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Cosmic_Guru

The Council - episodic narrative RPG - TWISTY

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It looks promising. I can't say I like the facial expressions and expressivenes of characters, which are very important in a game like this, but all in all it feels very fresh, especially with all the political focus.

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I'm really enjoying this although it's a real niche curio - something for those of us who always pump loads of points into speech based skills in RPGs.  Basically you play a French dude (Louis de Richet) on the trail of his mother who has disappeared in mysterious circumstances in 1792 at a gathering of real and fictional historical personages in the classic Agatha Christie closed room scenario (in this case an island).  To add to the spice, some of the guests are senior members of a Secret Society.

 

You select one of 3 classes which influence your background and base skills but are free to upgrade skills from other branches if you wish - all the skills are speech or knowledge / character based, designed to present different ways of obtaining information.  The choice is 

 

Diplomat - majors on language, etiquette and politics;

Occulist - covers science, knowledge of the weird, manipulation of others and subterfuge; 

Detective - covers observation, psychology, questioning etc.

Each chapter you start to read a book if you have one in your inventory, which will grant you an additional skill point.

 

Gameplay wise it's an intense adventure game / talky  RPG hybrid with very little aimless wandering around and there are only 2 simple puzzles in episode one.  There are several forks in the path in which you choose to, for example, follow one character or remain talking with another.  Talking with someone continually references skills and leads to certain confrontations in the form of challenges which require responding correctly to gain the trust of the individual or to, for example, obtain something they possess which may be relevant to your investigation.  If you fail these tests, the game just continues with appropriate downstream consequences. You will be continually reminded of skill checks you fail even when not in 1:1 conversation.

 

I should add that there are three further layers of complexity underneath the level of basic skills.  Firstly, each NPC has vulnerabilities and immunities rather analogous to classic RPG monsters e.g fire monsters immune to fire attack, weak to ice; only in this game psychological.  Finding and exploiting these makes conversation more efficient and grants higher XP at the end of each "quest" (chapter).  Secondly, exercising skills earn talents for your character . Finally, certain character traits are revealed after certain actions.

 

Visually it's lush in 4K with elaborate interiors and much artwork in particular to admire.  Some of the characters have the sort of grotesquery associated with Arkane's work.  The music is good and the game didn't give me an option to have French dialogue so it's a pot-pourri of accents.  

 

In my first attempt I went the occultist route, made a complete fist of confrontations with the Cardinal and Emily (you reap what you sow with her), and ended the episode

Spoiler

drugged from laudanum at the hands of a heavily tattood Elizabeth Adams (the stillborn daughter of the second US president).  

 

The game cannily gives you 3 save slots to try other routes and skill load outs, so I immediately started a diplomat and doubtless will try out the detective too (takes about 2 hours to run through).

 

Interface wise it's a bit like Quantum Break in the way you can replay from any chapter (called quests) onwards, and it also shares that clean yellow / white menu design.

 

The big question of course is to what extent any of this will matter downstream - the Telltale experience was initially exhilarating for me (original Walking dead series, the Wolf one, maybe the GoT one), until I realised that the seemingly BIG things weren't really (or just got tired of zombies).  This is a rather different kettle of fish.

 

 

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Episode 2 was weak - basically just 2 long puzzles but 3 is much longer and stronger.  I should have stopped playing before attempting to solve the last puzzle .....  Interesting now to see how this one gets resolved!

 

Unfortunately the episode highlights the weakness in voice acting in this - you play a French man but he voiced by an American (as is his mother) and I found that a bit confusing when attempting to resolve / advance the matter the conference was called to resolve, given how closely that matter entwines French and US interests.  

 

Continues to be an unusual experience.

 

 

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On 26/07/2018 at 11:29, Cosmic_Guru said:

Episode 2 was weak - basically just 2 long puzzles but 3 is much longer and stronger.  I should have stopped playing before attempting to solve the last puzzle .....  Interesting now to see how this one gets resolved!

 

Total cop out as it happens.  However, episode 4 is rather tasty and sets up the final episode (due out this week I think) well.  

 

Not sure how I could have saved 

Spoiler

"mother" given how you are unavoidably detained by Mortimer as you try to exit the mansion.  I'm siding with Gregory on this run but I have another game advanced to the start of episode 4 where I'll go the other way.  Embracing my daemon self all the way!  

 

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I am playing through this too, I think the final episode is to come out this week. It really drives the genre forward, avoids totally the pointlessness of most dialogue in Telltale-alike games by making the conversations themselves a kind of battle. The setting is great too (though anachronisms jar - I really don't think an 18th century gentleman would say 'Holy shit' or 'Man up').

 

Obviously the low budget hampers it. Voice acting ranges from acceptable to terrible, and you can see shortcuts like how they everyone has only packed a single outfit even though they seem to have intended to stay for a fortnight or more on the island (and poor old Emily seems to have forgotten to bring any clothes at all). Not sure I totally dug the plot direction change in ep 3 either, but I have warmed to it.

 

But yeah, one can nitpick, but as a fan of historical adventure games with a great sense of place, interesting and clever plotting and meaningful dialogue this is the game I've been waiting for all my life. If your interests intersect with that rather specific niche then I'd highly recommend it. Also it's only £14.99 for the season pass with PS+, so a good time to jump in.

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I can't really think of anything quite like it.  The voice acting is definitely the weak point particularly casting the two central French characters with Americans - jarring and at one point, when you are attempting to play the political game, downright confusing. Some of the French text carries over and some of the writing is too modern.

 

However, as you point out unlike Telltale games, conversations have real consequences with the degree of trust obtained, and certain characters will live or die at your hand, or indirectly as a result of your choices.  Not sure what the collectible coins do either at this point.  

 

I plan to run through the whole game with the benefit of hindsight and having made a note of the puzzle solutions along the way it should be fairly quick.  

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Agree with the slight dissonance around American Louis, though at least for actual French words and names he has a stab at the correct pronunciation!

I also think the balance is a little messed up, and some of the gameplay systems don't quite hang together (like, it is supremely easy to get at least level 1 of every single talent then cheese your way through just about everything with consumables). I forgive them for it all though, it's such a unique and daring game concept. Really makes me look forward to what they come up with next - hopefully they can build on the success of this (assuming it was successful...)

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7 hours ago, Cosmic_Guru said:

 

Not sure how I could have saved 

  Reveal hidden contents

"mother" given how you are unavoidably detained by Mortimer as you try to exit the mansion.  I'm siding with Gregory on this run but I have another game advanced to the start of episode 4 where I'll go the other way.  Embracing my daemon self all the way!  

 

 

Basically keep all confrontations as short as possible and you have an opportunity.  However, the scene at the wharf still went badly, and there was a call-back to the first decision you take in the game which didn't go my way, so same end result.  

 

Also, in this alternate run I have 

Spoiler

been poisoned by von Bulow :o.  

 

The game has updated for the final episode :).

 

Very impressed by the smaller things which change as a result of your skill set and success or otherwise at confrontations as well as the big life or death events.

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How long is each episode? I've bought it in the PSN sale but don't fancy a big diversion from AC:O right now

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20 minutes ago, Hexx said:

How long is each episode? I've bought it in the PSN sale but don't fancy a big diversion from AC:O right now

 

Around 2 hours on average.

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Well, I got a hell of an ending.

 

Spoiler

I had decided to go full daemon and embraced myself as Mortimer's son. I let him kill his brother and at the end of the game Mortimer possessed my body and killed me. 

So...yay? :wacko:

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15 hours ago, mdn2 said:

Well, I got a hell of an ending.

 

  Reveal hidden contents

I had decided to go full daemon and embraced myself as Mortimer's son. I let him kill his brother and at the end of the game Mortimer possessed my body and killed me. 

So...yay? :wacko:

 

Err Nay I would say.  There are at least two bad endings because I've had them both*.  Stayed up to stupid o'clock Wednesday running through a third game to attempt the "good" ending and something struck me immediately.

 

Re servants, particularly the first one you encounter on the wharf.

 

Spoiler

He is voiced by the same actor as Mortimer.  Not unusual to double up roles (PiaggI and Holm in this for example) but the voice here is identical, so you have to feel this is deliberate.  Could this be Mortimer himself (the character is the same height) or Mortimer controlling these minions but in a way which uses his own voice?  Later on, inside, if you persevere, you can obtain a book from the servant who admits to taking it from Lord M's library - again that seems suggestive.

 

I don't understand a few things, particularly concerning Von Wöllner

 

Spoiler

He is a historical character like Godoy, Bonaparte and Washington and therefore essentially untouchable, but unlike them appears to be possessed by a demon since he is present in the family line up.   This may have something to do with the demon Asahel which I have yet to encounter.  The alternative might be that demon is connected with Perú in some manner but I have never had a satisfactory relationship with the Frenchman.

 

I need to complete the final episode again and then come back with final thoughts.  I reckon I have the two things needed for success

 

Spoiler

the book and the correct spear

 

so I need to succeed with a specific confrontation and then retain enough points to be able to lie when the time comes.

 

* there might be a third - don't Google any of the characters in this to avoid nasty spoilers.

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7 hours ago, Cosmic_Guru said:

Re servants, particularly the first one you encounter on the wharf.

 

  Reveal hidden contents

He is voiced by the same actor as Mortimer.  Not unusual to double up roles (PiaggI and Holm in this for example) but the voice here is identical, so you have to feel this is deliberate.  Could this be Mortimer himself (the character is the same height) or Mortimer controlling these minions but in a way which uses his own voice?  Later on, inside, if you persevere, you can obtain a book from the servant who admits to taking it from Lord M's library - again that seems suggestive.

 

 

From a new cut scene at the end of Run 3 the latter explanation is broadly correct - it is deliberate.

 

Anyway, Run 3 is finished and I got a really satisfactory ending - no one died unnecessarily (and the mynah bird lives on too although dunno who will feed it now).

 

I reckon now there may be 2 good endings too, as well as the 2 or 3 bad ones - the one I was originally planning for and the one I actually got.

 

I was planning for (major end game spoilers obviously)

 

Spoiler

Choose the correct spear and obtain the book from the wharf.  Ensure you have effort points aplenty to lie convincingly to Mortimer, entice him forward with the book and stab him.  Leave the island with the others.(But see note below).  I got through this in Run 2 but had been poisoned by Von Wöllner and died immediately after the act.

 

This does not require any specific loyalty to H or M.

 

What I actually got was this.  You only get it if you ally with H and stick with that decision consistently.  The way it goes down (MAJOR end game spoilers obviously)

 

Spoiler

Stick with Holm in the vote and the ether segment and you get the opportunity to be spirit entered by him. Accept and he tells you to go up to Liz's room and link up with an ally who turns out to be Grandad (the demon Aruzel or summit).  Agree to be entered by him and you get a really great confrontation with Luis (what have you done to support me?) followed by Grandad doing the necessary and burying Mortimer alive for ever.  You get to leave with the book and effectively usurp Mortimer.

 

Note one thing you learn from Good ending 2 might have consequences to Good ending 1.

 

Spoiler

You learn (or are reminded) that family members must not harm, let alone kill, other family members.  So not sure if Grandad would turn up to punish you if you stab Dad without having being poisoned.

 

Well, that's me done.  Excellent game with lots and lots of little branching points (and call backs to earlier events), and things which simply don't happen down different paths; also some real cliff-hangers between episodes.  Still don't understand the roles of a couple of guests (particularly Von Wöllner, I'm sure I've missed something there, maybe also Perú) but overall very satisfying experience. 

 

Nothing else quite like it.

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I think I'm happy with my one run through. That my (tragic) story for Luis. Although it's interesting to see just what choices were available. 

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Blasted through to end of episode 3. It's pretty good. Lovely sense of place/style. As other have said the voice acting is a bit weird - and accents can be out of place. (Subtitles and Dialogue also don't always match up - and in one point said a different code number!)

 

How does replaying quests/chapters go? Looking at the trophy list it looks pretty easier to platinum is you speed through chapter 1 twice (and a bit)

 

 

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22 minutes ago, Hexx said:

Blasted through to end of episode 3. It's pretty good. Lovely sense of place/style. As other have said the voice acting is a bit weird - and accents can be out of place. (Subtitles and Dialogue also don't always match up - and in one point said a different code number!)

 

How does replaying quests/chapters go? Looking at the trophy list it looks pretty easier to platinum is you speed through chapter 1 twice (and a bit)

 

Chapter 1 is the only one you need replay for specific achievements.  It's then up to you whether or not to keep multiple games in play across the 3 slots.

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Massive episode 4 spoilers 

 

So they copied incest as well as ‘I am your father’ from Star Wars?



 

Mum died without really giving any answers...it’s a shame we didn’t have more of a connection

 

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My ending completely sucked! Utterly anti-climatic and cop out.

 

 

Emily, Emma (in a servant) and I go to see Mortimer.

 

 


Emily/Emma hold off his powers (by doing Professor X style "thinking really hard" poses) and I walked up and stabbed him with the nail (I'm pretty sure I got the right spear, but wasn't going to risk it)

Then we walked off and everyone got on a boat home - with both demons dead.

 

 

 

That was it. I presume it's a "good" ending - but it was a real damp squib. I think of few of my choices weren't expected/followed through on as the game seemed to swerve them

 

 

I'd always been human focused and planning to betray both. Although I was outwardly Mortimer supporting. I wish we had the option not to possess people...

 


Was there any way to get Sarah out of the Ether?

I failed an encounter with Asurael in the Ether but nothing seemed to come of it.

I found Al Azif only for it never to be mentioned (How did Von Wollner get it from Emma's hiding space?)

 

I know I fucked up being delaying in Mortimer's study early on - but the murdered servant never came up again?

There seemed to be no consequence for the letter to the Pope? (Which I think I got right)

They never really explained how Emma survived being shot did they?

Or what the bird heard between Sarah and Mortimer...

Was there any way into the locked room by Paiggi in the manor? I never found it?

Should I have used the Al Azif somewhere? (I got it too late - but it looked amazing for manuscript purposes!)

 

Do we know why Sarah went to see Emily/Emma?


Is it possible to save Sarah? It seemed like we had far far more to talk about but Emily had already killed her...

What would have happened if I'd opened Pandora's Urn...I went back after mothers warning but it wasn't an option

 

 

Really interesting game, really well done. And it's another one that shows how stagnant TellTale have/had become. Loses it's way a bit in the later sections and I don't think it ever recovers fully. The first 2 episodes are brilliantly done

 

If I was the type to repay this sort of game I expect there's loads of story/alternative angles I didn't see that might answer some questions.

 

 

 

 

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I wouldn't call that a damp squib ending but it is a "good" one since you escape the island.  I never came close to that outcome so that's good ending #3

 

I will post further thoughts when I have a little more time later.

 

 

Just leave this for now (non specific thematic spoiler music video)

Spoiler

 

 

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1 minute ago, Cosmic_Guru said:

I wouldn't call that a damp squib ending

 

It's more it took about 10-15 seconds of completely undramatic occurrences.

 

It might be good, but it didn't feel satisfying/climatic :D

 

 

 

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(Assuming you don't want to replay the game) Comments on @Hexx ending

 

Spoiler

I assume the key factor was you must have killed Emma in the shoot out and her demon self is occupying the servant.  Maybe you also had a high trust level with Emily for this to pop - I didn't always confide everything in her and played the ass with her most of the time.

 

I incorrectly identified Emily all times in the shoot out and then had different fates for Emma -

Died at Sarah's hands

Died at my hands after killing Sarah

Lived, left the island and was the muse for Jane Austin's Emma.

 

How did you retain the nails after the episode 3 puzzle?

 

 

Some comments on your questions, anyone disagree?

 

Spoiler

Was there any way to get Sarah out of the Ether?

Yes, see below.

I failed an encounter with Asurael in the Ether but nothing seemed to come of it.

Is this the one in Elizabeth's room? If so it is key, but I think it was just a meeting not an encounter (that comes later with yourself).  

There is also reference to an encounter in the putting the history puzzle in sequence section but I never had that trigger.

I found Al Azif only for it never to be mentioned (How did Von Wollner get it from Emma's hiding space?)
I think there was a missing link here somewhere, never got to the bottom of it (later on you can follow the trail out to the wharf to find it, that part is clear enough).  VonWöllner seems a key character plot wise, and I think that might be why he is present in the line up later even though not a "family" member, but seems to have gaps in his story.  
 


I know I fucked up being delaying in Mortimer's study early on - but the murdered servant never came up again?

Don't remember this happening at all, if this was early episode 2.  A lot hinges on whether you stayed drinking with Elizabeth the night before.

There seemed to be no consequence for the letter to the Pope? (Which I think I got right)

There is in one ending, because it forms part of the encounter with yourself which you have to pass to persuade Asurael to come to your aid against Mortimer (which is a version of your good ending I suppose, rather than a do it yourself without demon assistance good ending).

They never really explained how Emma survived being shot did they?

I think the distraction of the opened door was sufficient to send the shot high or wide.

Or what the bird heard between Sarah and Mortimer...

???  Bird died in one run, never said much in the others even after being fed.

Was there any way into the locked room by Paiggi in the manor? I never found it?

Don't think so - just seemed to be a spare room.

Should I have used the Al Azif somewhere? (I got it too late - but it looked amazing for manuscript purposes!)

Yes, if you have the correct spear but convince Mortimer you lost it to Bonaparte, you can entice Mortimer toward you in the final confrontation before stabbing him with the spear (or nails in your case).  Also reading the loose page gives you a bunch of skill points.

 

Do we know why Sarah went to see Emily/Emma?

To follow up on her mission I assume.


Is it possible to save Sarah? It seemed like we had far far more to talk about but Emily had already killed her...

Yes.  You have to (for once in a game) actually hurry through the 2 encounters - punch Bonaparte rather than engage him in discussion and then don't ask questions of Mortimer.  Maybe only the first is key but on the 2nd run I had the answers already so didnt need to ask anything.  Then there is a confrontation between Emma/Emily and Sarah which can end a number of ways, including both dead and both alive.  Sarah then leaves the island with the others and does more secret society stuff before dying without finding another bodily recipient to transfer to.

What would have happened if I'd opened Pandora's Urn...I went back after mothers warning but it wasn't an option

Nothing or nothing at the time anyway (I think I opened it every run so I don't have a control).

 

 

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Nope. I called out Emma (but wasn't sure) and Emily shot her. By time I got to docks Emily had shot Sarah - but I let her go. Then I met her in room and learnt about our incest and argued with her over who's fault everything was. I met Sarah in the Ether (couldn't find how to get her out) and Emma (who got VERY angry I wouldn't promise to get her out). Then when I went back to Emily later, she'd gotten Emma out into a servant. (Who didn't seem to carry over anger from before. I originally assumed it was Sarah or Jesus in there not Emma based on this - but it seems it was Emma she was just calmer)



 

I got the nail from the puzzle after the door opened (Glowing! Of course I picked it up) - it was on one of the many trips past it in Episode 4. I only realised during the last confrontation it's importance. I had option to stab with nail/stab with spear. Picked Nail (it worked on the puzzle - so must be legit bloody right?) even though I was confident of spear

 

I met Azazel/Jesus during the sequence puzzle in the Ether - he was left at the start through a painting - took me to Elizabeth's room where he appeared as her. Was a bit cocky and tried to Scan him...which resulted in very bad things/having to run away. Mortimer helped remotely.

How do you meet in Elizabeth's room?

 

If you feed Mortimer's bird a "red fruit" during trying to go behind the nightmare - it repeats part of an exchange between Mortimer and Sarah that seemed very heated and suggests he did her harm (Feeding it chocolate would have killed it I found out due to skills)


I failed getting out of the study behind the nightmare. (Where you have to put the code in so 1191 shows outside). Peru saved me eventually. (I did all good things to Peru and seemed to have missed out on loads of his backstory). I assume this delay mattered. When I (eventually) went down to the crypt at the end of episode 2 there was a dead servant where someone (assume Sarah) had been hiding. At the start of Ep 3 Washington comes down to get you for conference - no one talks about the servant with his brains bashed in ever again (I assumed by Sarah...)

 

Von Wollner is a "family" member - he's Gregory's son. It's not clear if he's a demon or not. Yeah I got Al Azif from the boat - a note in his room made it clear he was meeting someone there. (Annoyingly I was on the docks early in another earlier episode and it said something like "Von Wollner's not been here yet" when clicking things...even though I hadn't found the note/clue yet.) I just can't work out how it went from "Emma hid it" to "VW has it")

 

Oh I gave Bonaparte Mortimer's Encyclopedia I'd nicked (I'd already read it/skilled up :D)

 

There's clearly a lot of moving pieces here!

 

 

 

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9 minutes ago, Hexx said:

 

 

  Reveal hidden contents

Nope. I called out Emma (but wasn't sure) and Emily shot her. By time I got to docks Emily had shot Sarah - but I let her go. Then I met her in room and learnt about our incest and argued with her over who's fault everything was. I met Sarah in the Ether (couldn't find how to get her out) and Emma (who got VERY angry I wouldn't promise to get her out). Then when I went back to Emily later, she'd gotten Emma out into a servant. (Who didn't seem to carry over anger from before. I originally assumed it was Sarah or Jesus in there not Emma based on this - but it seems it was Emma she was just calmer)

 


 

I got the nail from the puzzle after the door opened (Glowing! Of course I picked it up) - it was on one of the many trips past it in Episode 4. I only realised during the last confrontation it's importance. I had option to stab with nail/stab with spear. Picked Nail (it worked on the puzzle - so must be legit bloody right?) even though I was confident of spear

 

I met Azazel/Jesus during the sequence puzzle in the Ether - he was left at the start through a painting - took me to Elizabeth's room where he appeared as her. Was a bit cocky and tried to Scan him...which resulted in very bad things/having to run away. Mortimer helped remotely.

How do you meet in Elizabeth's room?

 

If you feed Mortimer's bird a "red fruit" during trying to go behind the nightmare - it repeats part of an exchange between Mortimer and Sarah that seemed very heated and suggests he did her harm (Feeding it chocolate would have killed it I found out due to skills)


I failed getting out of the study behind the nightmare. (Where you have to put the code in so 1191 shows outside). Peru saved me eventually. (I did all good things to Peru and seemed to have missed out on loads of his backstory). I assume this delay mattered. When I (eventually) went down to the crypt at the end of episode 2 there was a dead servant where someone (assume Sarah) had been hiding. At the start of Ep 3 Washington comes down to get you for conference - no one talks about the servant with his brains bashed in ever again (I assumed by Sarah...)

 

Von Wollner is a "family" member - he's Gregory's son. It's not clear if he's a demon or not. Yeah I got Al Azif from the boat - a note in his room made it clear he was meeting someone there. (Annoyingly I was on the docks early in another earlier episode and it said something like "Von Wollner's not been here yet" when clicking things...even though I hadn't found the note/clue yet.) I just can't work out how it went from "Emma hid it" to "VW has it")

 

Oh I gave Bonaparte Mortimer's Encyclopedia I'd nicked (I'd already read it/skilled up :D)
 

 

 

 

There's clearly a lot of moving pieces here!

 

 

 

 

Incredible stuff.  I mean you can guess the existence of some of it by inspecting the alternative paths or failed objectives at the end of each chapter, but even so this is pretty impressive levels of branching in a limited space of game.

 

Misunderstanding re the servant - I experienced this and don't think this is influenceable, or important in any way which is probably why it is never mentioned.

 

re Azurael

Spoiler

I didn't see how to interact with him in the picture puzzle.

Later, in that stand off in the Ether I remained committed Holm, let Holm invade me and he told me to go to Elizabeth's room and invoke the Ether (in this game Elizabeth had vanished and not been murdered, not sure if that makes a difference).  There I invoked and  spoke with Azurael (who appeared in Elizabeth's body) and asked for his help (I did not mind probe him though since Mortimer put me straight on that point earlier).  He agreed but challenged me further just before entering the room with Mortimer at the very end (the point of no return) - basically along the lines of what have you done yourself thus far to deserve my help - this is the confrontation where altering the letter you write as Piaggi comes into play.  If you pass he basically overpowers Mortimer through demon powers, nullifies the servants and I imagine it goes down broadly like your ending (Mortimer isn't dead though just buried alive for eternity).  You leave having ursurped your father, but possibly owing a debt to granddad.  If you kill Mortimer using the lance or nails you have broken the family code of honour.

 

re Perú

Spoiler

I always thought there was more to this character than a dumb goon who you have the major interaction with in episode 1.  There are at least another couple of conversations with him and you get to find about his daughter but it never went anywhere in particular.

I knew how to get out of the study from (my) logic but there was obviously an alternative solution, as you explain.  

Regardless, the servant is dead but that's probably Sarah's doing.  Even if you get the sword and statue puzzle correct first time he's always dead.

Perú can end up killing himself or going crazy from being mind probed by the family and has never been present at the final Council meeting in my game.

 

re Emily

Spoiler

I (me) got really annoyed when I first found out Emma had impersonated Emily in my room (which is why in one run I strangled her on the wharf), but I don't know how that all really went down and for how much further back I might have been deceived.  

Emma in the Ether was in her little girl lost persona and it never got heated with Emily either in that segment, so I guess I've missed a bit here too.

 

I still feel there is more to know about Sarah and Von Wöllner in particular, but still got my money's worth from this.

 

There was also reference to an "unexpected" or "unusual" encounter in episode 1 which I never experienced.

 

I would recommend playing a second time just to pick more things up with full context, even from early in Episode 1, and choosing the alternative paths each time.

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Ahh

 

I was never on Holm's side. I was (for appearances) on Mortimer's side. I was cordial to Holm, but clearly pro democracy.



 

I rather liked the fact it let you could act like that. Lots of choice games would be "You sided with Mortimer" and that's it, and never let you stab him in the back.


Did you win the vote? I got everyone to vote for Mortimer (I like democracy I was assuming to take them both out :D) - but a part of me really wanted to vote for Holm, even if everyone else voted for Mortimer just to see what happened. Is that entire section of the game different if you're not following Mortimer? You have a different 3 people to convince to vote for Holm? (rather than 3 to vote for Mortimer?)

 

Also - do you know what happens if Von Wollner does your body harm while you're in Paigi?

 

Did you work out the point of the crypts? I didn't have enough EP to open them all - I opened Mortimer's and got amber fragments (I had so many segments towards the end and barely risked filling them all :). There were other names though...and a ominous blank one.

 

Wait. Emma had impersonated Emily? I thought it was legit Emily I'd boinked (and later dialogue seemed to back that up)...I'm going to have to think whether that's the game going differently or me misunderstanding things. The game made it clear there were two "Emily"'s that night though since the other was (IIRC) entertaining Napoleon.

 

I'd wondered if Emma hadn't been present before - it's tricky as Emily seems to have told her everything by time you meet them and there's no hint vice versa happened. It was just a bit odd she got shot/everyone acted as though gone/dead, and then she's in room. With Sarah and Emily. Felt like missing story there.

 

Peru - I got Elizabeth away from him (sorry George) but then dissed on women with him.

I mucked up a chat in the garden for episode 2 (which seemed the best chance to get to know him)

Then I saved him from killing himself, and later talked him out of killing me as Mortimer's son.

 

Do you know where the "letters" I should have been reading were? The loading screens KEPT MENTIONING them to find out immunities/vulnerabilities? Was that the post box on the docks. I ignored them on day 1 (like a goody too shoes) and never had chance again despite going back to the docks.

 

I'm not sure about replaying. I'm terrible at playing these sorts of games more than once - always try to make my true/accurate choices and playing any other way is odd.

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Well 

 

Spoiler

I was never on Holm's side. I was (for appearances) on Mortimer's side. I was cordial to Holm, but clearly pro democracy.

I rather liked the fact it let you could act like that. Lots of choice games would be "You sided with Mortimer" and that's it, and never let you stab him in the back. 
Did you win the vote? I got everyone to vote for Mortimer (I like democracy I was assuming to take them both out :D) - but a part of me really wanted to vote for Holm, even if everyone else voted for Mortimer just to see what happened. Is that entire section of the game different if you're not following Mortimer? You have a different 3 people to convince to vote for Holm? (rather than 3 to vote for Mortimer?) 

 

This is the way it went over my 3 games (H switching to M, M all the way, H all the way).

Bonaparte is Mortimer's man come what may. This means that Holm cannot win the vote, whatever you do.  If you are in Holm's team in this section you are charged with checking their loyalty, rather than persuading the other side to turn. Godoy is the most loyal of Holm's team and can stay with him; all the others - George Washington, Piaggi  (if alive) and VonW will turn - you can choose whether to warn Holm about Piaggi and Von W but it doesn't alter anything.  I am pretty certain I convinced Godoy to swap sides twice in one game, but the memory is now a little hazy (the section when you inhabit Bonaparte to talk to Godoy is genius).  Perú (if alive), VonW and Emily/Emma don't participate, at least not if VonW is accused of attacking Piaggi and attempting to poison Luis, in which case he gets his marching orders.

If you are in Mortimer's team you can persuade all the other side (who it turns out don't need much encouragement) and achieve a clean sweep in his favour.

Regardless of the vote, the scene immediately leads to the "freezing" of the Council Room tableaux etc etc, although if you have ducked and dived and switch sides between episodes 4 and 5 that will be referenced later in the Mortimer / Holm standoff.


  Also - do you know what happens if Von Wollner does your body harm while you're in Paigi? 

 

You die from poison if Mortimer doesn't get to you first.  Dunno if this happens also if you have demonic assistance.

 

I'd wondered if Emma hadn't been present before - it's tricky as Emily seems to have told her everything by time you meet them and there's no hint vice versa happened. It was just a bit odd she got shot/everyone acted as though gone/dead, and then she's in room. With Sarah and Emily. Felt like missing story there. 

  Agree Not sure about this section at all - there doesn't seem to be anyway at all to distinguish the twins before the final chapter, so no way of knowing for sure how they played this.  Maybe if you don't sleep with Emily/Emma it is easier to follow because she can't use that card.

Peru - I got Elizabeth away from him (sorry George) but then dissed on women with him. 
Done that section both ways.
I mucked up a chat in the garden for episode 2 (which seemed the best chance to get to know him) 

Same here, agreed probably important (together with the scene on the balcony of his room)
Then I saved him from killing himself, and later talked him out of killing me as Mortimer's son. 
I let him kill himself once. I don't think this scene happened in the other games.
  

Do you know where the "letters" I should have been reading were? The loading screens KEPT MENTIONING them to find out immunities/vulnerabilities? Was that the post box on the docks. I ignored them on day 1 (like a goody too shoes) and never had chance again despite going back to the docks.
No, I think the letters referred to in the loading screens are those lying around in the guest rooms - background info more than anything.  They remain as interactive all game.  The letters in the box mostly aren't key but there is one written by Sarah to a Society safe house which contributes to the evidence you seek in the first section of the game.
  


Did you work out the point of the crypts? I didn't have enough EP to open them all - I opened Mortimer's and got amber fragments (I had so many segments towards the end and barely risked filling them all :). There were other names though...and a ominous blank one. 

No, probably just background immortality stuff - I was there at the time of the Romans etc.  I didn't find all the spears either.  There was also that mysterious box in Mortimer's secret room behind the study.

  

Wait. Emma had impersonated Emily? I thought it was legit Emily I'd boinked (and later dialogue seemed to back that up)...I'm going to have to think whether that's the game going differently or me misunderstanding things. The game made it clear there were two "Emily"'s that night though since the other was (IIRC) entertaining Napoleon. 

Yes.  She mocks poor Luis endlessly for his mistake.  Emily attempting to work over Bonaparte on behalf of Holm makes sense given that she is on his side in the debate.

 

 

 

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Oh

 

 

On in that case I didn't commit incest...with Emily. 

 


 

All our chat/angst was just about attraction rather than acting on it. Emily seems a bit overwrought about it then.

 

I did boink my other sister then. But she's dead (ish) now. So that's ok....
 

 

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