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Bloodborne - GOTD edition

MW_Jimmy

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FiveFootNinja

FiveFootNinja

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Good session this morning. Cleared out NoM and opened all the shortcuts, then took on MHOTN and popped him on the 2nd attempt...

Annoying as he's basically really easy except for his AoE insta-kill attack. Feels a bit cheesy but if you stay close and stun lock him he never does it.

Then made my way up to (I think) MWN...

Not actually seen them yet but there was a lot of baby crying and a maternal ghost lady looking longingly into a big room.

I had over 100k in echoes though so I thought I'd cash in and then go back to try and take on E again, managed to drop them on the first go this time...

I'm not 100% sure but they may have glitched for me briefly (video below about 2:55 in), about 50% of the way in I was laying down some heavy damage with Ludwigs and bolt paper and she seemed to go into almost perpetual stun for about 10 seconds. It may have just been a transition to phase 2 or something? Either way, no laser beam attack this time = fairly easy victory.

I need to do a quick sweep of some of the locations I regularly go back to check but I think MWN is the only thing I have open to me now though. Is this near the end game/point-of-no-return?

Also a question for those who have finished/#TeamPlatinum...

I saw a post on Reddit earlier while I was looking for something else which suggested there were multiple endings and you could see them all by backing up your save game and reloading. Is that what you guys have done or have you done multiple complete run throughs to see them all? Not sure I'm going to do a full NG+ run (at least not in the short term) so I'm wondering if it's worth doing to see as much of the story/lore as possible. How many variations are there?

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Broker

Broker

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Ending spoilers:

There are three endings, two normal ones and one special one.

Does anyone who's finished know anything about the Yharnam stone? Is Nate still about to answer whether the secret feature was beast good or sonething to do with this?

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Qazimod

Qazimod

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Well, yeah, because it forced you to; there really is no other way to play the game. Which is my main gripe: what was one of many ways to play a Souls game has now become THE way to play a Souls game. I understand how some may see this is "different", but I see it as narrower.

And again, it only "changed" the way you played because you didn't play that way to begin with. I, however, did.

Every player plays the same way to begin with because the character stats are more or less the same. :P Unless you're going to run around with no clothes on to lower your equip load for an extra bit of agility :P (incidentally, something you don't need to do in Bloodborne because - surprise! - it isn't a Souls game.)

Nah, I used it loads, really. The thing is: regain works very well against regular enemies, but it's completely useless against bosses as they still require Dark Souls' more methodical approach. Another example of how the Soulsian nature of this beast (pun not intended) doesn't seem to gel with Miyazaki's "new" ideas that well.

You used it loads? I thought it was "not very necessary". :P I agree to an extent about bosses, however even then Regain still puts you in a unique "fight or flight" mindset - you've just been hit with a massive attack, have no vials and stand to fight the rest of the battle on a sliver of health, but you could risk it all and go in fighting and give yourself a bit more of a chance. If you're in that situation in Souls you can only hide in a corner with your shield up baiting out moves or whatever.

Don't get me wrong: I love BB's gameplay. As a result, the only thing that felt a bit rough when going back to DS2 was its slower pace. But I genuinely think that Bloodborne could've been a much better game had it either fully departed from its three predecessors or if it embraced its "Dark Souls 3ness" more. It feels stuck in the middle, being a Souls game that features some fun new ideas that haven't been implemented confidently enough.

Fair enough - I think that kind of thing is subjective to a degree, because Bloodborne feels different enough for me to consider it a departure. If it went too far the other way it might descend into character action madness, and nobody wants that :D but to me the fun new ideas are transformative.

Let's be honest here, though: this isn't selling massive numbers because it's doing "something different". It's selling because it's riding the momentum generated by the previous three games and their hardcore following, combined by the fact that PS4 users have been craving a lush, exclusive game for their machine.

Does that take anything away from my point? People put off by Souls want something different. From fans want more From games. And your point only accounts for one audience without thinking that maybe Souls-haters who enjoy BB find it a refreshing change to not worry about invasions in every area, to have a counter animation that's much more intuitive (also - when did Souls games ever limit the amount of parries you could do, or let you pick up more parries from fallen enemies? Oh, they didn't?) All your comment seems to highlight is that Souls fans aren't seeing the bigger picture and can't understand why newcomers can find the gameplay more refreshing.

The fact that both of those opinions have their merit (although I agree with you that I think BB is a better starting point for Souls noobs than any of the other three games) proves my point more than yours, actually :P

Did you read? They don't have merit. They're nuts. Souls experience really isn't a prerequisite for Bloodborne.

The thing I'm trying to discuss though is that it's Souls in more than just appearance and I do think I have given quite some good arguments as to why that has to do with more than just my personal experience of the games. I've played through the game three times in order to unlock the platinum *and* in the hope to find that something that truly sets it apart from its peers.

Three times? I was finding "that something" after about three hours.

I, too, appreciate the "new" things that Bloodborne does, but again: what is it truly doing new? There's a ring in Dark Souls 2 that gives you back some HP for every enemy you slay, for instance; the regain system feels like an evolution of that. And then there's stuff like how in the alpha, Father Gascoigne dies right after uttering "Umbasa!", which seems to indicate that even Miyazaki himself treated this game as a Souls game (Demon's 2, to be more precise). There are more things in the final release that really hint at that.

I think you're kind of missing the bigger picture. Regardless of how you tailor your character, both Souls and Bloodborne establish their gameplay motifs from the start. Souls begins and your roll sucks shit, and the only decent armour is the stuff that slows you down and adds to your equip load, and your parry is so ambiguous that you'll take a while figuring it out, and the closest thing to an agile dodge you have is the neutral backstep. Bloodborne begins and your evasive moves are much better, equip load is never something you have to worry about, the parry is a gunshot so you know the active frames immediately, and those dodges will always be there for you. Both games give you those tools and expect you to work with them, and I've just explained how a game delivers its experience to the player, and both experiences are different enough for Bloodborne to feel new.

Again, don't get me wrong: my criticism over the game's lack of true originality/innovation/identity doesn't detract from my love for it. I really do love Bloodborne. I still read this thread and I ordered the guide after having rinsed the game, FFS. I'm not having this discussion because I feel like everyone should share my slight disappointment over the fact that the jump from the Souls games to BB doesn't feel as substantial to me as the jump from Demon's to Dark was. I'm discussing this because I'm super passionate about this game and I believe that everything worth discussing should be discussed. Discussions like these can influence what Bloodborne 2 might look like, after all.

Yeah, I enjoy the discussion, and I'm genuinely not trying to rile up Souls fans or anything... however, this is a game that I believe people can get into if they don't like Souls. And I think that some of those people will like the game so much that experiencing Souls again would be really offputting because they'd miss all of the stuff I've been talking about over the past few posts. I think Dark Souls 3 will be very interesting because it will challenge what people think a "Souls game" is, and if it turns out to be the dream combination of the two series then I'll say that, sure, Bloodborne is a "Souls game", because the definition will have changed. I just don't think the current definition suits Bloodborne.

Really? Really?

People like you are the reason PR agencies exist and make filthy money :P

Really.

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FiveFootNinja

FiveFootNinja

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Okay, so I was having a bit of an explore and found a door that is opened by the Iron Key I found...

... And there is an area filled with treasures that has got a huge eye/brain thing in which causes super quick frenzy and projectile damage.

I've put on my highest frenzy res gear and managed to get a couple of bits on a suicide run but it's killing me in about 10 seconds. I've tried hiding behind pillars etc... But it only seems to work some of the time. Is it just a case of suicide run a few times to grab stuff because I can't seem to use sedatives/vials quick enough to resist it.

It also looks to me like its hanging over a pit so I don't see a way of attacking it directly.

Any tips?

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Mr Ben

Mr Ben

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Okay, so I was having a bit of an explore and found a door that is opened by the Iron Key I found...

... And there is an area filled with treasures that has got a huge eye/brain thing in which causes super quick frenzy and projectile damage.

I've put on my highest frenzy res gear and managed to get a couple of bits on a suicide run but it's killing me in about 10 seconds. I've tried hiding behind pillars etc... But it only seems to work some of the time. Is it just a case of suicide run a few times to grab stuff because I can't seem to use sedatives/vials quick enough to resist it.

It also looks to me like its hanging over a pit so I don't see a way of attacking it directly.

Any tips?

There is a lever in the level somewhere (my memory is fuzzy on where annoyingly) that you can pull that will make the brain fall into that pit, and then an elevator will appear where those dwarves/children were so you can go down and find the brain (it wont be hostile or cause frenzy). Killing it will give you a rune, but using a certain gesture in front of the big eyeball before hand has a surprisingly good result.

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Mr Ben

Mr Ben

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The area past

mergo's loft middle lamp

gives you some of the most echoes in the game btw. One run can net you something silly like 60k echoes in a few minutes. Use a bold hunters mark and just rinse and repeat if you want to level a bit, or just farm to buy anything you want from the vendor.

Question for those who have done so -

how hard is queen yharnam? I'm at the start of the 2nd layer of the relevant dungeon after just offing the descendant guy (gun parry/visceral attack ftw), and wondering if she is harder than Ebrietas in the defiled chalice (my god what a pain that fight was after her being so easy in the main game) or not.

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Goemon

Goemon

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Thanks Mr Ben, appreciated. I'll do some more exploring then as the direct route is so far getting me no where. Cheers.

Without spoiling too much...

theres a trick to finding the lever, it has something to do with the lifts...

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Majora

Majora

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Finally beat R today, which felt good even though the fight isn't really very enjoyable. I felt the best tactic was to clear the outsides before going in, as if I tried to rush it I just ended up getting swamped.

Onto UV via the proper route which seems like an irritating cunt of a level so far although I've found the next lantern with only a few deaths. I don't like the way I feel rushed along it though.

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Kevvy Metal

Kevvy Metal

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I've last killed R.

..am I meant to be going this way? I know in the Souls games you have to kinda "feel" your way around but..

There's now an area with huge Cthulhu beast things hanging off buildings and "Crimson head" bad guys who rez after they're killed!

Is this kinda the right way or should one be exploring elsewhere?

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Goemon

Goemon

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Question - I told two people about the "safe" location. One of them is now hanging out there, the other is not. What gives?

Are you talking about the young girl?

if you go to where the giant warthog is in the sewer you find a ribbon, which I believe is hers. You basically sent her to her death.

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Colonel Panic

Colonel Panic

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Finally beat R today, which felt good even though the fight isn't really very enjoyable. I felt the best tactic was to clear the outsides before going in, as if I tried to rush it I just ended up getting swamped.

Onto UV via the proper route which seems like an irritating cunt of a level so far although I've found the next lantern with only a few deaths. I don't like the way I feel rushed along it though.

Yeah, R was bullshit. I ended up struggling with one of the later attacks I hadn't seen before on my kill and chugged all my vials. If I hasn't got that kill, it might've been 20 more unsuccessful, unenjoyable attempts. Shit boss.

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K

K

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Ok, I got up to LB, and

I saw a spider on a wall, and obviously I killed it immediately. Then it said something like "That's not very nice, old boy!" and died, leaving a madman's knowledge. Have I just made a colossal boob by killing a friendly NPC?

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DC

DC

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Ok, I got up to LB, and

I saw a spider on a wall, and obviously I killed it immediately. Then it said something like "That's not very nice, old boy!" and died, leaving a madman's knowledge. Have I just made a colossal boob by killing a friendly NPC?

Well

friendly would be stretching it. He is a recurring character in Souls games. I think you just prevented yourself from getting him as a merchant selling things at high prices, so wouldn't sweat it. He is called Patches and will stich you up given the chance.

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Sng

Sng

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Damnit I just killed an NPC by accident. Cathedral Ward.

After the lift with the secret passage where you end up dropping down by the lantern. The thing that's sat there - I killed him by accident. He cried out that he only wanted to help. God damnit.

Did he do anything useful? Is there any way to roll back? I'm guessing not.

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df0

df0

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What do you mean by experience? Everything besides blood vials echoes are "saved" when you die. The Souls-franchise is known for its suicide runs where you run through an area only to pick up an item. Once picked up it is yours, no matter if you survive the suicide run.

Now, if you by experience means point that allows you to level up, then no. When you die, you leave behind a bloodstain on the floor (or an enemy carries it with them). You get one chance per death to get your blood vials echoes back. If you die before you can reclaim those they are lost forever. Blood vials echoes are the only currency in the game (I do not count Insight, that is too advanced for now) and it allows you to level up your character, buy items, upgrade weapons etc. You earn blood vials echoes by defeating enemies and using certain items.

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