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Kevvy Metal

Kevvy Metal

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, Cyhwuhx said:

 

After 12 months of Horizon and Bloodborne, yes, it is dreadful. I find myself evading combat because it's simply not up to snuff. It's not a fun component. Doesn't make the game itself problematic, which goes to show how much the rest makes up for it. I even like the weapon degradation. Combat is without a doubt the weakest link in this Zelda though.

 

Cool! Whatever, but dreadful? ... dreadful? really? A joke! Playing through the game actively avoiding participating in one of it's strongest elements? A joke! It's like bcass only playing Halo 2 with the Needler all those years ago. No wonder your view point is so skewed and ridiculous. It's not even close to being half-thought out or not fully integrated. It's straight up fun to fight a group of enemies... it's a "core loop" as they say that feels just as good as any other Zelda game. Audio, animation, impact,.. the small reward of seeing the enemy ragdoll in a silly way. It's a straight up joy. 

"Yeah, but this isn't as good as Bloodborne or what I perceive to be the high bar of combat so ... i'll just avoid it" *turns up nose. 

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Kevvy Metal

Kevvy Metal

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, SMD said:

 

I enjoyed Horizon but fuck me the combat has nothing on Zelda.

 

Yeah, the combat in Horizon is great, and systems driven with loads of scope for experimentation...but it's just a totally different.. thing to Zelda and it's approach. They're all really, really good. 

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Fletch

Fletch

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Stanley said:

Any positive impressions on Never Stop Sneakin' before it leaves the sale today? 

 

Very, very repitive and really easy. I tried my hardest to get through it but it's the same old thing repeated. Which is a shame as the idea of the game seems really good but it wasn't built upon or expanded. The theme tune is great though.

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simms

simms

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, Kevvy Metal said:

 

The combat in Zelda BOTW is so above and beyond the description of "dreadful" that yes, it's insulting and utterly ignorant. Insulting to the taste and intelligence of the people who have played the game and mastered it's combat systems and to the people who made it.  

Sure, opinion is all based on impression but fuck me, sometimes. 

 

I think Souls games and others have changed what some expect out of combat so I do think Zelda’s combat is not dreadful but not one it’s strongest elements either.

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Stanley

Stanley

Posted
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12 minutes ago, simms said:

 

I think Souls games and others have changed what some expect out of combat so I do think Zelda’s combat is not dreadful but not one it’s strongest elements either.

If anything it's Wild that has upped the ante and altered my expectations of all other games. The combat is excellent. Combine it with all the other systems all running in unison and it's utterly sublime. 

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Bazjam

Bazjam

Posted
Posted
8 hours ago, Stanley said:

I think it's great that people such as @El Spatula are interested in Switch despite accepting they have little interest in Nintendo's own output. This is exactly what it needs and why games such as Dark Souls, Skyrim, Doom etc. are important.

 

It should be perfectly reasonable to be drawn to the format itself and the other games on there, in the same way that not everyone is buying a PlayStation for Uncharted or an Xbox for Forza and Halo.

Exactly this. I appreciate that Nintendo games are very good, and enjoy playing the odd one every so often, but on the whole they're not my kind of thing. However, having games like Dark Souls and Doom on a handheld makes me absolutely love my Switch.

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Wiper

Wiper

Posted
Posted
6 hours ago, Cyhwuhx said:

 

After 12 months of Horizon and Bloodborne, yes, it is dreadful. I find myself evading combat because it's simply not up to snuff. It's not a fun component. Doesn't make the game itself problematic, which goes to show how much the rest makes up for it. I even like the weapon degradation. Combat is without a doubt the weakest link in this Zelda though.

 

6 hours ago, SMD said:

 

I enjoyed Horizon but fuck me the combat has nothing on Zelda.

 

As this is coming from me it will likely have the opposite effect than I'd like, but I do find myself more in agreement with Cyhwuhx. I certainly wouldn't go so far as to describe the combat in Zelda as dreadful, but I would say it's the weakest major component of the game. It's nicely dynamic thanks to the game's various systems and physics engine meshing together in fun ways, but it's always so easy and slow-paced that I never found it particularly engaging, each skirmish feeling like (not always desirable) punctuation to the game's core focus on exploration.

 

By contrast Horizon is carried by its combat, which is dynamic in spite of the game otherwise being reasonably limited in interaction, and suitably challenging from the off as you have to learn to handle fast, aggressive swarms of enemies from the very start, before scaling up to integrate larger, more deadly creatures, forcing you to master both stealth and combat in concert. The combat/hunting is the meat of the game, the excitement of new encounters the primary reason to keep on going, quite the opposite of Zelda's combat-as-interruption, so it's just as well that they nailed it.

 

But that's just it: while a significant part of the game, combat is not BOTW's focus, and I enjoyed BOTW far more than Horizon overall (10th to 20th favourite game of the year, respectively) because of its far greater dynamism, freedom and sense of scale. BOTW is just a delight to explore, a wonderful open world to immerse yourself in; it doesn't need its combat to be constantly engaging in order to be a great game.

 

In fact, by keeping it simple it allows you to experiment more, try silly things in combat to see if they work, which fits perfectly with the direction of the game as a whole. But taken out of context, as a combat loop alone, I really don't see it standing up to that of most combat-focussed games, and certainly not Horizon. But it shouldn't be expected to!

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MrPogo

MrPogo

Posted
Posted

Only exciting news for me, but I've just ordered a Switch :D £309 with Mario Kart, Mario & Rabbids and a Joycon Comfort Grip from Tesco (let me combine two deals, which was basically "console with Mario & Rabbids plus for grip for an extra tenner" and "console with one of these games for an extra £20"), minus the £35 of Clubcard vouchers I'd been hoarding for ages :P 

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MrPogo

MrPogo

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, ZOK said:

Yeah yeah yeah, what colour joycons did you get is the only thing we care about. :quote:

 

You could only get the double deal on the grey ones :( I’ll have to order some of those yellow buggers at some point :P

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Marlew

Marlew

Posted
Posted
10 hours ago, Stanshall said:

Modern HD bullet hell monstrosity, Danmaku Unlimited 3, is out tomorrow for about ten dollars. Dunno about EU price yet. It's described by @clippa as 'balls hard' though it supposedly has some difficulty adjustments in this release to make it more palatable for noobs.

 

It looks absolutely gorgeous and I can't wait.

 

SCN_4v.png

 

It's already out on the SA store and cost about six quid.

 

My brain feels like melted wax.

 

Exhilarating! 

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Stanley

Stanley

Posted
Posted
3 hours ago, Wiper said:

 

 

As this is coming from me it will likely have the opposite effect than I'd like, but I do find myself more in agreement with Cyhwuhx. I certainly wouldn't go so far as to describe the combat in Zelda as dreadful, but I would say it's the weakest major component of the game. It's nicely dynamic thanks to the game's various systems and physics engine meshing together in fun ways, but it's always so easy and slow-paced that I never found it particularly engaging, each skirmish feeling like (not always desirable) punctuation to the game's core focus on exploration.

 

By contrast Horizon is carried by its combat, which is dynamic in spite of the game otherwise being reasonably limited in interaction, and suitably challenging from the off as you have to learn to handle fast, aggressive swarms of enemies from the very start, before scaling up to integrate larger, more deadly creatures, forcing you to master both stealth and combat in concert. The combat/hunting is the meat of the game, the excitement of new encounters the primary reason to keep on going, quite the opposite of Zelda's combat-as-interruption, so it's just as well that they nailed it.

 

But that's just it: while a significant part of the game, combat is not BOTW's focus, and I enjoyed BOTW far more than Horizon overall (10th to 20th favourite game of the year, respectively) because of its far greater dynamism, freedom and sense of scale. BOTW is just a delight to explore, a wonderful open world to immerse yourself in; it doesn't need its combat to be constantly engaging in order to be a great game.

 

In fact, by keeping it simple it allows you to experiment more, try silly things in combat to see if they work, which fits perfectly with the direction of the game as a whole. But taken out of context, as a combat loop alone, I really don't see it standing up to that of most combat-focussed games, and certainly not Horizon. But it shouldn't be expected to!

Why shouldn't it be expected to? I found the combat in Zelda challenging especially at the start when I only had three hearts, weaker weapons and so on. And even later in the game I never found it a cakewalk.

 

I'm struggling to comprehend why something being simpler automatically makes it poorer or less involved. 

 

The controls work perfectly without any lag so that it always feels as though you're in control timing dodges, melee attacks and parries etc. It always feels fluid and instant. The bow aiming and slowdown works wonderfully as does the extra fine touch and finesse aided by motion controls.

 

It all just works as you'd expect it to regardless of the complex simulation or open world environment. 

 

It really feels now as though people are labouring a point which just isn't there. 

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Kevvy Metal

Kevvy Metal

Posted
Posted
7 hours ago, Stanley said:

Why shouldn't it be expected to? I found the combat in Zelda challenging especially at the start when I only had three hearts, weaker weapons and so on. And even later in the game I never found it a cakewalk.

 

I'm struggling to comprehend why something being simpler automatically makes it poorer or less involved. 

 

The controls work perfectly without any lag so that it always feels as though you're in control timing dodges, melee attacks and parries etc. It always feels fluid and instant. The bow aiming and slowdown works wonderfully as does the extra fine touch and finesse aided by motion controls.

 

It all just works as you'd expect it to regardless of the complex simulation or open world environment. 

 

It really feels now as though people are labouring a point which just isn't there. 

 

Yes, absolutely! Especially on the point that simplicity == worse. Such a backwards way to think about it. 

 

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