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Nintendo Wii U

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kensei

kensei

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Girahim was as camp as Christmas and a worthy addition to Zelda's freaks and geeks. Skyward Sword was, bar two sections I can think of, great. Plus can we not ruin two threads with miserable fuckers complaining they didn't like it. If I want to read nonsense about the game including "waggle" I know where that thread is, thanks.

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iris

iris

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I bought Skyward Sword and finished it with the gold motion+ controller. It wasn't until later I found out my controller didn't really work. I literally could not do the harp section and the sword fights were a mess. Unfortunately there was no way of telling the difference between a broken controller and a borken game, so I found all the swordplay hateful.

Anybody else had problems with built in motion+? It was almost like it hadn't taken into account the shorter length of the controller, if that would actually make a difference I don't know but that's how it felt.

Anyway, Sonic Racing, is the Wiiu framerate shonky?

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Stolly

Stolly

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I think the point I was trying to make (even if nobody else was) is that Nintendo have for some time been first and foremost fitting their new games to their new controller of the moment, whether its a waggle or a stylus or a balance board or touch screen/dual screen or now a tablet. That makes total sense from one point of view in that to Nintendo the new control method is their key differentiator from the competition. But at a fundamental level, rather than concentrating on making a great game full stop, they've been forced to make a great game that uses Nintendo unique control method A.

The second issue with regard to the wii especially was its fantastic success with simple waggle and balance board games which attracted a brand new audience who weren't particularly looking for games that had depth and that continued to astound even 20 hours in - therefore games like Zelda have (I think) been dumbed down to try and suit the masses.

I appreciate that my earlier comparison with Demons Souls can't be taken too seriously but, if you strip out the on-line elements of Demons Souls, what you have is a game with a hub and 5 beautifully crafted levels/dungeons to explore, find stuff, open up short cuts, and, so long as you keep your wits about you, dispatch relatively easily killed respawning enemies (once you figure them out), with of course several big/huge boss fights along the way. Its Zelda like in many many ways..... but without the (well any :)) hand holding and a much reduced quota of bunnies. And it drips atmosphere from every pore in a way that for sure Skyward Sword didn't.

Jump now to the wii u - please Nintendo for the next Zelda show some bottle and do it first and foremost as a great game.

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DC Lemon

DC Lemon

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I really don't understand the lack of WiiU for Dark Souls 2.

As a multi format - it would be the one to get... Bit if they even do release it months later, it'll be too late

Yeah, was it really worth EA putting out Ass Effect 3 for the Wii U's launch? (The weird thing is, I meant to write 'Mass' Effect 3 but Apple had other autocorrect ideas and it seems wrong to manually change it now.) Same goes for GTA5. Rockstar haven't ruled out a Wii U port, but they haven't started work on it either, so who cares?

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RubberJohnny

RubberJohnny

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But at a fundamental level, rather than concentrating on making a great game full stop, they've been forced to make a great game that uses Nintendo unique control method A.

Hang on, didn't people criticise Nintendo WIi games for not using the Wiimotes functions particularly heavily and just being regular games?

I think listening to Stolly about "the big problem" with Nintendos software (which is always different because they keep getting shot down) is a bad idea.

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iris

iris

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I think the point I was trying to make (even if nobody else was) is that Nintendo have for some time been first and foremost fitting their new games to their new controller of the moment, whether its a waggle or a stylus or a balance board or touch screen/dual screen or now a tablet. That makes total sense from one point of view in that to Nintendo the new control method is their key differentiator from the competition. But at a fundamental level, rather than concentrating on making a great game full stop, they've been forced to make a great game that uses Nintendo unique control method A.

The second issue with regard to the wii especially was its fantastic success with simple waggle and balance board games which attracted a brand new audience who weren't particularly looking for games that had depth and that continued to astound even 20 hours in - therefore games like Zelda have (I think) been dumbed down to try and suit the masses.

I appreciate that my earlier comparison with Demons Souls can't be taken too seriously but, if you strip out the on-line elements of Demons Souls, what you have is a game with a hub and 5 beautifully crafted levels/dungeons to explore, find stuff, open up short cuts, and, so long as you keep your wits about you, you have to dispatch relatively easily killed respawning enemies (once you figure them out), with of course several big/huge boss fights along the way. Its Zelda like in many many ways..... but without the (any :)) hand holding and a much reduced quota of bunnies. And it drips atmosphere from every pore in a way that for sure Skyward Sword didn't.

Jump now to the wii u - please Nintendo for the next Zelda show some bottle and do it first and foremost as a great game.

I agree with you about Zelda but I also think the term 'waggle' has done more to damage Nintendo's reputation that the reality of motion controls which on the whole worked brilliantly. Before it's launch I was concerned about motion controls. I was of the opinion that unless your actions were registered every single time then the console was broken. It would be like pressing a button and nothing happening but then owning a Wii and playing on it a lot I came to realize that it didn't mean it was broken if it didn't register correctly every single time. I accepted it was never going to be like that. And it couldn't be, because obviously you could do things with the controller that couldn't be mapped to motions. Wii Boxing always looked shonky because you could flail about and you boxer wouldn't. But then in a fighting game if you hammer a button track and field style it won't react every time. But it seems more of a failure with motion controls.

With my experience of the Wii there was very little little waggling. Shake the controller to extend a jump with Mario to me was just another input. Going back to the DS version and flipping closed the lid as I shook the machine trying to extend a jump became a thing for me.

Eventually with Motion+ the controller worked pretty much as well as we hoped. Take something like WiiSports Resort. The level of accuracy is pretty incredible. Sword fighting works pretty much perfectly as long as you don't try and break it. I think that's part of it. I think a lot of people didn't like the idea of motion controls and so would try and break it and claim that meant it didn't work. They'd do something the machine had no hope of imitating and claim that meant it was just all waggle.

The Wii controller itself is still an incredible thing. Plug a nunchuk in and it's a very comfortable controller. It's got a pointer and you could even unplug the nunchuk and you've got a NES style controller. But it can also act as a steering wheel. With a microphone in! That rumbles.

So I think anybody who uses the term waggle isn't really being fair.

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Clipper

Clipper

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Apologies for edit but this is the problem I and alot of other people have with "waggle"

I was of the opinion that unless your actions were registered every single time then the console was broken. It would be like pressing a button and nothing happening but then owning a Wii and playing on it a lot I came to realize that it didn't mean it was broken if it didn't register correctly every single time. I accepted it was never going to be like that.

For anything other than social party games like WiiSports I am still of the opinion that the control method is broken if it doesnt register every time. And almost every game failed in this regard.

The Wii controller itself is still an incredible thing. Plug a nunchuk in and it's a very comfortable controller. It's got a pointer and you could even unplug the nunchuk and you've got a NES style controller. But it can also act as a steering wheel. With a microphone in! That rumbles.

This however I agree with 100% it is a superb controller the splitting nunchuk, the pointer, the way it could work with or without nunchuck.

I just dont like the waggle because it was imprecise. Its fine for party/social games like WiiSports but for anything requiring finesse I just dont like it.

Same with Kinect.

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iris

iris

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Apologies for edit but this is the problem I and alot of other people have with "waggle"

For anything other than social party games like WiiSports I am still of the opinion that the control method is broken if it doesnt register every time. And almost every game failed in this regard.

This however I agree with 100% it is a superb controller the splitting nunchuk, the pointer, the way it could work with or without nunchuck.

I just dont like the waggle because it was imprecise. Its fine for party/social games like WiiSports but for anything requiring finesse I just dont like it.

Same with Kinect.

But a button won't react every single time either and we accept that but when it happens with motion controls it is amplified. having said that when we're talking about waggle what games are we talking about because waggle seems to cover all motion controls, even ones that work flawlessly. As I've said, I've done very little gormless waggling on my Wii. It's generally when a game calls for it. A few Mario Party mini games where you have to waggle.

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Stolly

Stolly

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Hang on, didn't people criticise Nintendo WIi games for not using the Wiimotes functions particularly heavily and just being regular games?

I think listening to Stolly about "the big problem" with Nintendos software (which is always different because they keep getting shot down) is a bad idea.

I don't quite understand what you're waffling about :). Your first point sort of agrees with me and your second point is incomprehensible. I freely admit to not buying many games for my wii but at a guess I still bought 15 or 16 wii games. I've also played Phantom Hourglass (pretty good and I finished it) and Spirit Tracks (fricking awful and I couldn't be arsed to finish it). Its not like I'm dissing Nintendo for dissings sake. In fact I'd go so far as to say my gamecube is my second best console ever :)

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iris

iris

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I don't quite understand what you're waffling about :). Your first point sort of agrees with me and your second point is incomprehensible. I freely admit to not buying many games for my wii but at a guess I still bought 15 or 16 wii games. I've also played Phantom Hourglass (pretty good and I finished it) and Spirit Tracks (fricking awful and I couldn't be arsed to finish it). Its not like I'm dissing Nintendo. In fact I'd go so far as to say my gamecube is my second best console ever :)

I too liked the Gamecube. You hear a lot of people saying they liked the Gamecube and yet take away the 'waggle' and the Wii played host to more Gamecube-like software than the Gamecube did. I don't see how people hold the Gamecube in such high regard and yet hate the Wii seemingly because as well as the Galaxy games it also plays host to Carnival Funfair Fuckery Games.

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iris

iris

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Unless you have a shonky controller this isn't true.

If you repeat a button press as the character is in the middle of an animation it won't do anything. That's accepted. With motion controls the same thing looks broken.

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scottcr

scottcr

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I want both, but don't want to spend £20 right now...

I'll probably end up spending it though.

I'm thinking that Neo game is more of the blaster pick up and play I want to play...

They're completely different... I'm naturally more inclined to suggest Trine 2 - but Nanoneoshooty is definitely pretty cool as a pick up and play blaster. Has online leaderboards as well if that floats your boat.

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