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The Last of Us Part 2

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Naughty Dog have always had a problem with editing- Uncharted 3 was a profoundly tedious game that should have had a third lopped off- and TLOU just managed to sit at the “epic” side of “epic or overstuffed”. I really hope they’ve not messed it up here.

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I suppose it comes from games being awkwardly paced like movies but being ten times as long. If there was a bit more compartmentalisation of plots they'd flow more like a TV show. Mass Effect 2 was really good at this. 

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16 minutes ago, Moz said:

I suppose it comes from games being awkwardly paced like movies but being ten times as long. If there was a bit more compartmentalisation of plots they'd flow more like a TV show. Mass Effect 2 was really good at this. 

Uncharted 4 did a good job of keeping its chapters at an hour or so’s length, so I hope some of that rubbed off. Tension only works if it’s released now and again.

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6 hours ago, Moz said:

I hear the complaint that the gameplay isn't great in TLOU quite regularly. But they can never seem to articulate why exactly. My first playthrough was on hard and then I did it on survivor (I did the same for remastered). I remember finding it difficult and fiddly for most of my first playthrough but eventually getting to grips with it and getting good at it. It's got that aggressive stealth gameplay of Arkham, where you take out as many as you can until things go South and then reassess on the fly. Combined with the survival horror resource management of Resi or Metro. And it's got some nice organic wrinkles to keep things interesting. I always assumed people who didn't like it were playing it wrong or not enough, but that's probably not fair.

I think with ND games it's often a problem with lack of variety. You've just slowly picked your way through one bunch of goons, then another one appears and nothing about it is significantly different. They can end up feeling like roadblocks, getting in the way of progress. And that's especially a problem with stealth, because it requires patience - the one thing you don't have when you want to get on with it. It's also a very stripped down stealth, which makes sense in the context, but mechanically it just doesn't have the scope for creativity or the unfussy clarity of MGSV. On one hand, that wouldn't work for TLOU, but on the other it does still feel a little primitive.

 

The good news is I think the sequel takes some pretty big steps to sorting these issues. They're nowhere near as prominent as in TLOU or Uncharted 4. 

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On 14/06/2020 at 00:28, Spacehost said:

Naughty Dog have always had a problem with editing- Uncharted 3 was a profoundly tedious game that should have had a third lopped off- and TLOU just managed to sit at the “epic” side of “epic or overstuffed”. I really hope they’ve not messed it up here.

 

TLOU is one of the best paced games I have ever played.

 

It's a masterclass in creating a genuinely moving and compelling interactive narrative.

 

I rarely complete games because I find them too big, but I think ND are masters of pacing this stuff, as I have completed everyone of their games since Uncharted.

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8 hours ago, Moz said:

My real fear for TLOU2 now having read a bunch of opinions is that it makes the Naughty Dog mistake of being 10-25% too long, but leans into the length and ends up being much too long as a result. But then, I won't be forced to play through an exhausting game about violence in the midst of a global pandemic/current political climate in order to write a review in time for the embargo. Lots of writers have touched on it being a gruelling, exhausting game. Those are often the best kind, though there's good gruelling and bad gruelling. If I feel like a game is exhausting me beyond what's comfortable I'll stop for a bit. Sometimes it takes me years to finish a game and it's difficult to gauge the pacing as a result. Is TLOU2 a game that's meant to be played in a few days? Probably not. And yet I probably will.

 

I thought the latest Uncharted games (4 and Lost Legacy) were extremely well paced. The Last of Us was also a masterclass in pacing in my opinion. 

 

This one doesn't feel as tight, it's true, but you only feel it in the last two or three hours tops where it wraps things up. But, by then, if you are not hooked to see what happens, the game has probably lost you much earlier. In my opinion it is not a big negative because of how ambitious it is. I mean, I am willing to forgive more easily a AAA game of that caliber when it takes some incredibly brave narrative risks (and generally pulls them off) instead of settling for something easier and crowd pleasing. 

 

This is by no means a perfect game but then neither was tLoU. All in all, gameplay and story, I think it surpasses the original in many ways.

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2 hours ago, BadgerFarmer said:

I think with ND games it's often a problem with lack of variety. You've just slowly picked your way through one bunch of goons, then another one appears and nothing about it is significantly different. They can end up feeling like roadblocks, getting in the way of progress. And that's especially a problem with stealth, because it requires patience - the one thing you don't have when you want to get on with it. It's also a very stripped down stealth, which makes sense in the context, but mechanically it just doesn't have the scope for creativity or the unfussy clarity of MGSV. On one hand, that wouldn't work for TLOU, but on the other it does still feel a little primitive.

 

The good news is I think the sequel takes some pretty big steps to sorting these issues. They're nowhere near as prominent as in TLOU or Uncharted 4. 


Good post, I think that’s it to some degree. The stories and production are compelling enough to make people keep ploughing on when the gameplay remains quite repetitive. I would personally stop until I wanted to play the game again, but there are lots of reasons someone might have for pushing through to the end.

 

Personally I didn’t really have the issue in TLOU or Uncharted 4 but I remember 2 and 3 feeling like they had a couple of combat bowl sequences too many. 

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I never finished Uncharted 4, it just seemed to go on too long. I’ve just finished UC1 in the remastered collection so I intend to play through those and then pickup 4 again.

 

Currently in Winter on TLOU Remastered on Survivor, the first time I’ve played through it since a couple of play throughs on PS3. The detail in the world is amazing and it only benefits from the harder difficulty. Funny thing is, the Remastered version doesn’t seem any better graphics/FPS wise in my mind (I know it is) than I remember the PS3 version :).

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12 minutes ago, scoobysi said:

Remastered version doesn’t seem any better graphics/FPS wise in my mind (I know it is) than I remember the PS3 version :).

 

Hindsight is 60fps.

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13 minutes ago, scoobysi said:

I never finished Uncharted 4, it just seemed to go on too long. I’ve just finished UC1 in the remastered collection so I intend to play through those and then pickup 4 again.

 

Currently in Winter on TLOU Remastered on Survivor, the first time I’ve played through it since a couple of play throughs on PS3. The detail in the world is amazing and it only benefits from the harder difficulty. Funny thing is, the Remastered version doesn’t seem any better graphics/FPS wise in my mind (I know it is) than I remember the PS3 version :).


Are you playing it with HDR? That makes an enormous difference.

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17 minutes ago, scoobysi said:

I never finished Uncharted 4, it just seemed to go on too long. I’ve just finished UC1 in the remastered collection so I intend to play through those and then pickup 4 again.

 

Currently in Winter on TLOU Remastered on Survivor, the first time I’ve played through it since a couple of play throughs on PS3. The detail in the world is amazing and it only benefits from the harder difficulty. Funny thing is, the Remastered version doesn’t seem any better graphics/FPS wise in my mind (I know it is) than I remember the PS3 version :).

And higher resolution

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And that's the Left Behind dlc done, I deliberately left it until this week to have it fresh in my mind, playing as Ellie, ready for this game on Friday.

 

Bring it on. :D

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Lol it is much better, what I meant was the way your mind plays tricks on you when you look back on older games :D.

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3 minutes ago, Thor said:

And that's the Left Behind dlc done, I deliberately left it until this week to have it fresh in my mind, playing as Ellie, ready for this game in Friday.

 

Bring it on. :D


How long does it take to play through, I might do if I finish TLOU in time?

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Reading reviews of this makes me wonder if it’ll be the second title, in my twenty five years of gaming, that I stop playing because I’m so opposed to the actions of the protagonist. 

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2 hours ago, Len said:

Defo do it, it's great.


Yes I played it on PS3 and thought it was excellent, just wondering whether to do the Remastered version too. I’ll probably run out of time though before TLOU2.

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56 minutes ago, Garibaldi said:

Reading reviews of this makes me wonder if it’ll be the second title, in my twenty five years of gaming, that I stop playing because I’m so opposed to the actions of the protagonist. 


The first being Manhunt?

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57 minutes ago, Garibaldi said:

Reading reviews of this makes me wonder if it’ll be the second title, in my twenty five years of gaming, that I stop playing because I’m so opposed to the actions of the protagonist. 


What was the first?

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10 minutes ago, Moz said:


What was the first?

 

Same as Hitcher. Shadow of the Colossus. 

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2 hours ago, Garibaldi said:

Reading reviews of this makes me wonder if it’ll be the second title, in my twenty five years of gaming, that I stop playing because I’m so opposed to the actions of the protagonist. 

 

I mean, it's got to be Dreamweb, right? Proper dickhead of a protagonist, that one.

  

1 hour ago, Garibaldi said:

 

Same as Hitcher. Shadow of the Colossus. 

 

Oh. Well. I do sort of agree. Poor Colossi. 

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Interesting. I like that feeling of tension between the character and player. It's the sensation that you're doing something you don't want to, but you're so far down a wrong path that you commit to finishing it through desperation.

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13 minutes ago, Lying Cat said:

 

I mean, it's got to be Dreamweb, right? Proper dickhead of a protagonist, that one.

 

 

Interesting example! I loved Dreamweb. The protagonist was unhinged, for sure, but it also felt like he was a pawn of otherworldly forces, whereas the protagonist in SOTC is entirely clear on what he’s doing and why the whole way through. 

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17 minutes ago, womblingfree said:

Hmmm, do I go with SimplyGames and get it a day early or Coolshop and save a couple of quid?

 

You know what to do. 

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Not sure anyone will get it early according to this:

Even if they were dispatched early, Royal Mail are a bit slower these days.

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20 minutes ago, Pug said:

Not sure anyone will get it early according to this:

Even if they were dispatched early, Royal Mail are a bit slower these days.


Shite! We may not even get to play it next weekend. :(

 

£54.99 on the PS Store...

 

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