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Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald

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17 minutes ago, Naieve said:

I watched the first movie at the weekend, quite enjoyed it but it reminded me of one of the X--men prequels, blatantly 2 different films stitched together. I want to see a film based on Newt's time working with dragons in WW1 but that wouldn't have enough tedious name dropping for the HP crowd. The Platypus thing was brilliant, the way it was jamming gold bars down it's pouch was really funny to me :D . 

 

I don't like the way they all use wands as notguns to fire blue shit. I also don't like that everyone does the turn into smoke and zoom around thing. Only the baddies seemed to do that in the HP films. I loved the horrible execution chamber and the shitty bureaucracy of American wizarding, it was so American.

 

 

 

 

Have you seen the "how it should have ended" video? In that they put Grindlewald in the execusion chamber and be done with him lol. Job done.

 

But yes, I too have gripes about how in the movies, all of a sudden everyone started to be able to fire back shots at each other without saying any incantations. I presume the idea is that as a wizard/witch you can fire weak as shit bolts that might knock you opponent down, but if you really want to put the hurt on them, you have to say the incantation too.

 

Apparatating has always been thing though I believe. Like small jumps you can do, over small distances.

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I'm sure the Magic NotFBI will be beating him with phone books at the start of the new movie but then he'll escape and Batman will have to catch him again.

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Adult wizards who properly learned the craft don't need to say incantations. Particularly aurors and others who engage in duels make use of silent spells as it gives them an advantage if the enemy does not know which spell they have to counter. At Hogwarts students start learning to do spells without incantations in their 6th year, but many spells are weakened if they are performed silently, but that is also dependent on how powerful the wizard is, what wand he is using, etc. For example, neither Dumbledore nor Voldemort used incantations when they dueled each other at the Ministry in the 5th movie.

 

All adult wizards are able to apparate (teleport), and not just small distances. Like when Hermione apparated herself, Ron and Harry to London in the beginning of the 7th movie. I don't like the whole smoke stuff either but even that has been a part of the old movies, with Death Eaters leaving a black trail and Order of the Phoenix members leaving a white trail.

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I just wish they were a bit more inventive with the magic...Like when Grindlewald escapes and he shoots snakes at people they need more of that stuff, all the battles should be filled with crazy shit.

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3 hours ago, Illyria said:

Adult wizards who properly learned the craft don't need to say incantations. Particularly aurors and others who engage in duels make use of silent spells as it gives them an advantage if the enemy does not know which spell they have to counter. At Hogwarts students start learning to do spells without incantations in their 6th year, but many spells are weakened if they are performed silently, but that is also dependent on how powerful the wizard is, what wand he is using, etc. For example, neither Dumbledore nor Voldemort used incantations when they dueled each other at the Ministry in the 5th movie.

 

All adult wizards are able to apparate (teleport), and not just small distances. Like when Hermione apparated herself, Ron and Harry to London in the beginning of the 7th movie. I don't like the whole smoke stuff either but even that has been a part of the old movies, with Death Eaters leaving a black trail and Order of the Phoenix members leaving a white trail.

 

See even I don't know everything haha.

 

2 hours ago, Delargey said:

I just wish they were a bit more inventive with the magic...Like when Grindlewald escapes and he shoots snakes at people they need more of that stuff, all the battles should be filled with crazy shit.

 

Thats one of the reasons I love Order of the Phoenix because of the battle between Dumbeldore and Voldermort. It's so much more than just zap bang

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Confusing, boring mess of a film (and I didn't mind the first one), and full of mumbling dialogue and shaky action editing.

 

There's an interest premise with the rise of a populist fascist character and how to deal with that... but the film barely deals with the idea. For a film about Grindelwald, it doesn't feature much Grindelwald. It stuffs a load of other plot threads into it, and red herrings, and pointless characters, and, and, and... blah. I really didn't enjoy it at all. :(

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2 hours ago, Delargey said:

I just wish they were a bit more inventive with the magic...Like when Grindlewald escapes and he shoots snakes at people they need more of that stuff, all the battles should be filled with crazy shit.

 

Agreed, and that's something that's bothered me about the old movies as well. Absolutely no creativity in most duels. And we never even once got to see the tickle spell!

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Also, baddies who are motivated by Visions or Prophecies = fucking shite. It worked with Voldo cos it had that fun self fulfilling thing but not anymore please.

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I think a vision of WW2 is an interesting motovation. I thought the additional evil layered on, up to and including

 

Spoiler

Killing a baby

 

actually weakened Grindelwand overall as an interesting protagonist.

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On 26/11/2018 at 20:30, Naieve said:

Also, baddies who are motivated by Visions or Prophecies = fucking shite. It worked with Voldo cos it had that fun self fulfilling thing but not anymore please.

 

I think that's a hell of a reason for Wizards to want to stop the muggle race after living through WW1. Even Jacob says "not another War" in shock. 

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On 26/11/2018 at 10:10, Stigweard said:

 

Are you talking about Credence?

 

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At first he thought he was Corvus Lestange (who was thought to have been killed by many on the sinking boat) and so did Yusuf Kama, thats why he was trying to kill him. The dwarf lady thought Credence was Corvus too because she took 'a baby' to America and hid him away at the Orphenage to keep him safe form the Kama family. Leta then revealed that he wasn't Corvus because she switched the babies on the boat, so Corvus was the baby who died when the lifeboat tipped over and Credence was taken by the dwarf. 

 

At this point Credence is nobody, he's at square one again, not knowing who he is or where he comes from. Grindlewald then reveals to him that he's Albus's brother. 

 

I personally think this is a lie as Grindlewald can't move against Dumbeldore because of the blood oath. He needs someone/thing powerful enough to be able to defeat Dumbledore and thinks that the obscurus that dwells within Credence  is the key to this. Also you can see at the end that Credence is powerful, with him blowing up the mountain side regardless of the obscurus. I don't think he can be Dumbeldores brother though because both Dumbledores parents died before Credence was born and also I presume the lady on the boat who swam after the sinking baby was Credence real mother.

 

 

Indeed I am talking about that chap. I just don't see that timeline as you suggest. I should google it. I'm not a Potter Lore fan tbh, yet it was a slightly confusing aspect for me.

 

THING IS...

 

 

The whole thing where by Albus-Law mentioned about the Phoenix - I felt that was a little jammed in. I noticed it straight away, knowing that it would be a plot point. Why was it suddenly highlighted? At the end we see that it pop out, as per the forshadowing; how can that be a lie or a mis-truth? Maybe Grindle-Depp made it happen yet it seemed authentic. Surely The Flash would know that it was a lie?


If it was NOT then that is frankly a super shit way to end things, a massive lie at the end of the film? Surely not.
 

 

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On 26/11/2018 at 14:12, Naieve said:

Yeah, if everyone Petronus is different why not everyone's generic blue flash thing? 

 

Are you talking about spells? Spells have specific colours. 

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On 20/11/2018 at 14:46, Stigweard said:

The ending

 

 

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I think he's lying to Credence as literally none of it makes sense for him to have another brother, especially one so young. His mother and sister died when he was 17 and his father died in Azkaban for seeking revenge on the muggles who harmed his sister.

 

Both his parents died before Credence was born (he was born 4 years after their death according to his birth certificate in the first film). If he is a Dumbledore, he must be Aunt Honoria's son, Albus's cousin. No sure where the brother part comes into it though.

 

 

A low 3/5 because whilst it's not great, I do bloody love the world and magic.

 

Spoiler

I was under the impression the boat with the babies on it sailed in 1901. Kendra and Ariana Dumbledore died 1899. The baby looks to be around a year old  

 

On 24/11/2018 at 20:11, Stigweard said:

So today I finished reading The Chamber of Secrets to my daughter and we're noe watching the film. The Chamber was opened 50 years ago, in the 40s. Jude Law needs to turn into this by the 5th film it seems.

 

 

20181124_200705.jpg

 

I think that’s a realistic look 18 years from now. If you think back to what Dumbledore looked like when he brought Tom to the school. And Tom is in his 5th or 6th year when the chamber is opened. 

He’s 46 in this latest movie. So 64 in that pic. 

 

On 26/11/2018 at 10:10, Stigweard said:

 

Are you talking about Credence?

 

Spoiler

swam after the sinking baby was Credence real mother.

 

 

Spoiler

“Credence’s aunt” is listed in the credits. So presumably that was Honoria.

 

Anyway, I’m calling it. Grindelwotsit knocked up Kendra before she died. Credence is that child. At first I thought perhaps he was Ariana’s, especially because of her suppressed magical powers and the way she killed her mother. But Grindelwald does say brother. I think he knows.

 

But I think the Dumbledore Phoenix has alterior motives. It’s definitely Fawkes, and I think he’s there to “bring Credence home”. They don’t ally with the bad dudes.

I think before the movies are done Credence will fulfil a role for Albus that allows him to better move on from the death of his sister. Perhaps somehow finding out it wasn’t his spell that hit her. It wouldn’t be too difficult to orchestrate if Credence has memories extracted and read in the penseive. If he is a baby Dumbledore, then chances are he was present during the duel and will have seen what happened. It would be rather cool if we got that piece of past played out.

 

Actually, the more I think about it, the more the title of the movie makes sense in that regard. If not screwing his best mate’s mum is one, then what were the crimes in that movie?

 

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6 hours ago, NexivRed said:

 

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I was under the impression the boat with the babies on it sailed in 1901. Kendra and Ariana Dumbledore died 1899. The baby looks to be around a year old  

 

I think that’s a realistic look 18 years from now. If you think back to what Dumbledore looked like when he brought Tom to the school. And Tom is in his 5th or 6th year when the chamber is opened. 

He’s 46 in this latest movie. So 64 in that pic. 

 

 

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“Credence’s aunt” is listed in the credits. So presumably that was Honoria.

 

Anyway, I’m calling it. Grindelwotsit knocked up Kendra before she died. Credence is that child. At first I thought perhaps he was Ariana’s, especially because of her suppressed magical powers and the way she killed her mother. But Grindelwald does say brother. I think he knows.

 

But I think the Dumbledore Phoenix has alterior motives. It’s definitely Fawkes, and I think he’s there to “bring Credence home”. They don’t ally with the bad dudes.

I think before the movies are done Credence will fulfil a role for Albus that allows him to better move on from the death of his sister. Perhaps somehow finding out it wasn’t his spell that hit her. It wouldn’t be too difficult to orchestrate if Credence has memories extracted and read in the penseive. If he is a baby Dumbledore, then chances are he was present during the duel and will have seen what happened. It would be rather cool if we got that piece of past played out.

 

Actually, the more I think about it, the more the title of the movie makes sense in that regard. If not screwing his best mate’s mum is one, then what were the crimes in that movie?

 

 

Not sure it that works out though because

 

Spoiler

Credence's birth certificate in the first film says 1904, unless that's a lie. But why wait 5 years to make a fake birth certificate?

 

credence-aurelius-birth-certificate.jpg.d61310f994ccff18515b9c21efd9c237.jpg

 

Also Dumbledore didn't strike up a friendship with Grindlewald till after Kendras death so Grindlewald wasn't involved with the family till then. Unless as you say, he's the father and knocked up Kendra. I guess they could say that whilst Albus' was at school, away from his mother and sister that Grindlewald was around due to his family living in the same place and he seduced Kendra, getting her pregnant. I just don't like it though. We hear all about the Dumbledore family from Albus and Aberforth and both just leave this 3rd brother out of the stories <_<

 

 

 

 

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Dumbledore has always been incredibly secretive, it doesn't surprise me at all that there are still mysteries to be revealed that we know nothing about. IF it's the truth.

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48 minutes ago, Illyria said:

Dumbledore has always been incredibly secretive, it doesn't surprise me at all that there are still mysteries to be revealed that we know nothing about. IF it's the truth.

 

Thats such a cop-out answer though because between them both, they reveal everything to Harry.....but not this.

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4 minutes ago, Stigweard said:

 

Thats such a cop-out answer though because between them both, they reveal everything to Harry.....but not this.

 

Dumbledore barely reveals anything to Harry, most of the info he got concerning the Dumbledore family was from Elphias Dodge after Dumbledore died. It's very possible even Elphias didn't know everything.

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1 hour ago, Illyria said:

 

Dumbledore barely reveals anything to Harry, most of the info he got concerning the Dumbledore family was from Elphias Dodge after Dumbledore died. It's very possible even Elphias didn't know everything.

 

My memory is hazy on it all it seems. It has been many years since I read the later books. 

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I've forgotten a lot of things as well! Been discussing theories with @NexivRed and @sprite and they know way more than I remember. I always have to go back and google and read up on what happened as it's been a few years for me as well :D 

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4 hours ago, Stigweard said:

 

Not sure it that works out though because

 

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Credence's birth certificate in the first film says 1904, unless that's a lie. But why wait 5 years to make a fake birth certificate?

 

credence-aurelius-birth-certificate.jpg.d61310f994ccff18515b9c21efd9c237.jpg

 

Also Dumbledore didn't strike up a friendship with Grindlewald till after Kendras death so Grindlewald wasn't involved with the family till then. Unless as you say, he's the father and knocked up Kendra. I guess they could say that whilst Albus' was at school, away from his mother and sister that Grindlewald was around due to his family living in the same place and he seduced Kendra, getting her pregnant. I just don't like it though. We hear all about the Dumbledore family from Albus and Aberforth and both just leave this 3rd brother out of the stories <_<

 

 

 

 

 

Spoiler

Both Credence and Corvus V are listed as being born in 1901 on the Harry Potter Wiki though. So I’m not sure which to believe regarding that birth certificate. When do you see it in the movie?

 

Yes you’re right, it’s not till he’s begrudgingly stuck at home after Kendra’s death that he meets Gellert. Perhaps it’s Ariana after all. I liked that idea better because of how she seems to have had an obscurus (now we know more about them). Like other emotional or mental health issues, the tendency to create one could be hereditary.

I just couldn’t work out why Gellert would bother saying brother...  

 

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25 minutes ago, NexivRed said:

 

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Both Credence and Corvus V are listed as being born in 1901 on the Harry Potter Wiki though. So I’m not sure which to believe regarding that birth certificate. When do you see it in the movie?

 

Yes you’re right, it’s not till he’s begrudgingly stuck at home after Kendra’s death that he meets Gellert. Perhaps it’s Ariana after all. I liked that idea better because of how she seems to have had an obscurus (now we know more about them). Like other emotional or mental health issues, the tendency to create one could be hereditary.

I just couldn’t work out why Gellert would bother saying brother...  

 

 

Who runs the Harry Potter will though? I posted a screen grab from the film with the date. This is what I mean about the first film being pointless. It's like she's come up with an idea after the fact and is running with that.

 

My take is that he said 

Spoiler

brother because either he is his brother or he's going to use Credence to kill Dumbledore because he can't do it himself. So he's using him, feeding him a bunch of lies by telling him that Albus wants him dead when that isn't what he wants it all

 

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As a film that was a bit poor I thought. Felt like almost 2 hours of exposition. Definitely one for the most obsessive fans who pour over every retrofitted bit of history that JKR invents...

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I keep wanting to it to call it The Crimes of Grumbleweeds. 

 

Makes sense.  I remember almost nothing about the Grumbleweeds and a few weeks after watching it, almost nothing about his film.

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