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Football Thread 2016/17

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2 hours ago, neoELITE said:

Highly technical in Leicester :lol: it's football. He'd never be able to take over a team like Rochdale and make them win the European Cup. 

 

No manager from history could do that in the past, let alone modern football, so I don't really see what this has got to do with anything.

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1 hour ago, neoELITE said:

It's magnificent management to manage the best players and make them play. I could manage Barcelona right now with access to Twitter.

 

People always use that line, especially 606 callers, 'my gran could win with those set of players'. Gerardo Martino didn't. During his time he managed to get so little out of Messi it was more of an achievement than doing otherwise, he wanted Messi on the end of the chances and not creating them as well, so some of the worst of their play was crossing into the box for Messi. Messi still got 28 goals in 31 league games but compared with 50-46 before and 43 in the season after it was a relatively poor for him. They won nothing that season. They were as toothless when Enrique took over before he finally just played all the best players in their best positions and they did the rest. But then they refuse to be subbed off, and you aren't able to rotate enough so the first 11 get knackered and you nearly lose the league. 

 

1 hour ago, neoELITE said:

The Premier League is a much more competitive league than the Bayern Munich league or the Spanish League. Man city have won 4 in 15 games.

 

I think it's just as much that Bayern and Real Madrid/Barcelona (and Juventus in a way) are on a different level to every other European team, whereas our top teams aren't at the moment, and the Champions League reflects that. Arsenal have beaten Bayern, as have City, but one off, not the tie, or group, City fell apart against Real Madrid, and one win aside always look outclassed by Barcelona, Spurs gave up against Dortmund...who they themselves battered Liverpool before miraculously losing. Then Sevilla outclassed Liverpool. 

 

I agree with 'competitive' but not better, the 8th best team in Spain would I think beat the 8th best team in the premier league 8 times out of ten. Over the last few years we've seen Man United be humiliated by Athletico Bilbao and various Europa league European teams. The other teams in La Liga and Bundesliga aren't less good than ours, it's just that their top teams make it appear so. 

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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-38276794?ns_mchannel=social&ns_campaign=bbc_sport&ns_source=facebook&ns_linkname=sport

 

Quote

Two explosions near a football stadium in Istanbul, Turkey, have killed 15 people and injured 69, the government says.

Turkish officials said the blasts, believed to be a car bomb and a suicide bomb, had targeted police officers.

Witnesses heard gunfire after the attack, which happened two hours after fans had left the Besiktas stadium.

 

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People are hammering Stones for his back pass but come on. 99% of the time that is fine.

Vardy's finish was so perfect that it was basically a freak. He was in that vibe.

 

Man city fans seem to be upset that they have a multimillion pound squad and a pretty decent manager and "its all going wrong".

They're doing okay compared to 10, 15, 20 years ago. Spoilt.

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I thought Guardiola would start slow and then by November would steamroll every team, but it's happened the other way around. I don't think he cares about being matched up with other managers in history in terms of comparing success, so won't care for taking a team from nowhere and winning everything and relishing in the achievement of it. He wants all the money and the best people and the best resources (like the best film directors do) to play the kind of football he wants. I think he resents the amount of expectation and pressure put on him, he's all about the day to day intense improvement and excelling, a reporter asking him about 'is the quadruple on?' leads him to say 'what the fuck?' and stare into space for 15 seconds. 

 

Maybe it benefited Guardiola in Germany in terms of the timing of Klopp's end at Dortmund and Tuchel's rejuvenation of that team still being in its earlier stages. But Ancelotti is not finding it as easy, Bayern are currently joint top just ahead on goal difference, and 8 points separating the top 6 makes for a tighter league than ours, which is 13 points. After the same number of games (14), last season Bayern had 7 more points, and were 8 points ahead of the 2nd placed team, and 19 ahead of the 6th placed team. Either all the other teams have got better or Bayern have become less good, or both, and it's made for a more even league. Dortmund are 6th so glamorous teams like RB Leipzig, Hertha Berlin, Hoffenheim, Frankfurt make up 2nd to 5th, while Shalke, Wolfsburg, Bayer Leverkusen and Monchengladbach linger from 9th to 15th.

 

Bayern went on a 19 (!) game winning streak under Guardiola in his first season. He went on a 53 game unbeaten run and Real Madrid are in their own rich vein of form with their club record 35 game unbeaten run, which puts them way ahead in their league, but otherwise it's pretty bunched up, few points separating, certainly more so than ours where Man United signify the split between the top 5 and the rest. 

 

Motd looking at the man city formation and the way the two forwards are are as wide as possible hugging the touchline to allow space for the midfield to push up into so that the team dominates near the opponent's box, then allowing the forwards free reign to go wherever reminds me of the Thierry Henry Guardiola Sky video analysis which is probably the best thing he's done post Barcelona.

 

It amazed me the other day to learn Ramos has 62 (now 63) goals in 492 games for Real Madrid. It averages at about 5 per season. When an offensive midfielder might get 10 a season. John Terry got 66 for Chelsea, too. Yet Jamie Carragher got 4 in 737 games, own goals not counted. So between 1999 and 2013, he scored two goals in 2005 and 2006, and that was it. One goal every 184 games overall. John Terry got a goal for Chelsea every 10 games. That's just... such a vast difference. You think of alllll those games Carragher played, where he doesn't even need to leap high like an Olympian to score the most beautifully directed header, the ball could hit the post, the knee of a defender, deflect, rebound, fall to Carragher who smashes it high into the net. Much maligned Lovren already has 4 goals for Liverpool in 47 games. Sakho has 3. Ferdinand only got 8 for Man United, so I guess Terry and Ramos are just freaks. 

 

wtf are u bored. In limbo at the moment so kind of..

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In 2001, Plymouth Argyle won the third division (now League 2) with 102 points. Our top scorer that season was our centre-half with 11 goals, Graham Coughlan. We scored 71 goals that season. He didn't score more than Steve Bruce but every game he scored in, he scored the winner. He had this weird knack of just appearing in the box from corners and free kicks unmarked. None of our forwards that season made it to double figures. That season was weird too as we beat at least five teams who then immediately sacked their managers. 

 

Mihalovic must have scored a lot for Lazio back in the Football Italia days.

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15 hours ago, neoELITE said:

Highly technical in Leicester :lol: it's football. He'd never be able to take over a team like Rochdale and make them win the European Cup. 

 

 

clough.jpg

 

Ahem, back to back European Cups with Notts Forrest sonny.

 

 

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Notts County were brillo in them 1970s days!

 

angel doesn't know much about football being a Sunderland fan. He thinks the season starts in February and is just 8 games.

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1 hour ago, redbloodcel said:

also if we're framing greatness by bringing tiny teams to greatness then Gary 'The Wizard' Johnson's escapades with Yeovil put him right up there. 

 

Yes.

 

Lower league managers are miles better than these idiots with their £1000 cardigans and trainers. When Peter Reid managed us he paid the gas billl out of his own pocket. He also sold his cup medal to fund it. Legend. 

It still baffles me how Pep is a great manager.

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1 hour ago, redbloodcel said:

 

Not Notts Forest. 

 

I've never been sure if notts forest not an acceptable term for Nottingham Forest, I do know who Cloughy won the leage etc with.

 

Point stands though, form is temporary, class is permanent, and Guardiola is class. He's only been at city 5 minutes and they need a good clear out.

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7 minutes ago, neoELITE said:

 

Yes.

 

Lower league managers are miles better than these idiots with their £1000 cardigans and trainers. When Peter Reid managed us he paid the gas billl out of his own pocket. He also sold his cup medal to fund it. Legend. 

It still baffles me how Pep is a great manager.

 

Who is 'us', who is your team. Oh it's Plymouth, I thought you were northern.

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It's a pretty revolutionary plan to ignore records of consistent success, genuinely innovative tactics, an ability to make teams play football that is as beautiful as any played in the history of the game, and instead judge a manager's worth on whether or not they've paid the gas bill.

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3 minutes ago, nakamura said:

And to look only to the top for brilliance is just as bad.

 

I love Peter Reid (he's got a monkey's heed), but his tactics were basically 'go out there and get on with it lads.'

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Just now, Shimmyhill said:

 

Same as your hero 'arry then!

 

This is very true, trusting your players and not micromanaging them is a valid technique. Most of Harrys former players have nothing but praise for him. There was a good one on ALOTO, Joey Barton story about 'arry. He was raging mad about something, not being in the team or whatever, and stormed into his office. Harry had his feet up on his desk with the Racing channel on, and said 'hiya Joey, take a seat, what can I do for you?'. Totally took the edge out of Barton, no acting the big man, just treated him like an adult. There's a lot to be said for good man management like that.

 

The 2nd bit of the story was about Barton almost chinning Mark Hughes, who he called a complete wanker, tret them like kids and always on his back.

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So..(spoilers)..Chelsea make it 9 league wins in a row. I tried to find other premier league win streaks, it's not that easy, there was one about Spurs winning 6 in a row during the Modric-VDV-Bale years, but 6 wins doesn't seem like something worth remembering. I'm sure Liverpool had some great win streaks over the Rodgers years, it's more exciting than unbeaten runs unless you do it for a season and brand yourself as The Invincibles. I found that Arsenal also had 14 win streak in the early 00s, but can't really find much else. 

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Just seen Snodgrass' pathetic dive which won him the penalty for Hull then run away celebrating after putting it away. The refs need help in cases like this. 5 second replay and he would see he dived and award a yellow. 

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4 hours ago, d ebolenk said:

So..(spoilers)..Chelsea make it 9 league wins in a row. I tried to find other premier league win streaks, it's not that easy, there was one about Spurs winning 6 in a row during the Modric-VDV-Bale years, but 6 wins doesn't seem like something worth remembering. I'm sure Liverpool had some great win streaks over the Rodgers years, it's more exciting than unbeaten runs unless you do it for a season and brand yourself as The Invincibles. I found that Arsenal also had 14 win streak in the early 00s, but can't really find much else. 

 

 

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1 hour ago, Baring said:

Just seen Snodgrass' pathetic dive which won him the penalty for Hull then run away celebrating after putting it away. The refs need help in cases like this. 5 second replay and he would see he dived and award a yellow. 

 

Hopefully, this trial will help eradicate things like this.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/38245174

 

Spoiler

 

 

Quote

Video replays: Referees to use pitch-side monitors at Fifa's Club World Cup

 

Referees will be able to use a pitch-side monitor for the first time to review decisions when the Club World Cup begins in Japan on Thursday. Video assistant referees will review "match-changing" situations before informing the on-field official. The referee will then be able to view footage for some decisions - something not permitted in previous trials.

 

Fifa's chief of technical development Marco van Basten said the move "represents a big step forward". Video assistant referees have been able to assist officials during two international friendlies this year but the Club World Cup represents their first use in Fifa competition. Previous usage has been in what Fifa call a "semi-live" scenario, where the referee was not able to review decisions on a pitchside monitor.

 

Under the live system, on-field referees will still make the final decision in the process but it is hoped video assistant referees will be able to correct clear mistakes in serious incidents. "Ultimately, these tests should prove invaluable in terms of determining whether the processes are sound or whether any further refinements are needed," added Van Basten, a former Netherlands international striker. "At the same time it's important to remember that we are entering somewhat unchartered territory here, given that we are going live for the first time."

 

Fifa intend conducting further live trials in several countries next year. The Club World Cup, which features champion club sides from each of Fifa's six continental confederations, plus the domestic champions from the host nation, begins in Yokohama with Kashima Antlers taking on Auckland City. Europe's representatives Real Madrid play their first fixture on 15 December.

 

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