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Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice

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Killed the elite Ashina samurai on about my twelfth attempt. Fuck me this game is haaaaaard. It's so difficult not to get in a flap, especially when you get rushed. I'm not sure if I actually enjoy playing it. It's so fucking frustrating. Makes me want to punch things, usually myself in the thigh, repeatedly.

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22 minutes ago, Jamie John said:

Killed the elite Ashina samurai on about my twelfth attempt. Fuck me this game is haaaaaard. It's so difficult not to get in a flap, especially when you get rushed. I'm not sure if I actually enjoy playing it. It's so fucking frustrating. Makes me want to punch things, usually myself in the thigh, repeatedly.

Oh man, I don’t want to spoil anything but be prepared for some serious thigh punching coming up very soon!

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I think I'm going to go back and have a go at some of the mini-bosses I've missed, as well as the butterfly woman, before I continue in an effort to git gud ahead of whatever is coming next.

 

My biggest issue is I keep pressing circle every time I see an enemy move as it's hardwired into my muscle memory from dodging in Souls and BB, whereas in this the dodge is crap in most situations and I should be deflecting instead. It's like I've learnt to play an instrument incorrectly and now I have to re-teach myself how to do it the right way, which is ten times harder than starting from scratch.

 

I saw this on Reddit and might consider it:

 

Spoiler

 

 

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Circle is important because the Mikiri counter is extremely valuable in destroying posture, but yeah, you should definitely not play it like DS. Jump in (literally, the jump kick is very effective), slash, slash, slash, parry, parry, slash, Mikiri counter, death blow.

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13 minutes ago, Vemsie said:

Circle is important because the Mikiri counter is extremely valuable in destroying posture, but yeah, you should definitely not play it like DS. Jump in (literally, the jump kick is very effective), slash, slash, slash, parry, parry, slash, Mikiri counter, death blow.

If only it was that easy!

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Make heal triangle and item up on the dpad, which I think is basically BB buttons.

 

I was also dodging and dying a lot at first. You need to substitute parry / block for dodge in this game.

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1 hour ago, Jamie John said:

:(

 

I'm scared now.

Don’t be. Go and take a look, it’s not a dead end. You can still go off in plenty of new directions from here. It’s worth it, just to see how all those skills you think you’ve learned after everything you’ve done so far was just the tutorial!

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Thanks for the advice, all. I think mostly I just need to practice with some of the mobs and lay off the dodge. I'm also going to do some of the things in this vid, including assigning heal to triangle, like @DC suggests:

 

 

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1 hour ago, El Spatula said:

There are some bosses where dodge is pretty much necessary mind...

I can't think of one? Simply walking is usually enough. 

 

I found dodge button most useful for closing distance tbh. And even then, sprinting is usually better! 

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And re the spirit Emblems / prosthetics, I'd agree it's a bit disjointed. 

 

Firstly, because they are all optional (as in you can miss / not find them) the game had to be designed so that every encounter is doable without, which ultimately makes them a bit pointless.  Maybe an approach like BotW (ie give all abilities from the beginning) could've worked better, and we could've had enemies that *required* certain tools to beat. 

 

Second, the Emblems themselves shouldn't be a consumable that can run out. I'm fine with them having a carry limit, and that the limit can be levelled up, but ti think the game would be loads better if they just always refilled when you rested at a bonfire. 

 

Wtf is with Miyazaki and his insistence on grinding out essential consumables? Demon's and Bloodborne suffered the same nonsense. 

 

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3 hours ago, JPL said:

If only it was that easy!


It's not that easy, but it's the mindset you should have when playing. I was observing a friend of mine who was playing this for the first time and she was playing it like Bloodborne. Dashing in for a few hits, dashing backwards to avoid attacks instead of parrying/countering them. She was having so much trouble with the white mini-boss with the spear in Harata because of this. This game is about all-out agression, not defense. When it clicks fights go a lot smoother. 

As for the prosthetics, I like that they're optional. You can miss them, but searching for them is definitely recommended because the prosthetics make your life a helluva lot easier. 

Spoiler

The shuriken is incredibly powerful against opponents that jump, the firecracker is powerful against basically everything, the Sabimaru makes certain fights a breeze, fire is great against the Ogre and certain other enemies, the axe makes life against shielded opponents a lot easier, the whistle works a treat on animals and the umbrella is a great defensive tool, with a version that helps a lot against the Headless.

I like that they're not mandatory, but fun to experiment with.

Also, can we talk about how good the

Spoiler

Puppeteer ninjitsu

is?

Spoiler

I use it all the time on NG+ as I have spent most of my money on emblems and I have around 1K of those right now. It's just super cool to see enemies fighting. The animations are amazing and it's great fun to watch stronger enemies pummel entire groups of lesser enemies into oblivion. Using it on gunmen on ledges works great as well. I also like that they commit seppuku after awhile, instead of returning to their normal state.


Spoilered it in case people want to be surprised when they get this. :)

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I've spent an hour this evening trying and dying against the same two mini-bosses in the Reservoir area. The ninja battle is as much as with the camera as with anything else, whereas with the spear guy, I know all his attacks now but I really struggle to react in time and he can kill me in literally two hits.

 

I like the exploration and stealth (got as far as the Sunken Valley area this evening), but, I don't know, I've not had what I would call a particularly enjoyable Friday evening playing video games, which is never something I'd say about the Souls games, or Bloodborne. It really is like hitting your head against a wall, an when I do eventually overcome and obstacle it's more relief I feel, rather than accomplishment. At the moment all that's keeping me playing is my own stubbornness and loyalty, if that's the right word, to From and Miyazaki, as opposed to anything else.

 

I'd honesty rather be playing another game :(

Spoiler

Added by accident.

 

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1 hour ago, Jamie John said:

I've spent an hour this evening trying and dying against the same two mini-bosses in the Reservoir area. The ninja battle is as much as with the camera as with anything else, whereas with the spear guy, I know all his attacks now but I really struggle to react in time and he can kill me in literally two hits.

 

I like the exploration and stealth (got as far as the Sunken Valley area this evening), but, I don't know, I've not had what I would call a particularly enjoyable Friday evening playing video games, which is never something I'd say about the Souls games, or Bloodborne. It really is like hitting your head against a wall, an when I do eventually overcome and obstacle it's more relief I feel, rather than accomplishment. At the moment all that's keeping me playing is my own stubbornness and loyalty, if that's the right word, to From and Miyazaki, as opposed to anything else.

 

I'd honesty rather be playing another game :(

  Hide contents

Added by accident.

 

 

Ninja:

Spoiler

You can get a free deathblow by not going down in the underground passage inmmediately. Walk for a bit, then drop on his head from the hole above him. Fight agressively and parry when you can, Mikiri counter when the kanji flashes.

 

Spear guy: you can get a free deathblow by sticking to the left of the map. Bushes, house, grass, cliff ledge. Then enter the house through the gap and deathblow from behind. Again, Mikiri counter is your friend here, but be sure to parry after you've succesfully done a counter. You'll drain his posture that way without getting hit.

 

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3 hours ago, Vemsie said:

 

Ninja:

  Hide contents

You can get a free deathblow by not going down in the underground passage inmmediately. Walk for a bit, then drop on his head from the hole above him. Fight agressively and parry when you can, Mikiri counter when the kanji flashes.

 

Spear guy: you can get a free deathblow by sticking to the left of the map. Bushes, house, grass, cliff ledge. Then enter the house through the gap and deathblow from behind. Again, Mikiri counter is your friend here, but be sure to parry after you've succesfully done a counter. You'll drain his posture that way without getting hit.

 

 

Ironically, I killed the ninja on my next go after posting and kept on going until I came to the 

Spoiler

Depths area with all the snipers.

 

I'll go back for spear guy another time. I've still got the general at the top of the long staircase to do, too, although I'll need to pick off all of his friends first.

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@Jamie John Have you still not done Lady Butterfly yet? I'd definitely do it before going on if not. It will help in the coming areas to have the increase in attack power you get for beating her. And by now you've probably had a couple of health upgrades, so it won't be too tough.

 

Also if you need a bead or two for another health upgrade, there are some hidden ones you may have missed.

Spoiler

In the area before Lady B there's a panel with a picture on it you can lean against for a secret door. And inside the building behind the battle field just after horse guy, you can climb all the way up and find one in the roof space.

 

That miniboss in the reservoir is a massive pain in the arse though. And it's not essential. Probably worth leaving till later.

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I found that reservoir general really tough. Looking back at the video I recorded of it I was still playing it like BB. If you know his moves, just get up in his face and fuck him up (easier said than done!). But I thought it was a great fight and one of the real highlights of the game for me. 

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2 hours ago, BadgerFarmer said:

@Jamie John Have you still not done Lady Butterfly yet? I'd definitely do it before going on if not. It will help in the coming areas to have the increase in attack power you get for beating her. And by now you've probably had a couple of health upgrades, so it won't be too tough.

 

Also if you need a bead or two for another health upgrade, there are some hidden ones you may have missed.

  Hide contents

In the area before Lady B there's a panel with a picture on it you can lean against for a secret door. And inside the building behind the battle field just after horse guy, you can climb all the way up and find one in the roof space.

 

That miniboss in the reservoir is a massive pain in the arse though. And it's not essential. Probably worth leaving till later.

 

I haven't don't her yet, no, so will give her another go. And I got the second bead that you mentioned but not the first, so thanks for that.

 

Thanks for the encouragement, all. I think I was just being a bit whingy last night.

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Allow me to come a different angle. If you go back in the thread, you'll see me saying things almost word for word you are. This is the absolute hardest bit of the game because of the nature of the arenas, the type of bosses and the amount of health and power you've got. Genuinely gets easier.

 

Make sure you are always getting the jump on minibosses to take out the first health bar. Sometimes you can aggro them and come back if you can't do it right away. Doing two is madness. 

 

You can use the prosthetic very effectively to make things easier, particularly for the minibosses. I took out the Purple Ninja and the resovoir general with judicious use of Oil and the flame barrel. Don't just use the prosthetic either - pellets, sugars, ash et al all help. 

 

If you can't parry (though note sometimes mashing parrying is a half decent tactic as you'll get a few), block. That sword is better than a DS heavy shield. You can still find openings. 

 

You can always chip bosses out. This is typically much much longer than getting in their face, but it's perfectly viable for many bosses. Don't be afraid to run away if you are under pressure, sometimes distances means the bosses only do a subset of their moves, which can be helpful. Unfortunately I think the next two bosses you do are the least likely to fall to this strategy. Though I'd zero upgrades doing LB, which didn't help. 

 

Waterfall strike or whatever you call it is a great option for short openings. Fast and you get two strikes instead of one. 

 

I always found strats for bosses on YouTube rather than working them out myself. It'd have been a million goes otherwise. 

 

But seriously, through this next section it gets easier. You get ninjitsu and more prosthetics and upgrades to them. You'll start to fill your skill tree. You get more health and power, and while the enemies get more powerful to keep pace, its neat never as bad as it is now. There are some great areas and bosses ahead.

 

If I could beat this game as useless as I am, you can too. 

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I had a productive session on this earlier. Boosted my vitality, killed Lady Buttertwat, boosted my attack power and finally took down that Reservoir dickhead with the spear 8-)

 

I'm going to have a go at the general at the top of the staircase and then it's off to the delights of whoever is in the topmost tower.

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