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Star Wars: The Force Awakens

Captain Kelsten

By Captain Kelsten
in Film, TV & Radio

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Space Renegade Ulala

Space Renegade Ulala

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Although I get your point, it's not even remotely the same.

There is no reason apart from utter laziness how he sort of tied things up. Why the fuck was there no mention of Chewie saying 'say hi to Yoda cos I was the one who put him on Dagobah and he's a weird green dude, so don't assume he's a big strong bloke or anything' Even putting it in the special editions would have made it more believable that this was 'the story arc' all along.

There's loads of other examples too. I still think that he completely ruined one of the best reveals in family movie cinema with 'I am your father' by making it totally obvious Darth is Luke's dad. If you watch them in order, that bit has no impact at all because you know for the whole of New Hope anyway.

What are you talking about? When does Luke talk to anyone but Ben and R2 about Yoda ever? Why would Chewie say "Rawwarrmamagagghrrrrrrr hrrrrrrrrahr (Oh hey, did I tell you about the time decades ago when I helped a geriatric Jedi sneak off into a tiny rocket ship? If you ever meet this ancient guy who's probably dead like all the other Jedi, don't underestimate him because I totes saw him decapitate some Stormtroopers like it was going out of fashion, bro.)"? There's literally no reason in the world he would other than idle chit chat and pure dumb fan service, which I thought was something most of you lot have been moaning there's too much of anyway?

Man, the films are bad but some of you guys are so fucking mental and touched in the head about it that you just make shit up to whinge about now and it's sad, man. SAD.

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Jumble Jumble

Jumble Jumble

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Why wouldn't Darth Vader recognise C3PO?

Er, because he looks exactly like all the other protocol droids in the universe? Anakin didn't even put the outside bit on did he?

On the other hand presumably he named him as "C3-P0", so if he heard the name I guess he would.

Assuming that C3P0 and R2D2 are registration numbers of some point, that convention stretches to 67,600 droids. I don't know how that's relevant, I was just curious to work it out.

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b00dles

b00dles

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We met Chewie in a backwater bar working as a smuggler. George made Yoda the boss of the Jedi for the entire galaxy.

Galaxies are pretty big. There is no good story reason for them to know each that isn't Lucas masturbating into your face.

Exactly, I might be 'reading to much into it' or what have you but Chewie is with Luke and Han etc when he says he's got to go to Dagobah, which would be quite a logical time for Chewie to mention that he was good chums with Yoda and he flew him there.

Both sides can argue about Lucas being a total incompetent in regards to story telling and/or fans getting too carried away with it being 'just a film' but really, it's just plain stupid. I can't think of any other 6 part movies made (or over seen) by one chap so it's difficult to make a comparison but it would be similar to someone making an Alien movie where it turns out that Hudson made some tests on a pet when he was a kid which resulted in the Alien, or something equally idiotic.

In fact, the only similar thing I can think of is Tolkein's stories which were then turned into films but Mr. Tolkein knows how to make a story and have more believable characters, it actually makes more sense in regards to the elves and what have you and it's also referenced in the LoTR films. If it wasn't just George being a bell-end and actually knowing and having that story in his head since the 70's, he would have mentioned it, there's no reason not to.

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Space Renegade Ulala

Space Renegade Ulala

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Chewie didn't fly him to Dagobah, he just escorted him to a ship. Yoda flew off, met up with Victor Sifuentes on the Blockade Runner, whereupon Obi-Wan hooked up with them and they went back to Coruscant to see what happened at the Jedi Temple. Chewie was on Kashyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyk the whole time oblivious to all of it.

Luke doesn't even tell them he's going to Dagobah (delirious jibber-jabber covered in tauntaun guts notwithstanding), he sneaks off without telling anyone after they leave Hoth. As far as R2 knew till that point, they were going to rendezvous with the rest of the fleet.

Like I said, you guys just make shit up.

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makkuwata

makkuwata

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Galaxies are big places. Chewie was a backwoods outlaw in the original trilogy.

In a story with trillions upon trillions of people Chewie was the one to help Yoda escape the Jedi purge?

It doesn't matter that he didn't mention it in the original trilogy. He didn't mention it because it didn't happen!

**in a greater sense that none of it happened.

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b00dles

b00dles

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Chewie didn't fly him to Dagobah, he just escorted him to a ship. Yoda flew off, met up with Victor Sifuentes on the Blockade Runner, whereupon Obi-Wan hooked up with them and they went back to Coruscant to see what happened at the Jedi Temple. Chewie was on Kashyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyk the whole time oblivious to all of it.

Luke doesn't even tell them he's going to Dagobah (delirious jibber-jabber covered in tauntaun guts notwithstanding), he sneaks off without telling anyone after they leave Hoth. As far as R2 knew till that point, they were going to rendezvous with the rest of the fleet.

Like I said, you guys just make shit up.

OK if that's the official line, then fair enough but it's still fucking stupid, he only put the bit with Kashyyk in as fan service in the first place, there was no need in even having that bit with Chewie at all. There's still massive glaring plot holes in it which Lucas introduced himself, which is just clearly the work of a mental.

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Sponge

Sponge

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Considering Chewie fought alongside Jedis and saw all their force shizzle it's surprising that Han is so dismissive about them in ANH. You'd think that Chewie would have at some point in their friendship said "look Han those Jedi were fucking real, you know, you talk about them like they're some mystical bullshit from thousands of years ago with no evidence to support the stories, but there were hundreds (thousands?) of them 18 years ago. They saved me and loads of my species FFS. Stop being a prick about them."

But no, so Han is all "LOL mystical religion". So it's not surprising he didn't mention Yoda to Luke.

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Smitty

Smitty

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Wow, people trying to make sense of Lucas' dumb prequel bullshit about the whole galaxy revolving around a few characters and planets.

Sorry, it's stupid and shit. As per Mukwatta and boodles you've got the mystery and adventure of the whole galaxy to play with. Lucas reuused stuff because he was lazy but most of all because he was trying to pull the pavlovian triggers that star wars fan boys are so attuned to.

"here's a planet you remember! It'd star wars! Here's a character from before. It's star wars! It turns out x was always linked to y and y was in the original films. It's star wars! Now give me all your money, grognards".

It's lazy and shameless appropriation. It's my beef from first hearing about this new set of sequels - SW fans just want the same old shit again, their standards are pretty low (we want light sabres and ships that make the noise) and they're totally prepared for the studio to give them that.

Why are these people so obsessed with relieving the experience of a set of films they first saw 20 years ago? Isnt it time to get over it?

We met Chewie in a backwater bar working as a smuggler. George made Yoda the boss of the Jedi for the entire galaxy.

Galaxies are pretty big. There is no good story reason for them to know each that isn't Lucas masturbating into your face.

He's not just wanking himself off, he's wanking the fans off. Here's that thing! Clap!

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kensei

kensei

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I always thought that was pretty weird really (Anakin building C3PO). Like I get why you might want to build your own car, but I imagine that when most people set out to build their own car from scratch they don't buy a set of blueprints for a Ford Fiesta and they recreate it piece by piece. Given that those droids are clearly very common, what was the point in Anakin building it, or the incentive for him to have built it? He's got a completely blank canvas and he's chosen to directly replicate something boring as shit. On top of that, what use is a translator to his mum? If she hasn't already learned to speak whatever languages are most common on Tatooine they can't be very important.

He was meant to be fixing loads of robots and machinery for the flying blue jew? It sorta makes sense in that role he'd find some parts of a common droid type and make one of his own. If you are looking for a reason, it's because he was a slave boy that wanted a friend / someone to talk to. This barely raises a tremor on the Star Wars stupid scale.

The fact that the droid he built is actually C3PO does get that needle moving, though.

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SeanR

SeanR

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He was meant to be fixing loads of robots and machinery for the flying blue jew? It sorta makes sense in that role he'd find some parts of a common droid type and make one of his own. If you are looking for a reason, it's because he was a slave boy that wanted a friend / someone to talk to. This barely raises a tremor on the Star Wars stupid scale.

The fact that the droid he built is actually C3PO does get that needle moving, though.

Oh wow, I hadn't thought of it like that, til you posted it!

Man, I wish someone had pointed that out at the time.

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Jumble Jumble

Jumble Jumble

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Wow, people trying to make sense of Lucas' dumb prequel bullshit about the whole galaxy revolving around a few characters and planets.

Sorry, it's stupid and shit. As per Mukwatta and boodles you've got the mystery and adventure of the whole galaxy to play with. Lucas reuused stuff because he was lazy but most of all because he was trying to pull the pavlovian triggers that star wars fan boys are so attuned to.

"here's a planet you remember! It'd star wars! Here's a

I actually really agree with your core point here: Knights of the old Republic felt really Star Wars-y and it had all-new stuff that was just designed to kind of link back to that universe, but without specifically referencing the original trilogy (although I seem to remember you could go to Tatooine?). All that stuff doesn't make it feel like Star Wars, which is why the prequels don't. The "used universe" thing really is enough. Of course, The Force is a key part of the universe, space travel, hyperdrives, planets taking the place of cities in normal fiction - that stuff can stay.

But you've made the point, and you keep making it, and it's nugatory and trite. You made it in February, September and October last year, and again in February, April and May this year. You've made six separate posts referencing the stupid thing where Obi Wan Kenobi's robes became Jedi uniform in the prequels, since the announcement of these new films. Again, very good point, but it's made now.

You're not the only one repeating yourself of course. Before you think I'm singling you out I would like to point out that until it became overwhelming I was telling everyone off for repeating puns too.

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kensei

kensei

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I'm not claiming that being Jewish makes me better placed to detect subtle Jewish stereotypes or slurs in films (although it probably does) but Watto always came across as a lazy Italian stereotype to me, at least as far as his voice was concerned. I've never heard a Jew speak in a voice that sounds anything like Watto's. Which just leaves Watto's selfish, greedy, slave-master personality for viewers to base their interpretations on; the fact that people (including your good self, it seems) might be able to link those traits with being Jewish really bothers me.

The accent is definitely middle eastern. Then he has a long nose, a beard and an odd hat. It's a physical stereotype that is then coupled with the traits you describe that make him a bit problematic. But it's Star Wars so don't take it too seriously. I mean, Sand People?

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Jug McKenzie

Jug McKenzie

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The accent is definitely middle eastern. Then he has a long nose, a beard and an odd hat. It's a physical stereotype that is then coupled with the traits you describe that make him a bit problematic. But it's Star Wars so don't take it too seriously. I mean, Sand People?

I agree with a couple of those observations actually - maybe I just find it hard to believe that even George Lucas would be lazy and unimaginative enough to create a character based on such an unfair and grotesque stereotype. But then again, Jar Jar Binks.

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Sponge

Sponge

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It's lazy and shameless appropriation. It's my beef from first hearing about this new set of sequels - SW fans just want the same old shit again, their standards are pretty low (we want light sabres and ships that make the noise) and they're totally prepared for the studio to give them that.

I just want something that is good. If it has recognisable characters or elements from the original trilogy then great I'm all for that, if not, whatever, either way is fine as long as it's good. The prequels weren't good so they rightly get slated. This is a new set of films by a new set of people with no Lucas controlling or dictating it. I'm willing to give it a chance on that basis alone.

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Space Renegade Ulala

Space Renegade Ulala

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Jar Jar Binks is the protagonist of The Phantom Menace with a clear character arc, and serves as a prime example of white, ruling class elites co-opting native population underclasses into fighting their wars for them, dying in their thousands then placated with empty promises of equality and token representation in the political system. That Jar Jar and his people are then quietly shunted off to the sidelines almost never to be seen again speaks volumes for how racial issues are dealt with both in the Galactic Republic and the real world (is it a coincidence that so many of the systems that split from the Republic are largely entirely non-humans seeking freedom from it?)

As for Watto, it's a very dated Jewish stereotype. Perhaps a more relevant one would have seen him bombing the shit out of helpless Sandwomen and their children while shrugging and saying it was their own fault for being there.

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SeanR

SeanR

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I'm not claiming that being Jewish makes me better placed to detect subtle Jewish stereotypes or slurs in films (although it probably does) but Watto always came across as a lazy Italian stereotype to me, at least as far as his voice was concerned. I've never heard a Jew speak in a voice that sounds anything like Watto's. Which just leaves Watto's selfish, greedy, slave-master personality for viewers to base their interpretations on; the fact that people (including your good self, it seems) might be able to link those traits with being Jewish really bothers me.

The accent is definitely middle eastern. Then he has a long nose, a beard and an odd hat. It's a physical stereotype that is then coupled with the traits you describe that make him a bit problematic. But it's Star Wars so don't take it too seriously. I mean, Sand People?

You meant to suggest it was an Israeli government stereotype rather than a Jewish one there, didn't you? 'Cause if you didn't, well, you know, fuck you.

http://www.mediacoop.ca/blog/norasamaran/2522

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