The Boxing Thread

[Stig]

We'll never get Wilder vs AJ whilst neither holds a title but I still think AJ vs Fury happens because it'll make both a fuck ton of money. The titles aren't needed for that fight (although they'd help).

 

I think after Fury batters Wilder again, he fights Usyk for the undisputed crown (AJ ain't beating him in a rematch). Then we wil get AJ vs Fury, there's too much money involved for it not to happen.

 

Fury of course will win though cause he's the best Heavyweight out there.

[Pug]

Joshua would lose quick to Wilder & Fury, and the rematch with Usyk will be a different fight but with the same outcome.

He'll come out all guns blazing and like already mentioned will most likely then get demolished after gassing. There is a chance he could catch and KO Usyk if he comes in heavier and catches him with a peach, but I think Usyk has the defensive movement to make it unlikely.

 

The Klitschko fight was the only time I've seen him look like a champ, but even then this was a Klitschko at the very end of his career with a last big payday fight to retire with.

 

 

 

[Scratchy Bollock]

I think we're not giving AJ enough credit. His CV is impressive and he's actually underrated as a technician. Pretty good footwork and when he lets his hands go, he has impressive hand speed and his combos are very effective. I actually think his performances against both Povetkin and Pulev were more impressive than his win over Vlad, despite not being as entertaining. His win over Whyte has become more impressive over time. There's no shame in losing to an all time great and it certainly doesn't diminish his achievements or his legacy and it's a shame that a loss in boxing has such weight these days. That's the Mayweather effect I suppose.

 

It's a cliche, but styles make fights. I always picked Usyk to beat AJ on points because he's demonstrated the skillset, intelligence and movement to handle fighters with similar styles to AJ. I think Wilder KO's AJ, despite being technically awful, because AJ can get caught and Wilder has ridiculous power.

 

But I've always felt that Fury was quite well suited to AJ and I don't think that fight is anywhere near as one sided as some are making out. Fury has lapses in concentration and I would argue that outside of his fights with Wilder, Vlad and possibly the second Chisora fight, he's always been very inconsistent, and looked pretty mediocre against very poor opposition. No to say that he isn't the most talented out of the bunch, he has all the potential, but It really depends on what type of Fury shows up. And outside of his last fight with Wilder, he's never been a puncher or KO specialist, so I don't think we should start reassessing his power yet, based off one (Undeniably) very impressive performance against Wilder.

[Ry]

Absolute boxing masterclass. And a performance that should go down in history.

 

Watched with some ex boxer pals who though AJ would blow him out within 6. Managed to take some money off them and the bookies. 

 

Now that Hatton fight, fucking travesty. Getting these big undercard fights because of his name alone. Then he gets soundly beat for 6 rounds and gets the decision. Not the first time this has happened with him. There needs to be an enquiry Into that fight and looking at social media with fighters commenting, I'm not alone. 

 

That Castillo KO was worrying as hell. Obviously sky had to cut away and not show the replay as it could have essentially been a snuff movie. The delay and medics in the ring had me thinking the worst and its been a while since I was that worried for a fighter. Glad to hear he is responsive and recovering in hospital. 

[CrichStand]

11 hours ago, Orion said:

Well your just a spanner then and sound like 15 year old hater on twitter.

 

I don't know what Joshua did to upset you so much but fact is he is an all time top 10 British Heavyweight based on what he has achieved in his career. This is'nt fucking Audley Harrison we are talking about. He was beaten by a better fighter tonight but was not humilated or anything against an "absolute monster".  If you honestly think he has a glass jaw, no gas tank and is just a total hype job, jesus christ.

 

 

IMate, you’re the one calling me a spanner! Lol. You clearly haven’t even read my posts properly! I’ve said “Joshua is just not that good”. That’s because he’s not as good as he’s made out to be - an Elite fighter that is the best of his era. The reality is he’s probably the 5th or 6th best heavyweight around at the moment and not on the same level as Fury and Usyk who are Elite, master boxers, and the best of the best.

Joshua will struggle to make the top 10 British Heavyweights of All Time, as he won’t be remembered so fondly after he loses to Usyk twice. Loses to Fury twice. Loses to Wilder twice.......all in devastating fashion.........all the casuals will quickly forget about him and the general public will realise he’s not as good as he’s been made out to be. 
 

And 100% - YES. He has a glass chin, he has no engine and gasses easily, which gets even worse when he’s been clipped. Also, he struggles when he doesn’t dictate the pace of a fight, due to the things I’m listing. You can clearly see these traits in many of his fights but, the best to watch to get a glimpse of it all, would be his 1st fight with Andy Ruiz. Enjoy! Lol.

[Ry]

2 minutes ago, Scratchy Bollock said:

I think we're not giving AJ enough credit. His CV is impressive and he's actually underrated as a technician. Pretty good footwork and when he lets his hands go, he has impressive hand speed and his combos are very effective. I actually think his performances against both Povetkin and Pulev were more impressive than his win over Vlad, despite not being as entertaining. His win over Whyte has become more impressive over time. There's no shame in losing to an all time great and it certainly doesn't diminish his achievements or his legacy and it's a shame that a loss in boxing has such weight these days. That's the Mayweather effect I suppose.

 

It's a cliche, but styles make fights. I always picked Usyk to beat AJ on points because he's demonstrated the skillset, intelligence and movement to handle fighters with similar styles to AJ. I think Wilder KO's AJ, despite being technically awful, because AJ can get caught and Wilder has ridiculous power.

 

But I've always felt that Fury was quite well suited to AJ and I don't think that fight is anywhere near as one sided as some are making out. Fury has lapses in concentration and I would argue that outside of his fights with Wilder, Vlad and possibly the second Chisora fight, he's always been very inconsistent, and looked pretty mediocre against very poor opposition. No to say that he isn't the most talented out of the bunch, he has all the potential, but It really depends on what type of Fury shows up. And outside of his last fight with Wilder, he's never been a puncher or KO specialist, so I don't think we should start reassessing his power yet, based off one (Undeniably) very impressive performance against Wilder.

 

Totally agree on the Fury comment. 

 

There are fans who automatically think Fury schools AJ. AJ would give fury some serious problems. People forget AJ is a technically great fighter. 

 

Fury ain't Invincible like some like to believe, he's fantastic but I still think his resume pales next to what AJ has achieved. 

[Ry]

2 minutes ago, CrichStand said:

IMate, you’re the one calling me a spanner! Lol. You clearly haven’t even read my posts properly! I’ve said “Joshua is just not that good”. That’s because he’s not as good as he’s made out to be - an Elite fighter that is the best of his era. The reality is he’s probably the 5th or 6th best heavyweight around at the moment and not on the same level as Fury and Usyk who are Elite, master boxers, and the best of the best.

Joshua will struggle to make the top 10 British Heavyweights of All Time, as he won’t be remembered so fondly after he loses to Usyk twice. Loses to Fury twice. Loses to Wilder twice.......all in devastating fashion.........all the casuals will quickly forget about him and the general public will realise he’s not as good as he’s been made out to be. 
 

And 100% - YES. He has a glass chin, he has no engine and gasses easily, which gets even worse when he’s been clipped. Also, he struggles when he doesn’t dictate the pace of a fight, due to the things I’m listing. You can clearly see these traits in many of his fights but, the best to watch to get a glimpse of it all, would be his 1st fight with Andy Ruiz. Enjoy! Lol.

 

Genuine question but please tell me the 5 heavyweights above him. 

[CrichStand]

Just now, Ry said:

 

Genuine question but please tell me the 5 heavyweights above him. 

Fury, Usyk - On another level to anyone else in the division. Wilder - he’d windmill Joshua through the ropes. From there I’d pick Parker under Andy Lee to beat him in a rematch. Parker is a VERY good and extremely talented boxer but he’s consistently underperformed and the ref screwed him in the first fight. Think an in shape, motivated, not willing to take a backhander Ruiz would have beat Joshua in the rematch. Whyte could drop him if they were to fight again. David Haye?!?!? Lol.
 

Think when you get to around 4th or 5th best it’s a clear drop in levels and there are a lot of fighters that could potentially beat each other. Joshua is in that group for me. He ain’t ever beating Fury, Usyk or Wilder though and like I say, after those loses he won’t be remembered in the same light. 
 

I think he’s pretty much done now but after losing to Usyk again, if he takes the rematch, he’ll never be the same. Fury will retire him at that point, if that fight ever happens.

[Ry]

Are you drunk? Or just oblivious? 😆

 

I love Parker but Joshua beat him fair and square. Out boxed him for 9 rounds. 

 

Joshua fucking demolished and schooled Ruiz in the rematch in every round. How that makes Ruiz a better fighter than AJ makes no fucking sense. 

 

[Orion]

I've seen it all now. Parker and Whyte above him who he already beat. Plus Ruiz who he handled easily in the rematch. That is just crazy talk from an obviously biased viewpoint.

 

Plus he has a glass chin because he was stopped once in 26 fights....fucking hell.

[Scratchy Bollock]

 

lol judging by the above, I wouldn't take what he's saying too seriously. I mean, Parker and Whyte above AJ is comical levels of bias and of course complete bollocks. 

 

The glass chin thing is also really funny. AJ gets hit clean by one of the all time great punchers in Vlad and gets back up and knocks him out. Hit hard by Povetkin who ate Whyte's soul. And he survived a pretty nasty onslaught from Whyte, who has shown he has a lot of power. The glass jaw reputation seems to have come entirely from his loss to Ruiz. I mean, he can be vulnerable, but that's the nature of heavyweight boxing. Literally the only boxer who so far looks invincible at that weight is Usyk and that's because he can't be hit!

 

The level of vitriol directed at AJ is pretty shocking to be honest and totally unjustified.

 

[Ry]

Some people just have no clue. Which is fine, they can learn. 

 

But talking absolute nonsense deserves nothing by laughter. 

[CrichStand]

28 minutes ago, Scratchy Bollock said:

 

lol judging by the above, I wouldn't take what he's saying too seriously. I mean, Parker and Whyte above AJ is comical levels of bias and of course complete bollocks. 

 

The glass chin thing is also really funny. AJ gets hit clean by one of the all time great punchers in Vlad and gets back up and knocks him out. Hit hard by Povetkin who ate Whyte's soul. And he survived a pretty nasty onslaught from Whyte, who has shown he has a lot of power. The glass jaw reputation seems to have come entirely from his loss to Ruiz. I mean, he can be vulnerable, but that's the nature of heavyweight boxing. Literally the only boxer who so far looks invincible at that weight is Usyk and that's because he can't be hit!

 

The level of vitriol directed at AJ is pretty shocking to be honest and totally unjustified.

 

I clearly said Joshua is on the level of many other heavyweight boxers around the 4th or 5h spot in the world. He’s not on the level of Fury or Usyk. Wilder would sleep him. He’s not as skilled as Parker. Whyte could absolutely beat him in a shootout at this point. 
 

So yeah,  I would have

1. Fury.

2. Usyk.

3. Wilder.

4. Joshua...........but I believe that Parker is more skilled than Joshua and would beat him in a rematch. I also think Ruiz would beat him in a genuine rematch. I also think Whyte has the ability to beat him. Not sure why all these Joshua fans have trouble reading! Hahaha.

 

The only reason Joshua beat Vlad, who was over the hill at that point, is because Vlad got cocky and arrogant (surely not), took his foot off the gas when Joshua was GASSED, let him recover and didn’t finish Joshua when he had the chance. Vlad pretty much threw that fight away.

 

In the Parker fight the ref made sure Parker wasn’t able to fight on the inside otherwise Joshua would have had major problems. 

 

Ruiz smashed Joshua to pieces and made him quit. Funny how in the rematch he was the size of a house, could barely move and threw under 20 punches in some rounds! Joshua may as well have been circling around a traffic cone in that fight, it was a total joke. Let’s just say......cash in hand......and leave it at that!

 

All of this proves my point. All I’ve said is.....JOSHUA IS NOT AS GOOD AS HE’S MADE OUT TO BE. He’s been promoted and publicised and moulded into a highly marketable product, to appeal to a mass market audience and make lots of money for lots of people. He’s essentially a money making machine. Great! One thing he is not though is an Elite level boxer Oran out and out fighting man. He’s good, but not great. Fury and Usyk are great and the best of their era. They’re master boxers and at the very top of their game. 
 

Joshua has no place left to hide. No amount of talking him up is going to help. He’s got to the point of having PROVE with actions, not just words, how good he is against fighters who are the real deal and at the top of the tree. We saw what happened  last night. He looked way out his depth and completely lost. You’ll see it again in the rematch. You’ll see it when he gets smashed by Fury. You’ll see it when Wilder sleeps him. Probably won’t get to that point though. He’ll lose to Usyk in the rematch. Lose twice to Fury and then he’ll retire. 
 

No vitriol at all here, just facts. Talks cheap though, however we’ll see actions soon enough that back up my words 100%!

 

 

[Stoppy2000]

10 minutes ago, CrichStand said:

I clearly said Joshua is on the level of many other heavyweight boxers around the 4th or 5h spot in the world. He’s not on the level of Fury or Usyk. Wilder would sleep him. He’s not as skilled as Parker. Whyte could absolutely beat him in a shootout at this point. 
 

So yeah,  I would have

1. Fury.

2. Usyk.

3. Wilder.

4. Joshua...........but I believe that Parker is more skilled than Joshua and would beat him in a rematch. I also think Ruiz would beat him in a genuine rematch. I also think Whyte has the ability to beat him. Not sure why all these Joshua fans have trouble reading! Hahaha.

 

The only reason Joshua beat Vlad, who was over the hill at that point, is because Vlad got cocky and arrogant (surely not), took his foot off the gas when Joshua was GASSED, let him recover and didn’t finish Joshua when he had the chance. Vlad pretty much threw that fight away.

 

In the Parker fight the ref made sure Parker wasn’t able to fight on the inside otherwise Joshua would have had major problems. 

 

Ruiz smashed Joshua to pieces and made him quit. Funny how in the rematch he was the size of a house, could barely move and threw under 20 punches in some rounds! Joshua may as well have been circling around a traffic cone in that fight, it was a total joke. Let’s just say......cash in hand......and leave it at that!

 

All of this proves my point. All I’ve said is.....JOSHUA IS NOT AS GOOD AS HE’S MADE OUT TO BE. He’s been promoted and publicised and moulded into a highly marketable product, to appeal to a mass market audience and make lots of money for lots of people. He’s essentially a money making machine. Great! One thing he is not though is an Elite level boxer Oran out and out fighting man. He’s good, but not great. Fury and Usyk are great and the best of their era. They’re master boxers and at the very top of their game. 
 

Joshua has no place left to hide. No amount of talking him up is going to help. He’s got to the point of having PROVE with actions, not just words, how good he is against fighters who are the real deal and at the top of the tree. We saw what happened  last night. He looked way out his depth and completely lost. You’ll see it again in the rematch. You’ll see it when he gets smashed by Fury. You’ll see it when Wilder sleeps him. Probably won’t get to that point though. He’ll lose to Usyk in the rematch. Lose twice to Fury and then he’ll retire. 
 

No vitriol at all here, just facts. Talks cheap though, however we’ll see actions soon enough that back up my words 100%!

 

 

You originally said 5th or 6th... You've already moved him up one place! 

[CrichStand]

2 minutes ago, Stoppy2000 said:

You originally said 5th or 6th... You've already moved him up one place! 

Yeah, cause I was thinking off the top of my head, plus it’s difficult to pick for the reasons I’ve mentioned. Believe the hype and Joshua is the modern day Muhammad Ali, the best of the best, an Elite level master boxer, with beastly one punch KO power, who can walk through anyone or put on a masterclass of boxing skill with stunning hand speed, incredible movement and peerless boxing IQ..........just look at his muscles!

 

On the other hand Joshua is a solid boxer, good all rounder but nothing special. He’s around the same level of many other Heavyweight boxers - good but not great. I can see plenty of fighters around the same level beating him, but overall it’s hard to say who would be ranked higher overall. 
 

So yeah, with Usyk or Fury......I can’t see anyone beating them. I would take Fury over Usyk but have always thought Usyk is Fury’s biggest threat. They are the men to beat. I think Wilder is dogshit in terms of boxing ability but the power in his right hand levels everything and puts him above far better boxers. For example, Joshua is a better boxer but he wouldn’t beat Wilder with the power in his right hand. 

 

 

[Orion]

Quote

All I’ve said is.....JOSHUA IS NOT AS GOOD AS HE’S MADE OUT TO BE

 

No you didn't. You have claimed all kinds of total bollocks in every single post about him.  Which your now back tracking on.

 

I can't even be arsed debating your BS anymore. I hope your just trolling and on the wind up because if your actually being serious, fucking hell....

[Escape]

 

[Ry]

OK, New fight 

 

Yes, there might be nut bags who never stepped in a ring. 

 

Anyway..... Which round does Fury win? 

 

 

*personally I have a few quid on fury rounds 4-6. 

 

I'm dru k.... 

[Opinionated Ham Scarecrow]

I can't shake the feeling that Wilder's going to come out swinging and catch Fury early. Hope I'm wrong. Fury has become a lot more likeable recently the big fridge on legs.

[Orion]

1 hour ago, Opinionated Ham Scarecrow said:

I can't shake the feeling that Wilder's going to come out swinging and catch Fury early. Hope I'm wrong. Fury has become a lot more likeable recently the big fridge on legs.

 

Wilder weighed in at 238 lbs. He weighed in at 212 in the first fight and 231 in the 2nd. I think his corner know he has zero chance outboxing Fury. His best and probably only chance is to just come straight at Fury and let his hands go.

 

Fury weighed in at 277. He was 256 in the first fight, 273 in the 2nd. Which looks like he is going to try and walk through Wilder like he did last time. 

 

Could be fireworks for a few rounds this one. I think Fury will win but he might have to survive an early knockdown or two to do it.

[Corrogate]

I think Wilder's gonna bang him. He's top 3 heavyweight - think his mental edge after the second, combined with that fucking sledge hammer right hand is gonna be hardwired. Personally feel the general consensus is the trilogy's a bit boring at this point tbf. Fury's had Joshua on him mind for a hundred million pound fight so he's forgotten about Wilder at some point. All Wilder's been able to think about career wise is Fury. I give him a massive mental edge, and Fury's showing a degree of doubt or lack of enthusiasm same way Joshua did leading into the fight with Usyk.

If Fury does it, fair play, but I'm giving Wilder a 65/35 edge. Hope he does as well - Wilder's punching power's a mad thing to see.
 

[GamesGamesGames]

45 minutes ago, Corrogate said:

think his mental edge after the second...

 

Why would Wilder have a mental edge after the second fight? He was bullied and easily dealt with.

 

He'll always have a puncher's chance, but I'd be surprised at anything beyond a Fury win.

[Corrogate]

Guess you'll be surprised then.

[Matt Defis]

Fury in round 5 I reckon, Usyk and Fury are the only real game out there at the moment I think and then everybody else is a step below. 

 

I don't think AJ will beat Fury, Usyk or Wilder going forward. Fury wins this, beats Whyte as mandatory then fights Usyk after he's dealt with AJ for the second time and one of those becomes undisputed, if it's Fury he'll wipe the floor with AJ and then retire leaving Usyk to clean up the division.

[Smoothy]

Wilder's already complaining about the gloves being used.

In short, he's accepted Fury's "horse-hair-lined" gloves and decided to go back to his Everlast MX gloves, which he implies have a similar thin amount of lining.

 

Quote

‘We had a little situation with the gloves,’ Wilder told 78SportsTV.

‘I already got word of some funny stuff going on in the back of the gloves. ‘When I got into the room I immediately asked about the gloves and was telling them about certain things that happened in the first event with his gloves being funny, how they were bending and folding, even showing certain clips of it. ‘They [NASC officials] said they’ve been around boxing 25, 30 years, everybody feels since they’ve been around it they are some type of expert. But if you haven’t put a glove on and hit someone in the face to understand what type of damage it could do, or how mechanically a glove can work, it’s 25, 30 years down the toilet.

‘You can cut open a glove all day and look inside and still not know what’s going on. What happened was Fury’s glove that he’s chosen, which is the same thing he had last time, had little to no padding. The rest of it was horse hair, we thought horse hair was illegal and out of the question but they said it was [okay], so we said cool. They opened up my glove and my glove padding is at least two to three inches thick. His glove looks like they’ve already been used, already folded, bended, like they’ve been thrown in the trash and got back out and say, ‘we’re gonna reuse these’. My argument was that this is not enough padding in these gloves. They [NASC officials] were trying to convince me the horse hair in the gloves makes up for everything because the horse hair is actually harder than the foam.
 

‘I was telling them they were wrong because the thing about the horse hair is that over time the horse hair can spread, and if it spreads the horse hair gets thinner, that way you only feel that small padding that’s under the horse hair. ‘The man [the NASC official] tried to go on and explain the lining [on the glove] means it [the horse hair] can’t go anywhere. Of course it can’t go down but it can go left to right in the pad. I started to explain to him of course it can’t go down but it can go left to right. You can just put your hands together and the horse hair will start to expand [separate], so now you’ll just have a fist [in your glove], a top secret weapon. I was trying to educate him [the NASC official] on it. One of the guys was trying to say the gloves bend at a 90 degree angle. I had to take my glasses off and look at him so they knew I was real.
 

‘As I started explaining more and we got into it more they said, ‘if you want to be on the same playing field you can wear the same gloves or get another selection of gloves’. I said, ‘okay, let me get my [Everlast] MX’. Everybody knows about the MX, those are puncher’s gloves, when they first came out I was breaking eye socks, breaking wrists, I even broke my hand a couple of times but I think my hand wraps were too tight and I have so much power that all that force was going in one place and cracking my own hands. So I went back to my old MX to be on fair playing ground. We got it all situated. We’re back at it, I’m very happy with what’s going on with the gloves. Since they want little to no padding in the gloves, we’re going to have the same thing and may the best man win.’

 

[GamesGamesGames]

30 minutes ago, Corrogate said:

Guess you'll be surprised then.

 

Maybe. But, as I asked, why do you say Wilder has a mental edge after the second fight?

[Naysonymous]

The weigh in was hilarious.  Fury’s speech was the best bit of swearing I’ve heard in a good long while.  Fence sitting time in saying my opinion is the same as a lot of people, Wilder really only has a punchers chance but when you can punch as hard as Deontay Wilder then it’s a pretty good chance.  

[Faded]

That puncher’s chance is always there but I think it only happens if Tyson is slacking somehow. 
 

If Tyson is properly focussed on this fight and wilder in front of him it doesn’t look too different from the second match. 
 

I suspect he’s already beaten wilder again in his head and that costs him a little bit. I think he still wins, a bit rougher than it has to be. 

[Straps]

Really annoying when you definitely pay for a stream but that stream that you definitely paid for dies inexplicably and then you don't know what to do. Anyone know how to solve this?

 

*edit* Managed to find a solution on the internet to my definitely paid for stream problem.

[Orion]

Thought this might be fireworks, but this is wild.