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Dark Souls II - Prepare to Die, Again


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24 minutes ago, Hanzo the Razor said:

The main thought that always occurs to me during The Gutter is "Who the fuck built this and why?". It feels like a big Jenga puzzle. Remove one plank of wood and the whole thing will come crashing down.


Yes - I remember enjoying exploring it far more than PS3 Blight Town, but in retrospect Blight Town has a cast iron (well - rickety plank) reason to exist in the way it does, and where it does. The Gutter does not - it’s just there like that because...?  
 

It’s kind of a perfect example of the difference between the two games really. 

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14 minutes ago, Davros sock drawer said:


Yes - I remember enjoying exploring it far more than PS3 Blight Town, but in retrospect Blight Town has a cast iron (well - rickety plank) reason to exist in the way it does, and where it does. The Gutter does not - it’s just there like that because...?  
 

It’s kind of a perfect example of the difference between the two games really. 

 

I respectfully disagree. The Gutter is clearly one mans lunatic vision. It's incomplete and dilapidated but the framework of a town made entirely of wood is still there. I'm fascinated by how long it has stood considering the state of it's inhabitants.

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1 hour ago, Stanley said:

He must have had the same problem with Bloodborne, Dark Souls III and Sekiro too as he hasn’t released an album since 2007 ;)

 

FROM released too many games so he's only got time for EPs and singles now. 

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1 hour ago, Hanzo the Razor said:

I've no idea. That's just my interpretation of it.


Oh right. Well, I think that kind of proves my point don’t you think? Not that it’s a hill I’m particularly desperate to die on. But to me Blight Town has an obvious visual and narrative reason to exist how and where it does, whereas for the Gutter you kind of had to invent your own reason. And much of Dark Souls 2 is like that. It’s like “Here’s the rickety network of planks bit! Why? Er, I dunno, don’t all souls games have them? A crazy dude built it, there you go” 

 

Can’t believe I’m defending Blight Town! :lol:

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42 minutes ago, Davros sock drawer said:


Oh right. Well, I think that kind of proves my point don’t you think?

 

Not really, no. I like things that make you use your imagination to fill in the blanks. Like Star Wars when it was the only film. There was so much unexplained that you had to fill in with your own imagination. Everything after that diluted that mysteriousness.

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The Gutter is a rickety structure because the shite thrown down the Majula hole is all that the people down there had in order to construct an escape route back up. They eventually gave up and festered down there.

 

The Black Gulch is the gutter of The Gutter, and The Rotten is an amalgamation of all of the lost souls who ventured downwards from The Gutter rather than trying to escape back up towards the light.

 

There actually is some pretty robust lore to both areas.

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58 minutes ago, Hanzo the Razor said:

 

Not really, no. I like things that make you use your imagination to fill in the blanks. Like Star Wars when it was the only film. There was so much unexplained that you had to fill in with your own imagination. Everything after that diluted that mysteriousness.


I don’t think that’s an apt analogy. I’m not making a point about over/explaining vs under-explaining, I’m talking about world building and how that carries its own narrative. There’s still plenty of scope to fill in the blanks with your imagination in DS1’s world design, but it also makes sense at a glance. You can see the structure of Blight Town clinging to the underside of the structure supporting Firelink shrine, and so it automatically feels embedded in the world’s “story” in a way that the Gutter doesn’t, which as I recall is just sort of floating in a black void? 
 

Leaving stuff unexplained is one thing, dumping an area into a game in a disconnected way which needs specific lore to explain (thanks @Stanshall) is another. DS2 fails in this regard, IMO. 

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Where were we... Ah, yes, foggy forest... 

 

Spoiler

Made my way through that area, killed the ghosts and chatted with a head. Killed some lion men in the next bit and rolled through a lot of curse jars. Found the headless body and killed it and found sums other stuff. Chatted with the guy who hates some other guy, then made my way up the hill and killed scorpion lady on the first go. 

 

Into the tomb of Pharos. Interesting area, but a few dead giants and things later and it's time to put a giant wolf down, then join the rat covenant. Upwards into some town like place. Lots of odd stuff to kill but mostly spiders. Taste my flamey spear! I had released the other Smith in a previous area and met her again here and got me a bit sword from one of my great souls and leveled it up. It does a lot of damage. 

 

Anyway, more dead spiders, through the Web and a big spider that meets my new sword and dies. All four souls are now mine. I light the primal bonfire and spend my souls. Back to the shrine of winter and out the other side. Up to the big rainy castle. I fight my way through, have a chat with the queen and the chamberlain, and kill the dragon twins on the first go. Then I find a girl in a cage and a zombie pinned to the door. Odd. I make my way to the Lord's passage (matron) and have a big ruckus with some big Knight. It's a good fight and he's down first time. Then I head downwards into the shrine of someone or other. Meet a singing girl and then come up against some magic users and finally call it a day. 

 

I enjoyed this sequence. 

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Tomb of Pharros was a semi-genius idea but only when the game first came out and the online population was high. You couldn't tell walking through it now, but back then, players could set booby traps all over the place, turning it into a land-mine filled danger zone! 

 

Now, there's maybe 3 doors of interest, the main one being the enemy guarding Santier's Spear. What a weapon! The spin-to-win move is still ridiculous. And back when the durability bug was still in effect, this was the go-to because it has zero durability to begin with. Try it out!

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Just now, Curtis said:

Tomb of Pharros was a semi-genius idea but only when the game first came out and the online population was high. You couldn't tell walking through it now, but back then, players could set booby traps all over the place, turning into a land-mine filled danger zone! 

 

Now there's maybe 3 doors of interest, the main one being the enemy guarding Santier's Spear. What a weapon! The spin-to-win move is still ridiculous. And back when the durability bug was still in effect, this was the go-to because it has zero durability to begin with. Try it out!

Where is it? 

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The spear? Bottom floor. From the bonfire, through the crack, and its the wall on your right. It may need a prompt to open. Big enemy behind the slowly opening door.

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8 minutes ago, Curtis said:

The spear? Bottom floor. From the bonfire, through the crack, and its the wall on your right. It may need a prompt to open. Big enemy behind the slowly opening door.

I'll have a look when I'm on next. 

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On 04/08/2020 at 12:56, Davros sock drawer said:


I don’t think that’s an apt analogy. I’m not making a point about over/explaining vs under-explaining, I’m talking about world building and how that carries its own narrative. There’s still plenty of scope to fill in the blanks with your imagination in DS1’s world design, but it also makes sense at a glance. You can see the structure of Blight Town clinging to the underside of the structure supporting Firelink shrine, and so it automatically feels embedded in the world’s “story” in a way that the Gutter doesn’t, which as I recall is just sort of floating in a black void? 

 

It isn't floating. There's stone floor at the bottom which it's built on.

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One of the things that is odd about this one compared to the first one is how you can have bonfires in rooms with creatures. I've just reached the second bonfire in the Shrine of Amara (iirc) and there are a load of toadstools and one giant one just there emitting weapon breaking shit and blocking the way. There was another room on the way to the spider boss with a bonfire in that just had a load of spiders in that respawned is you used it. I think there are some others too. 

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That's definitely a flaw of the game, I'd say. It exemplifies some of the more trollish design decisions in DS2, like the gank mobs and ambushes and anachronistic platforming. On the other hand, they also give DS2 a different character, slightly more experimental and less bound by established rulesets. I fully accept that's apologism, by the way! 

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1 hour ago, Stanshall said:

That's definitely a flaw of the game, I'd say. It exemplifies some of the more trollish design decisions in DS2, like the gank mobs and ambushes and anachronistic platforming. On the other hand, they also give DS2 a different character, slightly more experimental and less bound by established rulesets. I fully accept that's apologism, by the way! 

Yeah, it's not a deal breaker, just an odd design decision.

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Worst one for me is in Lost Bastille or Sinner's Rise (can't remember which) where there's a couple of archers who immediately start firing when you leave the bonfire. It's like they break an unspoken law, but I'm perverse and kind of like it. 

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Spoiler

So made my way through the rest of the shrine and killed the frog in its onesie and got the key for the gimp. I did a lot of other stuff as well; killed some fire salamanders, tried making an impossible jump before giving up, had a sex change and met the Scottish guy again. Then went into the Undead Crypt. Killed some knights, one with naught but shields, some magic users then found the bonfire in the haunted stone yard and took a break. 

Onwards! 

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So I've been invading people's games but then, to fuck with their minds, helping them out. In Dragon Sanctum I've been destroying statues to make killing the knights easier. One guy was there, with a human summon, and he was clearly struggling, so I ran past them (they ignored me), broke the statues, and then they sort of stood, confused, before dealing with the knights. I think they understood I was there to help. But then, to double fuck their minds, after they'd killed the enemies, I used corrosion mist to damage their armour but not their bodies. Then I jumped in a hole to my death!

 

I invaded a couple of people in The Gutter, then ran around lighting torches and breaking poison statues, even dropping healing items. Helped one guy despite him chasing after me trying to kill me. He saw what I was doing, yet killed me anyway. But I had the last laugh - THOSE TORCHES ARE LIT FOREVER NOW!

 

I also invaded one guy, turned myself into barrels (the hiding spell thing), then followed him around. He seemed pretty confused. At first he took a fighting stance, waiting for the duel, but I just turned on the spot rapidly like some sort of spinning Dervish. Then he ran off and I followed, in barrel form, dancing in the background of his battles. Dude mus thought: WTF?!

 

So anyway, now I need advice:

 

I can't beat Sinh, that dragon boss.

 

I've got a 10+ lightning mace, and I realise he's resistant to lightning, but he's resistant to basically everything. Human and computer NPC summons don't help much. The most I've done is knock down by 60% before dying. He damages weapons. Can't be fought at range. Does massive damage.

 

I only manage about... 80 dmg per hit? Less than triple figures. The DS2 Wiki says I need to be hitting him for 400 damage with each strike. HOW IN THE HELL DO YOU GET 400 PER STRIKE?!?!

 

Any real advice?

 

I mean recommended levels, weapons, armour, etc.

 

I'm soul level 146, but I put most of it into weird stats. Dexterity is 19, and strength less than that. Faith is 45. Maybe I should pump stats into strength?

 

What kind of armour and shield load out?

 

I'm playing on PS3. Anyone with similar soul memory want to co-op this beast? I promise not to do weird shenanigans.

 

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Wish I could help, but on Xbox One. 

 

Anyway... 

 

Spoiler

Made my way through the Undead Crypt and killed the big Knight at the end. Found a zombie king and stole his ring. Went through the door in the woods and through the building afterwards. Released a murderer but not before I agreed to kill the ladder guy. Killed the big dragon at the end and made my way through Dragon Heights, killing everything on the way until I met the ancient dragon who gave me some ashen mist stuff. OK... 

 

No idea where to go so checked a wiki. Of course, go and merge with the giants that stand in odd places. Went through one and found the king, but not a zombie this time. Hacked away at his heel and took him down. Got some king thing. Looking for other statues now. 

 

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Took a break and went to check out the DLC. 

Spoiler

Made my way through the Shulva one, or whatever its called. Had to keep looking those knights very slowly until I, completely by accident, see you could bring them to reality by destroying their coffins. That made it easier. Found a key but didn't use it as went on downwards. Killed some stomping things in the water then made my way downwards. Summoned a couple of helpers and managed to kill the annoying magic Queen. Then... Repeatedly got my arse kicked by the stupid dragon afterwards. Decided to give it a break. 

 

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8 minutes ago, Stanshall said:

Fucking hell. I probably spent 10 hours on that bastard Q. Bravo.

The magic user before the dragon? It wasn't easy, but I'm a tenacious bastard! The dragon, though... Jesus! That's gonna take some doing. 

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That actually makes me feel better, I did all right with that one. I was a pure Faith build so sometimes melted bosses and sometimes questioned where my life was headed. 

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16 minutes ago, Stanshall said:

That actually makes me feel better, I did all right with that one. I was a pure Faith build so sometimes melted bosses and sometimes questioned where my life was headed. 

I've only had three goes at it so far. It just never seems to stop moving to give it a good whack and when it does it does that side breath shit. Just to say, on my second go, I did get it down to about 25% before I got overconfident. 

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