Star Wars: The Force Awakens

[Smitty]

You might regret having key plots details and scenes spoiled for you later, that's all I'm saying. A bit of patience and you could go into the film knowing very little and have a more exciting time.

You might want to resist the urge. Some of you have been waiting decades for this.

[TehStu]

So to my earlier point, did they scrub the various games from canon, along with the novels, etc.? Because I thought we were due a new Battlefront, so it'll be interesting if that goes straight to Legend, or if it's considered canon. If KOTOR is now considered Legend, it's unlikely Revan features in VII.

[Jumble Jumble]

I'm surprised that the people who have the most to gain from going fresh into the film are wanting to see all these details about it.

See, if that had been your first post on the subject it would have come across fine. But you put:

So, let me get this right - after waiting many, many years for these films a number of you want to know everything about the plot in advance?

You see the difference in tone there? If not, you probably need to learn a bit about written communication.

Anyway. Yes, I can see how it's incongruous.

I'm looking at the spoilers but it's not for the same reason. Basically I was burned so badly with the prequels that I don't really give a shit. When there are actual spoilers I'll avoid them but for the time being all this speculation is fine by me.

Also, I read the leaked script of Batman Begins and that didn't spoil it for me at all. The script was so boring I'd forgotten it all again by the time the film came out.

You might regret having key plots details and scenes spoiled for you later, that's all I'm saying. A bit of patience and you could go into the film knowing very little and have a more exciting time.

Agreed. Pre-internet, this would have been the only option, and somehow we would have survived it.

[Glasgowchivas]

So to my earlier point, did they scrub the various games from canon, along with the novels, etc.? Because I thought we were due a new Battlefront, so it'll be interesting if that goes straight to Legend, or if it's considered canon. If KOTOR is now considered Legend, it's unlikely Revan features in VII.

I'm not positive on the state of KOTOR regarding canon but the new Storygroup that's been set up to establish what's canon or not has already said they'll cherrypick from the 'Legend' material - characters, planets, aliens, anything - if it suits them.

It's that that gives me hope for Thrawn making an appearence down the line. I might not get him going up against Luke and Co. but he might go up against Boyega and Co.

[makkuwata]

Yeah, it sounds like they're taking more or less a tone of "it's canon unless we contradict it" ala the prequels.

[b00dles]

I do find it a bit strange because I'm fairly sure the Timothy Zahn books were 'meant to be' canon that didn't happen because these three films were never going to get made, so it is a bit odd to know what if ANY of the expanded universe counts at all.

[Glasgowchivas]

I do find it a bit strange because I'm fairly sure the Timothy Zahn books were 'meant to be' canon that didn't happen because these three films were never going to get made, so it is a bit odd to know what if ANY of the expanded universe counts at all.

Until it's confirmed by Lucasfilm, in one of the new books, appears in either 'Rebels' or one of the new films it's not canon; it's nothing more than a vast pool of material that they can pick from as they make a new continuity.

[TehStu]

How about Battlefront 3?

[Davros sock drawer]

I'm looking at the spoilers but it's not for the same reason. Basically I was burned so badly with the prequels that I don't really give a shit. When there are actual spoilers I'll avoid them but for the time being all this speculation is fine by me.

Ditto. In fact I'd go so far as to say I'm not even bothered about avoiding any spoilers.

Actually, back in the day I seem to remember we lapped up every single scrap of info on Return of the Jedi before it was released. We had a book club at school, and every single person in my class ordered the book of the film, ages before we saw it. I also distinctly remember tearing down the stairs after my Mum called up "There's a clip of the new Star Wars film on telly!". I think they showed the Speeder Bike chase or something on Swapshop.

[Glasgowchivas]

How about Battlefront 3?

I thought it was cancelled.

[makkuwata]

KOTOR happened. It's historical fact. It happened a long, long, long, long time ago in a galaxy far, far away, but it happened. They can't take that away from me.

Dance around the Thrawn stuff too.

Other than that, go wild. I love the EU, but in a self aware "this is so dumb and self indulgent" sort of way.

[b00dles]

Until it's confirmed by Lucasfilm, in one of the new books, appears in either 'Rebels' or one of the new films it's not canon; it's nothing more than a vast pool of material that they can pick from as they make a new continuity.

I was convinced that the Zahn books (more than tales of jabba's palace and the bounty hunter one for example) were endorsed by Lucas and written up because he wasn't going to do this trilogy on film.

Ah well, I stand corrected.

Although it also completely makes sense as it would be a bit weird to make a film of those books as all the fans would 'know it' and the actors really wouldn't be able to play the roles as depicted in the books.... then again, I can barely remember what happened in them, apart from Jedi twins.

[TehStu]

I thought it was cancelled.

Nope!

May the Force be with you: Star Wars Battlefront will release for Holiday 2015.

link to tweet from EA

I hope, by then, that they've really got the measure of the PS4/XB1 and that it's a looker. Always enjoyed the Battlefront games so confident it'll be fun, regardless.

[TehStu]

KOTOR happened. It's historical fact. It happened a long, long, long, long time ago in a galaxy far, far away, but it happened. They can't take that away from me.

Aw, shit

Past Star Wars games were considered part of the Star Wars Extended Universe canon, but Disney decided to give the franchise a do-over after purchasing Lucasfilm and LucasArts. As a result, the lore established by the many novels, games, comics and other media beyond the core films and the Clone Wars animated series has been pretty much wiped.

But it’s not all bad news: moving forward, video games won’t be part of the Expanded Universe. Instead, they’ll be part of the core franchise canon.

Gamespot reports Lucasfilm has announced that “all aspects of Star Wars storytelling moving forward will be connected”. A dedicated story group will oversee “all Star Wars creative development”, apparently.

Ongoing Expanded Universe projects, like Star Wars: The Old Republic, will not be folded into the glorious new canon, Lucasfilm confirmed.

The new canon will begin its expansion with upcoming novels and a new animated series, but later on DICE’s Battlefront and the mysterious Star Wars project at Visceral Games will contribute their mite.

So games henceforth will be considered canon.

[makkuwata]

Not again JJ, not again...

[rubberducker]

I was convinced that the Zahn books (more than tales of jabba's palace and the bounty hunter one for example) were endorsed by Lucas and written up because he wasn't going to do this trilogy on film.

Ah well, I stand corrected.

when that book deal was first agreed with Lucasfilm, Zahn had very clear instructions to stay in that immediate time frame after the films. 30 years after was a no no apparently, and it was only when George had had enough during the prequels - that authors were given the ok to go to town in the EU universe. George was done.

but the stories are all Zahn. And whilst they are just about ok (they are the only bit of EU I have read) i would hope that the new films are mining more interesting stories.

[makkuwata]

That's what's so exciting about the talk around this movie...it sounds genuinely good. Not campy "I'll take what I can get" EU good, but good.

I bet it's all a smokescreen now.

[Chocky]

I'll always struggle to call him talented. In an alternate universe he's the guy who made Flash Gordon and nobody has ever heard of.

I think in that alternate universe THX is still seen as a cult sci fi classic and then American Graffitti still got nominated for best picture/director/screenplay. Main difference would have been after 1977 Lucas wouldn't have had to take steps back to run Lucasfilm, ILM etc, made more films in different genres and worked with different people and not been surrounded by 'yes' men. Francis Ford Coppola's notion that the sucess of star wars took a great film maker off the board is pretty understandable. Lucas as a director would be a better story no doubt if Star Wars hadn't been a worldwide smash.

Hopefully in the alt universe we still get Raiders of the Lost Ark

It was his weird 'they should be like the Saturday matinee movies' excuse which I never understood, perhaps in his childhood those Saturday matinee movies were all really badly acted and scripted and actually it's a very faithful 'update' to that style of film. I just think he wasn't actually that good at directing.

This is one of the prequels failings, him going for the old movie serial vibe at the expense of making a film audiences will engage with. One of their many failings!

making a a big budget version of a cheap as chips 1940's serial must have seemed like pretty wacky and very risky proposition back in 1973. so i have monumental respect and awe for his ability to pull that off - and to do so, so very spectacularly.

But if i was stuck in a lift with him - i'd love to know how he originally thought the prequels would be received? he spoke at length when he started them about what a bad writer he was, about how he likes weird medieval play style acting and how the prequels won't have one protagonist - but will be more like a soap opera drama. i'm not joking when i say its like he made them shit on purpose - because that's all he talks about in early interviews. but why? how could that have possibly worked out well?

thats perhaps the biggest mystery in SW universe.

The advantage that he had when making Star Wars was script assistance by Katz & Hyuck who made the film sound normal where it needed to. Doesn't appear that he was questioned much if at all when making I to III hence all the naff dialogue.

[gizmo1990]

but the stories are all Zahn. And whilst they are just about ok (they are the only bit of EU I have read) i would hope that the new films are mining more interesting stories.

Hang on, are there people that don't like Zahn's trilogy!?? I only read them once (when they came out) but they left an extremely positive impression on me. I loved the whole storyline and characters he came up with. Imo he 'got' what everyone loved about Star Wars and ran with it logically.

[Glasgowchivas]

The first three Thrawn books are fantastic, other Zahn stuff, meh. I can take it or leave it. I've never even learned the names of other EU writers because the quality was so bad.

[makkuwata]

Hang on, are there people that don't like Zahn's trilogy!?? I only read them once (when they came out) but they left an extremely positive impression on me. I loved the whole storyline and characters he came up with. Imo he 'got' what everyone loved about Star Wars and ran with it logically.

Yeah, but those stories ended up influencing further authors in an incestious way the same way Lucas fell down his own rabbit hole.

Too good out the gate in each case.

[TehStu]

They did try to rein it in a bit in later books, but too little too late. Obviously IMHO, but you're missing out if you liked that trilogy but have dismissed the rest because EU.

[rubberducker]

Hang on, are there people that don't like Zahn's trilogy!?? Imo he 'got' what everyone loved about Star Wars and ran with it logically.

they were ok. more star trek, than star wars for me.

[JoeK]

Hang on, are there people that don't like Zahn's trilogy!?? I only read them once (when they came out) but they left an extremely positive impression on me. I loved the whole storyline and characters he came up with. Imo he 'got' what everyone loved about Star Wars and ran with it logically.

They were fine. My major gripe with them is his persistence to reuse phrases from the films constantly.

Just to make sure we remembered that we were reading a Star Wars book.

[rubberducker]

The advantage that he had when making Star Wars was script assistance by Katz & Hyuck who made the film sound normal where it needed to. Doesn't appear that he was questioned much if at all when making I to III hence all the naff dialogue.

Star Wars had the advantage not just of that, but of having to be written and rewritten hundreds of times. and somewhere along the way Katz, Hyuck and Coppola suggested that he make the structure like a fairy tale (as this long, wierd alien script (about a princess) was pretty impenetrable) - and that ladies and gentlemen was one of the the most influential story decisions in the history of cinema (Lucas claimed he planned it all along - but the more you read the less true that appears).

The prequels were all first drafts, with virtually no story or character development. and i still haven't forgiven lucas for not planning anakin's motivation to turn into vader until he was deep in the edit of episode 3 (hence those shitty dreams). it was only then i finally conceded to reality and accepted the hero i had had growing up was completely full of shit.

[TehStu]

They were fine. My major gripe with them is his persistence to reuse phrases from the films constantly.

Just to make sure we remembered that we were reading a Star Wars book.

Yeah, the earlier books were terrible for that. Frequent use of "hey, remember that one time in the cantina...", as though there was nothing in the preceding years he could have used as an example. Any of the books with a dramatis personae at the beginning seems to be post "we'd better sort these books out" Lucasfilm, and don't have those silly references.

[makkuwata]

One thing I love about the EU is the use of dumb sounding super weapons.

Sun Crusher/Galaxy Gun/Sky Cannon etc

There's bound to be something like that in the new trilogy and the internet will rage and the internet will forget they're talking about a fiction with Death Stars and Star Destroyers...

[K]

That George Lucas piece: if you read what he actuall said as one lump rather than a bunch of snippets, he's saying that he's not interested in watching the trailer because he prefers to see movies as finished products. Not that he isn't interested in the movie.

I feel a bit sorry for George Lucas here. It's like his ex-wife left him and hooked up with a much younger, more handsome man, who's going to take her to sexual heights she never imagined, and this reporter's stormed up to Lucas and asked him if he's going to the wedding. It's, like, Star Wars ruined Lucas' career and made everyone hate him, and now they've given it to someone else to do properly - leave the guy alone!

[makkuwata]

If only he had billions and billions of dollars and a legacy on par with Lennon/McCartney to console him.

[rubberducker]

I feel a bit sorry for George Lucas here. It's like his ex-wife left him and hooked up with a much younger, more handsome man, who's going to take her to sexual heights she never imagined.

you know what. that is exactly what happened to George Lucas during Return of The Jedi. Marcia hooked up with the architect that was building Skywalker Ranch because George was spending all his time making star wars.

not only that - she took him for a lot of his star wars fortune as well. maybe not surprising he began to resent Star Wars.