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Game of Thrones - No Book Chat. NONE. The Books don't exist.


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6 hours ago, Delargey said:

Well, I for one, I'm outraged they dropped penny and her pig.

 

Raging Dany's diarrhoea scene was dropped. Was looking forward to it for 6 years.

 

55 minutes ago, mushashi said:

Given the trajectory of its ever spiralling budget and lack of apparent interest from the 2 blokes in charge in slogging on with it, would dragging it out have been much better? They might have rushed the ending, but a slow lowered budget death could have equally been as bad, given the scope of this series.

 

It was setting records for just how much money you could spunk up the wall on a TV episode at the time.

 

If The Last of Us is a hit, HBO are seriously in danger of painting themselves into a corner with production expectations for their flagship dramas.

 

Shows can change show runners. It's not like they were the sole writers for the show. Just pass it on. Budget would not have been an issue had it still been successful.

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The way HBO seem to do things is give whoever is in charge of creating their shows the creative freedom to do it as they will and if they choose to end it, they will do so, no matter what HBO might prefer from a commercial interest POV. (I'm sure HBO would have equally loved for both Sex and the City and The Sopranos to have continued way past the point they were both ended for example)

 

All the greatest widely acclaimed TV dramas have not gone past 7 years, especially on HBO so 8 years was already pushing the limit. I can understand their rumoured desire to be finished with it and move on to something new and more interesting for them, though they must now be in hiding what with the apparent internet Fatwahs against them :P (they are supposedly hard at work on an adaption of The Three-Body Problem for Netflix)

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6 hours ago, mushashi said:

The way HBO seem to do things is give whoever is in charge of creating their shows the creative freedom to do it as they will and if they choose to end it, they will do so, no matter what HBO might prefer from a commercial interest POV. (I'm sure HBO would have equally loved for both Sex and the City and The Sopranos to have continued way past the point they were both ended for example)

 

All the greatest widely acclaimed TV dramas have not gone past 7 years, especially on HBO so 8 years was already pushing the limit. I can understand their rumoured desire to be finished with it and move on to something new and more interesting for them, though they must now be in hiding what with the apparent internet Fatwahs against them :P (they are supposedly hard at work on an adaption of The Three-Body Problem for Netflix)

 

I think after 7 years actors are entitled to shitloads more pay - it's a SAG thing, I think.

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In terms of how GRRM will / would have ended things, I don't even think he knows. He's described himself as a "gardener" kind of writer, so he has an idea but is no adverse to letting things grow and exploring them, a bit like a D&D campaign. He probably needs a collaborator or much stronger editor to keep him in line.  Like anyone who read Wheel of Time you can tell that Robert Jordan making his wife his editor wasn't a good move and I'm not sure who is supporting / challenging GRRM.

 

I honestly think he'll never finish, I'm not even sure we will see another book.

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I'm amazed people still remember what happened in the last book he wrote. I just have some vague recollections of Tyrian ending up in a circus or some such shit.

 

If he ever does write the next one I hope there's a "Previously On" section with the cliff notes.

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3 hours ago, Captain Novaforce said:

In terms of how GRRM will / would have ended things, I don't even think he knows. He's described himself as a "gardener" kind of writer, so he has an idea but is no adverse to letting things grow and exploring them, a bit like a D&D campaign. He probably needs a collaborator or much stronger editor to keep him in line.  Like anyone who read Wheel of Time you can tell that Robert Jordan making his wife his editor wasn't a good move and I'm not sure who is supporting / challenging GRRM.

 

I honestly think he'll never finish, I'm not even sure we will see another book.

 

There's not a chance another book will appear,

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On 03/12/2021 at 12:41, gizmo1990 said:

I don't know why Martin doesn't enlist help to finish the series. It seems utterly bizarre given the limitless opportunities that huge amounts of money grant. The last I'd read was that he did have organisational help via 2 fan assistants but nothing more than that. I'm not sure how much input the James S Corey writers had, but did the issue with GOT start when they left to do their own thing? Put in perspective, they've just finished their own sprawling series, in quick smart time. And done it very well indeed.

 

The only conclusion I can come to is hubris on Martin's part? Nothing else makes sense given that all he has to do is ask for help. I imagine the publisher is chomping at the bit to give him all the help he could possibly want. I'm sure they now feel very much like HBO did with D and D.


I can’t understand why he hasn’t done this. There must be tonnes of talented authors who would bite his hand off for the chance to write a game of thrones book, and he’s clearly not able to make progress anymore. I guess he’s just not willing to give up control, no matter how uncomfortable the process of continuing is making him. 

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It's hubris. He wouldn't be giving up control, he'd simply be gaining a huge amount of creative force to play with and move things forward. I don't care what anyone says, working with other passionate people, who you respect, and they you, fantastic things can happen. And he can find and have access to those kinds of people. Wealth and power have that effect. His address book must hold the gold standard of literary contacts and connections. I'll throw one out there, Dan Abnett. The guy is a fucking beast. I'm reading his Ghosts series again and the quality of his writing, the pace, the imagination, it's so impressive. Sure I just plucked him out of thin air, but someone like him, who can write at such pace, maybe he'd be interested in collaborating. Someone to push Martin forward, problem solve, invigorate him.

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On 06/12/2021 at 00:07, mushashi said:

The way HBO seem to do things is give whoever is in charge of creating their shows the creative freedom to do it as they will and if they choose to end it, they will do so, no matter what HBO might prefer from a commercial interest POV. (I'm sure HBO would have equally loved for both Sex and the City and The Sopranos to have continued way past the point they were both ended for example)

 

All the greatest widely acclaimed TV dramas have not gone past 7 years, especially on HBO so 8 years was already pushing the limit. I can understand their rumoured desire to be finished with it and move on to something new and more interesting for them, though they must now be in hiding what with the apparent internet Fatwahs against them :P (they are supposedly hard at work on an adaption of The Three-Body Problem for Netflix)

 

HBO cancelled Deadwood after three seasons. The forth was supposed to be the last. They still cancelled it. They were then quite happy to pay for seven seasons of True Blood.

 

HBO are cunts.

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On 07/12/2021 at 10:37, Hanzo the Razor said:

 

HBO cancelled Deadwood after three seasons. The forth was supposed to be the last. They still cancelled it. They were then quite happy to pay for seven seasons of True Blood.

 

HBO are cunts.

 

That was a rights problem between Paramount (the production company) and HBO (who did not have global distribution rights on it). They couldn't come to an agreement and David Milch rejected the compromised 6 episode offer from HBO.

 

https://www.looper.com/153803/we-finally-understand-why-deadwood-was-canceled/

 

Quote

"It seemed to me that some sort of partial order for the show would make it impossible to do anything but superimpose all sort of interpretations that would deprive it of its own emotion," Milch said. 

 

He instead pitched them the movies, which seem to have eventually become a single movie to wrap it up instead.

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  • 3 weeks later...

I was thinking the same when I read this page last night: seems wrong to advise that someone miss out on it entirely because it's some brilliant TV for several seasons, but agreement about the cliff it falls off after that is about as universal as it comes. I was trying to think if there was any stopping point around season 5 or 6 that would feel at all natural. Clearly, it's going to be a bit open-ended, but there must be a better option than seeing it through to the bitter end.

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Well it still holds up as QUALITY TV right through to the final season so it's 100% worth a watch. Personally, although it was clearly a disappointing ending, I never thought it was anywhere near as bad as others have said. It just never reaches the awesomeness as the first 5 or 6 seasons. But that's still a hell of a lot of superb entertainment. 

 

I'll be doing a full rewatch at some point this year as my stepdaughter wants to watch it and she's now old enough. I'm also really excited for the prequel as I loved Fire and Blood when I read it last year.

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5 hours ago, MrPogo said:

Just skip the last series and then make up your own ending.

 

I feel like the cliff edge is some distance prior to S08E01, personally!

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I only watched this last year, was put off by the reviews and the fact it was a fantasy themed show, but despite all that, I'd say it was a definite watch as parts of it are some of the best genre television ever made, but admittedly the bar is fairly low to clear for that sort of praise ;)

 

I get the disappointment about how it ended, but most of the journey is worth experiencing, even if you loath fantasy, it's like the TV equivalent of LotR, another fantasy epic that managed to reach outside the usual devotees of its genre.

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  • 4 weeks later...

It just became too predictable and safe by the last few seasons. Earlier on it was  being quite risky and dark, felt like anything could happen. After season 2-3 (as it became mainstream and iconic) I think they were just too scared to kill off any beloved major characters 

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Oh wow, really? I didn’t get that at all. I wonder if watching it all in very quick succession affected my perception? I’d got the impression that the ending in particular had been widely considered a drop in quality at the time, although that certainly wasn’t my impression. 

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