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Crackdown 3

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My literal first post on the topic that everyone is angrily responding to and quoting specifically mentions online, so why are all these people arguing with me if they agree there's no offline?

Why does everyone think they'll be singleplayer? They didn't mention it at all during the video and it looks like it's supposed to be an online world type game like the Crew or the Division.

Did they mention it in the actual conference that I missed?

Which do you think we'll not have? Completely offline single-player, as per the first two? Or any semblence of a proper campaign, be it online or offline, vis-a-vis your comparisons with Destiny?

Come back with a coherent point and I'll take your silly bet.

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Why does everyone think they'll be singleplayer? They didn't mention it at all during the video and it looks like it's supposed to be an online world type game like the Crew or the Division.

Did they mention it in the actual conference that I missed?

Here is a post referring to "why does everyone think there will be single player", and no mention of offline.

Frankly, I couldn't care less whether single player is online or off, but any post you make referring to the xbox or its games has to be taken with as big a pinch of trolling as Boozy and the PS4...

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Which do you think we'll not have? Completely offline single-player, as per the first two? Or any semblence of a proper campaign, be it online or offline, vis-a-vis your comparisons with Destiny?

Come back with a coherent point and I'll take your silly bet.

Er, all three of those examples say we won't have completely offline singleplayer.

Destiny does have a "proper campaign", just not one people liked.

VV: Did I miss the period in gaming where "singleplayer" became synonymous with "online only"? Because some of these reactions are aghast that I'd dare conflate the two.

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For idiots such as I, could you just explain this sentence, preferably without mentioning the words on, off, line, and combinations thereof:

Why does everyone think they'll be singleplayer?

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Did we miss the period in gaming where "singleplayer" became synonymous with "offline only"?

From what little I've read before about the game, they're looking at drop in, drop out co-op when you're engaged in solo play. Now, if that means it's not single player by a definition you're determined to stick to, then you win a gold star, but it means fuck all to anyone else.

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Did we miss the period in gaming where "singleplayer" became synonymous with "offline only"?

It's synonmyous until Sony say otherwise.

Why are we still feeding the troll? Any good media links for crackdown?

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Did we miss the period in gaming where "singleplayer" became synonymous with "offline only"?

Er, you can play almost all games in singleplayer without needing an always on internet connection. I'm not talking about co-op here.

So what years of the industry did I miss that makes everyone think "singleplayer = online only"?

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My literal first post on the topic that everyone is angrily responding to and quoting specifically mentions it being an online world, so why are all these people arguing with me if they agree there's no offline?

We're going around in circles here.

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No, we're all reacting to the point you're avoiding - the implication that there'll be no single player. It literally matters not if that single player experience is offline or online, as it's possible to have either or.

I mean, literally, you said:

Why does everyone think they'll be singleplayer?

To which I answer: because the previous two games did, and even WITH the heavily implied online aspect of either campaign or multiplayer, it's perfectly possible to have a single-player campaign while online, c.f. Watch_dogs.

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And the solution to bringing down a stronghold from range with a rocket launcher easily killing everyone inside with little to no challenge?

The straightforward approach there is to either make the strongholds themselves more durable than the average building (reinforced bunkers compared to the skyscrapers that dot the landscape), or to add in a requirement that you need to arrest rather than kill the leader/rescue hostages/other such conceit to prevent you just levelling the structure.

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I'm still waiting for answers on where this mythical period where singleplayer meant online only was? I'm fairly sure there is no such connection and people are flailing around because they don't want to admit they're wrong?

I mean, no-one wanted to take me up on my bet, despite Stu saying just that. He's now angrily quoting very select cut-down bits of posts out of context to try and prove himself right, which is childish and kinda pathetic.

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I'm still waiting for answers on where this mythical period where singleplayer meant online only was? I'm fairly sure there is no such connection and people are flailing around because they don't want to admit they're wrong?

I mean, no-one wanted to take me up on my bet, despite Stu saying just that. He's now angrily quoting very select cut-down bits of posts out of context to try and prove himself right, which is childish and kinda pathetic.

I'm trying to get you to explain your point. I'm not selectively quoting you to make a point, I'm asking you to explain yours. I mean, I literally don't understand your point. You can call me childish, or you can have another go at explaining it without quoting the bit about going around in circles.

Where was this period where singleplayer games were online only? Stu? Fry Crayola? Someone?

There was no such specific period, but that's the way we're going, particularly with these current consoles.

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The straightforward approach there is to either make the strongholds themselves more durable than the average building (reinforced bunkers compared to the skyscrapers that dot the landscape), or to add in a requirement that you need to arrest rather than kill the leader/rescue hostages/other such conceit to prevent you just levelling the structure.

It'd work... but my guess is that they don't want to enforce an online only restriction on the game, at least not just yet.

The destruction uses cloud computing, and you can pretty much guarantee that if you're playing over Xbox Live, you're online. If you're playing offline (let's call it hypothetical to keep Johnny off my back here), then there's no destruction, meaning you can't design the game around having it. Introduce it to such a design and you risk it being game breaking. Design to include it, and you greatly increase the design challenge. Maybe they just figured it wasn't worth that effort.

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Why does everyone think they'll be singleplayer? They didn't mention it at all during the video and it looks like it's supposed to be an online world type game like the Crew or the Division.

Well here's the full point, not just the bit you selectively quoted. I'm quite clearly using singleplayer as a synonym for "offline" as shown by the mention that it's online only, like the online only games that I reference.

I thought that would be well understood, given that singleplayer generally never means "online only", and has for the vast majority of the industry meant "offline".

But apparently you and Fry Crayola come from another industry where the sky is purple and singleplayer has always meant online, and got quite annoyed!

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It'd work... but my guess is that they don't want to enforce an online only restriction on the game, at least not just yet.

The destruction uses cloud computing, and you can pretty much guarantee that if you're playing over Xbox Live, you're online. If you're playing offline (let's call it hypothetical to keep Johnny off my back here), then there's no destruction, meaning you can't design the game around having it. Introduce it to such a design and you risk it being game breaking. Design to include it, and you greatly increase the design challenge. Maybe they just figured it wasn't worth that effort.

Yeah, that's the reason I'm assuming for its non-inclusion - that it would require always online and/or that the server load would be painfully high for Microsoft if they had to enable it for every instance of the game, no matter what mode it's in.

I'm still waiting for answers on where this mythical period where singleplayer meant online only was? I'm fairly sure there is no such connection and people are flailing around because they don't want to admit they're wrong?

I mean, no-one wanted to take me up on my bet, despite Stu saying just that. He's now angrily quoting very select cut-down bits of posts out of context to try and prove himself right, which is childish and kinda pathetic.

I think we're mostly ignoring your flailing in the same embarrassed silence we maintained as mywetpants windmilled endlessly in the NX thread. You suggested that the game would have no singleplayer, people (like me) were a little surprised and suggested that we thought the game would have a singleplayer mode, then you argued that what you meant was the game would be online only, to which people said well, yeah, that's quite possible, though no way certain, and now you're getting a bit weird arguing that singleplayer is a synonym for offline play, which it isn't (in exactly the same way that multiplayer isn't a synonym for online play).

I mean yeah, there's very strong links between the two, and I can understand how you could have said one meaning the other, but it was hardly clear-cut to readers in your first post - this isn't us arguing in bad faith, this is you making an unclear argument in the first case. The Destiny example was particularly confusing, because of course that is a game which really does lack a single-player - it's not just online-only. Now, if you'd used, say, Sim City as an example (or actually written 'online only' instead of singleplayer...), that would have been a lot clearer.

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Surely a single player version of the revolutionary cloud based destruction stuff, 20x the power of Xbox One, would mean they'd have to dedicate multiple servers for every player. There's no way they'd do that.

So any single player variant would have to be massively cutdown, less/no destruction, or something else!

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Well here's the full point, not just the bit you selectively quoted. I'm quite clearly using singleplayer as a synonym for "offline" as shown by the mention that it's online only, like the online only games that I reference.

I thought that would be well understood, given that singleplayer generally never means "online only", and has for the vast majority of the industry meant "offline".

But apparently you and Fry Crayola come from another industry where the sky is purple and singleplayer has always meant online, and got quite annoyed!

In Elite Dangerous, you can play single player (Solo Mode) but you have to be online. If you don't consider that to be single player, then we simply have different definitions of the term.

Single player - playing alone.

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I'm fairly sure that we all know what the other person means, this just seems to be willfully pleading ignorance to argue over semantics. There was a bit of confusion over the initial discussion but rather than simply clarify things and move on it seems to have escalated into a bit of a shit show.

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Surely a single player version of the revolutionary cloud based destruction stuff, 20x the power of Xbox One, would mean they'd have to dedicate multiple servers for every player. There's no way they'd do that.

So any single player variant would have to massively cutdown, less/no destruction, or something else!

You could do some clever scaling shit, though to what degree that's feasible I dunno. I like to think not everyone would be wrecking buildings every single second so you'd have a lot of leeway with server allocation, but then the only game I remember playing with such destruction was Rampage, and I spent every single second of that wrecking all the buildings.

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In Elite Dangerous, you can play single player (Solo Mode) but you have to be online. If you don't consider that to be single player, then we simply have different definitions of the term.

Almost all singleplayer games don't require an internet connection always on though - Call of Duty, Assassins Creed, Uncharted, Tomb Raider, Mario, Animal Crossing, Pokemon, Minecraft, Zelda, Metroid, Scalebound, Gears of War, Quantum Break, Forza, GT, Last Guardian, Mass Effect, Dead Space, Mirrors Edge, Watch Dogs, Dark Souls, etc.

Silly me for thinking of those examples and not the one that everyone else was thinking of - Elite Dangerous.

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I'm fairly sure that we all know what the other person means, this just seems to be willfully pleading ignorance to argue over semantics. There was a bit of confusion over the initial discussion but rather than simply clarify things and move on it seems to have escalated into a bit of a shit show.

The problem is, I don't. Whether you can play while on Pluto, or whether the games requires an always on connection, doesn't affect whether there will or will not be a proper single player campaign. If we're having a general moan about the always-on nature of these things? Sure, I can see that. But that's not what he said, because he compared the potential Crackdown 3 single player experience to the razor thin offering of Destiny. I mean, if you bring up Destiny, aren't you implying it's mostly a multiplayer, online game?

Fuck it: Crackdown 3 will have a single player campaign mode to match the depth of the previous two titles, thankfully without zombies. That's all I care about, whether it's online, offline, or requires you to dress as a banana.

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But that's not what he said, because he compared the potential Crackdown 3 single player experience to the razor thin offering of Destiny. I mean, if you bring up Destiny, aren't you implying it's mostly a multiplayer, online game?

Fuck it: Crackdown 3 will have a single player campaign mode to match the depth of the previous two titles, thankfully without zombies.

The previous Crackdown games had a thinner campaign than Destiny! Crackdown was a bunch of enemies standing around and Orbs. Deep is not how I'd describe it.

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