Liverpool Football Club Thread

[Gabe]

Get the team more organised and compact?

Edit: To turn that around, what exactly do you think Rodgers will do that he hasn't been able to in 2.5 years?

[SMD]

We had an organised and compact team. Then we struggled to break the opposition down. The solution isn't to go for the opposite style but to tweak what you've got. Otherwise we're wasting another five years and hundreds of millions reshaping the squad again. Meanwhile our youth players suffer.

[dogsout]

So you're saying the players we have are incapable of playing in an organised and compact shape? I guess in a way I sort of agree with you, because the options in the centre of midfield are so resoundingly bad at the moment. But it's not as if this couldn't be rectified by signing a midfielder or two of the right type. The rest of the team absolutely would be able to play in such a manner; of course they would. Do you trust him to spend the money properly in order to fix the problem? I take it you do. I personally don't. Joe Allen is not good enough. Jordan Henderson is not a holding midfielder. Neither is Gerrard. Lucas isn't trusted. I really like the look of Can but he's little more than potential right now. This is perhaps the most important area of the team and it's piss weak. I'm also not expecting Rodgers to alter his style completely - I'm talking about fundamental organisation here. Simple things like not trying to double and triple press the wings when we're in our own third of the pitch. You can't set out with a line as deep as ours usually is and expect to press effectively.

[Guest]

How would your opinions have changed if you'd won the title last year? I mean, you were pretty damn close. Would there still be people calling for his head?

Dogsout, you said you don't believe Rodgers will succeed. Have you always thought that, or were you all geared up for a bus parade last April?

[dogsout]

Gabzy will tell you I still didn't believe with only 3 games to go. There was a point last season when I realised there were fundamental problems with the distance between our lines that made me start to question him for the first time. Obviously the team responded by going on that run. I hope they prove me wrong again.

[Guest]

I hope you lumped all your disbelief on City to win at William Hill's then?

[hmm]

This season's performances would look just as awful regardless of 1st or 2nd place last season, and there'd be just as little patience. There were a few occasions when Man Utd fans called for Ferguson's head in the last decade after all!

I don't think it's purely the fact that we're not top of the table anyway; it's the clueless, anaemic nature of the performances and real lack of any sign of things changing at the moment. We've still literally only played one good game this entire season.

BR needs to be given more time but equally there needs to be some kind of hint of progress before too long. If we stumble to the end of the season looking much like we do now then I'd be starting to agree we need to consider a change.

[Jamin]

The thing that I think is inexcusable is the way BR has changed the team from week to week, dropping players at random, changing formations and for no discernable reason.

I'm thinking of Can - who has looked excellent - no game time for a month. Borini - not the best striker, but mobile and runs channels well - no game time for a month during a period when we've only had Lambert upfront. Lovren preferred to Toure for Man Utd when he had been given a run in the side and had done excellently. Dropping Coutinho/Lallana consistently - both of whom have looked like bright spots this season. Starting the Basel match with 3 holding midfielders and leaving our two most creative midfielders on the bench when we needed a win. Bringing on wingers in the same game whilst simultanously taking over our tall powerful striker. Dropping Mignolet when he did - i.e. for the Man Utd game - when he'd actually done well against Basel in the previous match.

I could go on.

[JohnnyNolan]

Didn't Rafa want to shift Alonso to bring in Gareth Barry?

[Adrock]

Yep, the season after Alonso had a stinker. He then had the best season he could have and left for Real Madrid.

Meanwhile Barry went to man city and did quite well if I recall correctly.

[rjpageuk]

It is completely results oriented for this discussion to be happening after being "thrashed" by Man U 3-0 in a game in which we created more chances and looked more dangerous than we have almost all season (Tottenham aside).

We had more chances in that game than we did the previous year when we won 3-0. More shots on and off target, more corners and more clear goal scoring opportunities (and Man U had less shots, albeit with more on target).

The whole conversation would be different if Sterling or even Balotelli put away some of their chances.

Our defence gifting them a goal is a catastrophic mistake, but their defenders gifting us chances (e.g. the sterling clean through chance) is forgotten about because Sterling didnt score. It is results-oriented thinking. Their defence was at least as bad as ours in that game but unfortunately we couldnt punish them for the mistakes and they did us.

At least in the game vs Man U we created chances and looked like we could score - thats a big improvement over games that have come before. Hopefully we can do the same vs Arsenal.

Some of the comments re: sterling in this thread show a ridiculously short memory too - he is struggling to score at the moment. He has just turned 20! Compare his goal scoring record against any other winger in world football history to see how his goal scoring rate compares at the same age. He is the best prospect we have and deserves the support of the fans.

[Guest]

To be fair, weren't a lot of you guys really excited when Ballotelli was announced? Especially for what was then a low fee of £16mil. I don't think anyone was quite expecting him to have turned out like he has?

Why always you?

[Shimmyhill]

That's made massively worse by the fact he seemed to spend most of the summer saying "Don't worry, we're not doing what Spurs did". To be so massively aware of it and then do it anyway is even worse.

He has done worse than Spurs, spent more and took in less - Spurs made money last season on transfers!

However pre Bale being sold and in the year we had Champs league run we were awesome, proper old fashioned Spurs style but the rest of the league worked out how to stop us and that continues to this day. Plenty said last season you had a lousy defence and keeper so add to that losing chompy & the other teams working out how to play it was inevitable how this season would go.

The test is do you follow Spurs piss poor example of chopping and changing to relive that one glory season or do you stick with him and build a team - we are on our third rebuild in two years and it is no fun at all.

[Gabe]

In part though, the Spurs situation was because AVB had lost the dressing-room and Sherwood was tactically naive. But yeah, money was spent poorly and we've done the same.

[ryodi]

Spurs bought Lloris during all their chopping and changing so at least they knew what they were doing when they bought a goalkeeper. Apart from Soldado's inability to score in the league I can't think of any if their Bale signings being a complete disaster.

[JohnnyNolan]

The Bale money transfers aren't too bad on paper. Lamela and Soldado are the only really big money signings in that window, both of whom it could be argued haven't lived up to what was expected from them.

Lloris was bought the year before at what now appears to be a bargian fee, considering a year later we paid more for Mignolet!

[V3zna]

Spurs bought Lloris during all their chopping and changing so at least they knew what they were doing when they bought a goalkeeper. Apart from Soldado's inability to score in the league I can't think of any if their Bale signings being a complete disaster.

Paulinho? I'd say that one is a flop.

Lamela? Ultimately has not worked out so far for various reasons.

Chiriches? Apparently will be let go when a buyer is found.

Capoue? There seems to be quite a few ahead of him as far as first choice midfielders go.

A lot of these Spurs signings, including Soldado, looked like decent buys and it's not often such a high percentage underachieves for whatever reason. It's no different with Liverpool. People like Moreno, Markovic and Can where all expected to flourish and all have not got going so far.

[Charliemouse]

Spurs made a few bad buys but at least they signed Ericksen with the Bale money, who continues to produce even when he isn't really being played in his correct position.

Solado and Paulinho have been massive flops and Lamela still could turn out to be one as well, but the other signings haven't been dreadful, they just weren't that good in the first place really.

I think Liverpool should have bought 2 or 3 top quality players with the Suarez money and not made the same mistake Spurs did and sign 5 or 6 good players who potentially may be very good players in a year or twos time.

[Stig]

Well by all accounts we tried at least with Sanchez.

[Adrock]

But thats part of the problem too, the club has been beaten to plenty of signings in recent years to rivals every summer.

[Oh Danny Boy]

i think the problem is location (Liverpool ain't a fashionable area) Sanchez said as much that the only reason he chose Arsenal over us is because of London and inability to match the wages offered by most of our rivals, we can't/don't offer £200k+ wages so we have to look at the second tier players, those who a lot to learn/prove, don't forget that Sturridge, Torres and Suarez all fit into that category. I remember a few on here stating that they didn't believe Suarez would ever become a top player. Personally I believe that Markovic, Can and Moreno all have the attributes to make it at this level. We should have bought some experienced heads though as we have had to throw too many players who weren't ready into the deep end.

[Chewylegs]

at the Spurs supporters now saying they didn't waste the Bale money. I'm sorry but only Erikson has been a decent buy, £30m on Lamela and £27m(?) on Soldaldo is a massive waste, just like Lovren and Markovic for us, although they've so far only had half a season to prove themselves.

[Adrock]

Robbie Savage has spoken and he reckons the problem is that the club need to buy a defender.

He is definitely the worst pundit around.

[Kelthink]

at the Spurs supporters now saying they didn't waste the Bale money. I'm sorry but only Erikson has been a decent buy, £30m on Lamela and £27m(?) on Soldaldo is a massive waste, just like Lovren and Markovic for us, although they've so far only had half a season to prove themselves.

Arguing who is worse is...flipping stupid. Not exactly something to pride ourselves on.

Dogsout is bang on, our shape is shocking. At our best under Rafa we were regimented, a nightmare to go up against. Now it's something resembling a 4-year old's scribbling on paper.

[Jamin]

If Emre Can doesn't play tonight I go mad.

[carlito]

i think the problem is location (Liverpool ain't a fashionable area) Sanchez said as much that the only reason he chose Arsenal over us is because of London and inability to match the wages offered by our rivals

This kind of deluded bullshit is why so many people are relishing Liverpool being so gash.

[Timmo]

The only reasons Sanchez chose Arsenal over Liverpool are the fact Arsenal is in the much more desirable London, the wages offered are much higher, Arsenal are a better and more consistent team, the manager is better (and renowned) and his teammates recommended it.

[hmm]

While I really doubt there's any genuine quote from Sanchez saying that, what else is particularly deluded about it? At the end of last season when Sanchez was making this choice I would have thought, certainly for a forward, that we would have been at least as attractive a proposition as Arsenal. We were at that point a wonderful attacking team that nearly won the league and were in the CL next season. I'm sure Sanchez could well have had other reasons but location and wages hardly seem implausible.

[hmm]

Anyway, quibbling over that is a distraction; what we should be discussing is to exactly what degree we're going to get bummed by Bournemouth tonight. My money's on 'extensively'.

[JamesTW]

Arsenal are a better and more consistent team

Well they are now(ish) but not at the time of the transfer