rushed original, but the remixed music is really not for me.

 

According to Wiki, Sega responded to criticism that Daytona's music didn't fit a racing game (heathens!), and produced this new soundtrack.

 

The whole game just feels a billion times more USA!USA!USA! to me. While that makes sense (it IS based on an American racing series after all), I feel that a lot of the charm of the original is lost.

 

And, as has been said, the handling feels completely different.

 

Personally I just play the remastered version on PSN from years back as it's pretty much perfect to the arcade.

[Shimmyhill]

3 hours ago, megamixer said:

I have CCE (on a CD-R) and I personally don't really enjoy it. It has more content and is a lot more polished than the rushed original, but the remixed music is really not for me.

 

According to Wiki, Sega responded to criticism that Daytona's music didn't fit a racing game (heathens!), and produced this new soundtrack.

 

The whole game just feels a billion times more USA!USA!USA! to me. While that makes sense (it IS based on an American racing series after all), I feel that a lot of the charm of the original is lost.

 

And, as has been said, the handling feels completely different.

 

Personally I just play the remastered version on PSN from years back as it's pretty much perfect to the arcade.

 

Cheers - I have it on Xbox and Sony platforms but these games always hit the feels more on the original hardware, complete nonsense of course and im fully aware of that but….

[pastry]

CCE is an ok racing game in its own right, but it's not Daytona USA.

The original port is still great fun, 777 Speedway with the hustle and bustle of 40 cars is really impressive, particularly when you stop to think about the gulf between Model 2 and Saturn architecture. The popup is mostly a non-issue when playing - yeah it's bad to look at as an observer, but I don't think it really upsets the gameplay. 

If you just want the best home Daytona then of course, PS3 or 360. If you want to imagine what Daytona in your home in 1995 was like, the Saturn port is the only option

[megamixer]

11 hours ago, Shimmyhill said:

 

Cheers - I have it on Xbox and Sony platforms but these games always hit the feels more on the original hardware, complete nonsense of course and im fully aware of that but….

Oh, totally. I would also echo that the original Daytona USA port is not as atrocious as people would have you believe and is very authentic in feel to the arcade. I used to play it all the time and wasn't bothered by the shortcomings (It WAS a home port after all - it was never going to mirror the power of an arcade cab perfectly...).

 

I'd say check CCE out if you can, as it isn't a bad game by any means. It's just better if you also have the original on-hand 😀

[Down by Law]

Just grab the Japanese Saturn version of Daytona. It's about a tenner and naturally runs correctly at 60hz so the borders aren't as obnoxious as the PAL version. The PAL versions been optimised to match the NTSC version's speed, so if you run the PAL version at 60hz you lose some of the borders, but it doesn't run particularly great. Manx TT is similar in that if you run the PAL version at 60hz the timer runs too fast making it nigh on impossible to finish.

Out of these three, it's definetely the one I return to the most often.

 

[Rex Grossman]

How much of the perception around Daytona on the Saturn has come from how much people raved about Ridge Racer on the PlayStation at the time?

[Shimmyhill]

2 hours ago, Rex Grossman said:

Ho much of the perception around Daytona on the Saturn has come from how much people raved about Ridge Racer on the PlayStation at the time?

 

I preferred Ridge Racer in the arcade, im sure ive put enough money into it over the years to buy a cab…. Most of my college life was spent down the arcades playing it!! Im actually playing it now, my original launch disc and it is odd as for sure whats in front of you looks more impressive than Daytona but my word the pop in and lack of cars on track is clearly why it looks better. Its probably more noticeable on a 43” telly sat in my racing rig than it was on a 14” Sony CRT back in the day!!!

[Haribokart]

On 04/01/2023 at 13:41, Shimmyhill said:

Im going to try and only buy a game or two and actually play them - I really want to play Nights and Guardian Heroes as while ive played them I haven’t done it on my own in one go if that makes sense - always played on a mates or a bit on 360.

 

Outside of that I want to pick up the arcade ports, Daytona (I knowbut its got ridiculous nostalgia on Saturn) VF games, Sega Rally etc and would love Virtua Cop and gun but assume would need a CRT for that…

 

I actually have pretty limited knowledge of the Saturn as played via a friends and all PAL - anything you or others can suggest would be good (pref not Saga as seen the price of that )

 

For someone who never had a Saturn you seem really well informed!

 

Daytona is good and as discussed way better if you can get a JP/US copy but even then I think it might be a struggle in 2023 without nostalgia propping it up, I mean the game was held up as a particularly poor port almost thirty years ago let alone now. Core gameplay is still there though, personally I'd probably steer clear of CCE which as someone else said ain't really Daytona. It's an 'ok' game that I'd class as 'inspired by' the original rather than a remake/remaster.

 

Sega Rally is AAA and probably still very cheap. Was my absolute favourite driving game until Driveclub, there is not much content but that works in its favour as what is there is so good, I'd say it is the best time trial racer of all time. As someone who doesn't really buy games (I have probably bought three games in the past five years) I'd snap this up immediately were it released on modern consoles with online scoreboards, even as-is with no improvements.

 

Nights is also a time attack/high score game (amazing how many people miss this even those who have played it) and you really need the 3D controller to enjoy it fully which it seems you're aware of. Initially it may be a bit baffling but once it clicks you can really get in the zone if you know what I mean, Great game.

 

Good shout on Guardian Heroes. Virtua Cop 1&2 are both fucking awesome. Panzer Dragoon Zwei, Virtua Fighter 2, Radient Silvergun, Exhumed, Die hard Arcade, 2D Capcom fighters go without saying, a fair amount of multiformat stuff is better than given credit for although probably still inferior to PS versions in most cases. There are many games I personally liked a lot but would struggle to recommend such as Sonic R, Burning Rangers etc. Fairly received at the time but due to performance probably also a struggle to play now without nostalgia.

 

Most of my time spent with the console was on multiplayer stuff so if you end up with multiple pads and a mate to play with let me know and I will give you a huge list of brilliant shit. I'm really looking forward to reading your opinion on the console/games when you get it, suffice to say the beast is in good hand with Mike.

[Lyrical Donut]

22 hours ago, megamixer said:

I have CCE (on a CD-R) and I personally don't really enjoy it. It has more content and is a lot more polished than the rushed original, but the remixed music is really not for me.

 

According to Wiki, Sega responded to criticism that Daytona's music didn't fit a racing game (heathens!), and produced this new soundtrack.

 

The whole game just feels a billion times more USA!USA!USA! to me. While that makes sense (it IS based on an American racing series after all), I feel that a lot of the charm of the original is lost.

 

And, as has been said, the handling feels completely different.

 

Personally I just play the remastered version on PSN from years back as it's pretty much perfect to the arcade

 

Ah, I'd completely forgotten about the music! As you were...

[Hanzo the Razor]

17 hours ago, pastry said:

If you want to imagine what Daytona in your home in 1995 was like, the Saturn port is the only option

 

I don't have to imagine. I remember it very well. Then the triple whammy of VF2, Sega Rally and Virtua Cop made it feel for a brief while like the Saturn could hold it's own against the PSX.

[mash]

16 hours ago, Hanzo the Razor said:

 

I don't have to imagine. I remember it very well. Then the triple whammy of VF2, Sega Rally and Virtua Cop made it feel for a brief while like the Saturn could hold it's own against the PSX.

 

At that point, the Saturn did far more than hold its own. Christmas 95/Jan 96 there was nothing on the PS1 that could compete with VF2, Virtua Cop 2 and Sega Rally. Playstation was still only on Tekken 1 and Ridge Racer was probably the best car racing game at that point. 

 

It's absolutely criminal that Sega did not build on those franchises there after. In the same way Namco did, who wouldn't have bought another Sega Rally with more tracks added or another Virtua Fighter game using the same engine as VF2. Instead they released Fighting Vipers which always seemed a step back from VF2, hell even Fighters Megamix wasn't as good. Less said about Manx TT and Touring Car the better. 

[Rex Grossman]

1 hour ago, mash said:

 

At that point, the Saturn did far more than hold its own. Christmas 95/Jan 96 there was nothing on the PS1 that could compete with VF2, Virtua Cop 2 and Sega Rally. Playstation was still only on Tekken 1 and Ridge Racer was probably the best car racing game at that point. 

 

It's absolutely criminal that Sega did not build on those franchises there after. In the same way Namco did, who wouldn't have bought another Sega Rally with more tracks added or another Virtua Fighter game using the same engine as VF2. Instead they released Fighting Vipers which always seemed a step back from VF2, hell even Fighters Megamix wasn't as good. Less said about Manx TT and Touring Car the better. 

 

Tekken couldn't compete with Virtua Fighter 2?

[SeanR]

Couldn’t even compete with Virtua Kids… 

[merrychan]

Just popped by to say I've finally ordered a Satiator

Also has anyone had any issues with running one in a Saturn that's already got a switchless mod (region free / boots CDRs) out of interest? I'm Wondering if it will be fine in that as well as my other stock Japanese Grey Saturn (the finest console ever I might add).

[mash]

1 hour ago, Rex Grossman said:

 

Tekken couldn't compete with Virtua Fighter 2?

Tekken 1 couldn’t compete with VF2. 

[Rex Grossman]

56 minutes ago, mash said:

Tekken 1 couldn’t compete with VF2. 

 

Fair enough. I don't think reviewers or the game-buying public subscribed to that viewpoint however.

[mash]

31 minutes ago, Rex Grossman said:

 

Fair enough. I don't think reviewers or the game-buying public subscribed to that viewpoint however.

 

That's how the Saturn rolled that whole generation. With hindsight, gamers realised they were wrong and the Saturn has had a critical re-evaluation. In the same way films which were disregarded at the time are now considered classics. 

 

 

[ianinthefuture]

1 hour ago, merrychan said:

Just popped by to say I've finally ordered a Satiator

Also has anyone had any issues with running one in a Saturn that's already got a switchless mod (region free / boots CDRs) out of interest? I'm Wondering if it will be fine in that as well as my other stock Japanese Grey Saturn (the finest console ever I might add).

 

My PAL Saturn has a switchless mod and works fine with the Satiator. It's a really wonderful bit of kit, as I'm obligated to say every time I mention it. Just such an elegant solution, Professor Abrasive needs a fecking knighthood or something for it.