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The terrifying, never-ending (old) Star Trek thread - new movies and Discovery talk in the other, dedicated threads

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1 hour ago, Jg15 said:

Wind up, surely?

Nope, never rated him. He's good enough to not ruin DS9, but he is wooden. His career appeared to fizzle out after DS9 - he's not good in TV/Film. Don't get me wrong, I'd still get starstruck if I happened to bump into him somehow, he's Captain fucking Sisko after all. But I just don't rate him as an actor.

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3 hours ago, Jg15 said:

Wind up, surely?

 

I rate Sisko as one of my fave Captains alongside Picard, the two are completely different from each other with Sisko being a far more emotional and complex character.

 

I also don't believe anyone who watched Season 4's The Vistor and didn't come away misty eyed, such a well played episode with Brooks, Lofton and Tony Todd as older Jake. Part of the dynamic I liked about Sisko, the fact that he was a single parent and his relationship with his son.

 

I absolutely love DS9- desert island TV show for me until I die. But I have to agree Avery Brooks is poor as an actor. I always cry when I watch The Visitor, having lost both father and son, but it's Tony Todd's performance that is the bedrock of that episode.

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I watched Star Trek: Nemesis today, entirely because of this thread. First time I've watched it for maybe ten years. I still stand by my previous opinion: it is decent, and the even numbered rule still applies.

 

So I offer the following challenge: in the vein of he has not yet sinned can cast the first stone- what does Nemesis do wrong that no other Trek had not already done?

 

And with confidence that nobody will beat that challenge- what were the true reasons as to why Nemesis marked the end of Star Trek for a generation?

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The reason was money - It was released around the same time as the second Lord of the Rings and Harry Potter films, as well as a James Bond movie. Tough competition, so it wasnt exactly a box office smash, but also the director was apparently quite difficult to work with.

https://www.denofgeek.com/movies/star-trek-nemesis/36477/star-trek-nemesis-what-went-wrong

 

Basically Paramount fucked up. That about sums it up.

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12 hours ago, Jg15 said:

he was a single parent and his relationship with his son.

Felt like it was the Crushers 2.0 but actually done right this time.

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9 hours ago, drmick said:

I watched Star Trek: Nemesis today, entirely because of this thread. First time I've watched it for maybe ten years. I still stand by my previous opinion: it is decent, and the even numbered rule still applies.

 

So I offer the following challenge: in the vein of he has not yet sinned can cast the first stone- what does Nemesis do wrong that no other Trek had not already done?

 

And with confidence that nobody will beat that challenge- what were the true reasons as to why Nemesis marked the end of Star Trek for a generation?

Fatigue in the franchise as well played a part.

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1 hour ago, davidcotton said:

Fatigue in the franchise as well played a part.

 

Yeah, I think it was over saturation.

 

Four TV shows nearly all top of one another plus their re-runs, the two newest of which were poor.

 

Four movies right on top of each other as well.

 

Star Wars in prequel ascendancy.

 

The birth of comic book movies.

 

The birth of the Potter franchise.

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I never felt that TNG transitioned well from TV to Movie, certainly not as well as the original trek cast did anyway.

 

The only TNG movie that worked on the big screen for me was First Contact. I think the Borg threat helped elevate it enough (plus we get to see the Defiant actually fighting against the Borg, although she does get nearly destroyed). Generations is ok, Insurrection is an overblown TV movie and Nemesis just felt oddly out of place with the rest (almost like a TNG comic book story including the villan).

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Ha, I wondered when Al would make an appearance. ;)

 

Im really liking this crew now. Space Pinebarrens with Trip and Reed earlier in he season was a nice change of pace. T'Pol has been great too. :)

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1 hour ago, Jg15 said:

I never felt that TNG transitioned well from TV to Movie, certainly not as well as the original trek cast did anyway.

 

The only TNG movie that worked on the big screen for me was First Contact.


Yep, absolutely, though that’s not unique to Trek. There aren’t many TV shows that move well to the big screen. 
The original series did better than most with a 50% hit rate. 

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Avery Brooks was certainly a competent actor, but his performances were often too variable in quality. Obviously a primarily a stage actor, he often struggled to tone it down for the acting style suitable for TV shows of the time, but occasionally just acted bored and phoning it in. With the right direction and script and other factors, he was great though, it’s just a shame he wasn’t more consistently top-tier.

 

Still, DS9 > all other Treks.

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Ah, space butlins ... yay. Oh no, false alarm, episode was actually alright, not a horga'hn in sight. 

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I'm watching Voyager for the first time since the 90s. The pilot isn't bad, even if they struggle to conceal the fact that the Ocampa settlement looks like a shopping centre they had the run of on a Sunday morning. Having some trouble believing that Chakotay just immediately fell into line behind Janeway though, to the point of restraining Torres and siding with Starfleet when she rightfully objects to the order to blow up the Caretaker's array and strand them there.

 

It's nice, proper Trek so far- a quality I've come to appreciate in recent years. Think I'll carry on with the rest of the series.

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I'm watching it at the mo too, on about episode 5, Neelix already annoying me. Some of the stuff with kes is creepier than I remember it. Bob picardo is always good value though, ever since inner space I've thought he was good

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Re: Avery Brooks: I can't say he was a great actor, but I appreciate that he gave odd and unique line readings. He seemed to be a bit of a nutty guy based on some intervews.

 

Re: Enterprise. I haven't seen any Enterprise since it first aired in the UK. I dutifully watched about one and a half seasons, but was immediately disappointed by how grey and boring it was. I had been led to believe it would be more adventurous and colourful than Voyager, which I thought too grey and nice and technobabbly. Enterprise was meant to be a time before phasers and transporters... but in the pilot episode they broke out their new phasers, and then transported Archer, so my heart sank knowing it was just more Voyager with the date changed. Apparently it became more fun and interesting in seasons 3 and 4, but I'd stopped watching (and it was hard to even know where it could be found in UK TV schedules), and apparently it had adopted a continuous plotline so it felt like there was no point jumping in late.

 

You guys are sort of tempting me to buy the blu-ray boxset, but I really don't think I have time to watch such things.

 

It seems that nearly all Star Trek suffers from a "first couple of seasons are rubbish and then it gets good" syndrome.

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I met Brooks at one of the Destination Star Treks.  Will try and dig out my photo with him.

 

I can confirm he is absolutely BONKERS. In a good way, but still :D 

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5 hours ago, SqueakyG said:

Re: Avery Brooks: I can't say he was a great actor, but I appreciate that he gave odd and unique line readings. He seemed to be a bit of a nutty guy based on some intervews.

 

Re: Enterprise. I haven't seen any Enterprise since it first aired in the UK. I dutifully watched about one and a half seasons, but was immediately disappointed by how grey and boring it was. I had been led to believe it would be more adventurous and colourful than Voyager, which I thought too grey and nice and technobabbly. Enterprise was meant to be a time before phasers and transporters... but in the pilot episode they broke out their new phasers, and then transported Archer, so my heart sank knowing it was just more Voyager with the date changed. Apparently it became more fun and interesting in seasons 3 and 4, but I'd stopped watching (and it was hard to even know where it could be found in UK TV schedules), and apparently it had adopted a continuous plotline so it felt like there was no point jumping in late.

 

You guys are sort of tempting me to buy the blu-ray boxset, but I really don't think I have time to watch such things.

 

It seems that nearly all Star Trek suffers from a "first couple of seasons are rubbish and then it gets good" syndrome.


All Trek is on Netflix if you have it, for a lower commitment option.

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41 minutes ago, sprite said:

I met Brooks at one of the Destination Star Treks.  Will try and dig out my photo with him.

 

I can confirm he is absolutely BONKERS. In a good way, but still :D 

 

Was he scat singing and playing piano?

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14 hours ago, Thor said:

Ah, space butlins ... yay. Oh no, false alarm, episode was actually alright, not a horga'hn in sight. 

Or not ... next episode was "We're back on course for Risa ... oh no, we're being diverted", another close call. I managed to catch the opening captains log of the next episode "We're finally at Risa!"  eeeehhhhhh ... 

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The Risa episode is pretty bad from memory, isn't that where..

 

Spoiler

Trip and Malcolm hit it off with two hot alien ladies who turn out to be a couple of ugly alien criminal guys in disguise

 

Glad you are enjoying it on the whole though, I feel a rewatch taking place somewhat soon myself.

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I didn't fully realise it was him that brought a lot of those storylines into it and I loved that moment in the otherwise very silly holosuite episode where he says how racist it was in Vegas at the time. The whole benny Russell episode and subsequent call backs are obviously brilliant too.

 

It's also notable that he's a Shakespearean actor in regards to the comments about his acting, he is perhaps a bit "stage " acting at times which is at odds to pretty much everyone else's delivery. Aside from, at times, Patrick Stewart's so that all makes sense. I can't for a moment agree he's a bad actor though and I'd imagine some of his lines would have probably come off even worse if he wasn't a theatrical actor originally. 

 

There are times that he seems a little frustrated with what he's doing too (as an actor) and I can totally understand that too. It is a shame that he and the rest of the cast didn't get a movie based send off as hinted at in that den of geek piece either. 

The final episode of ds9, even though it does have an extended look back for various characters did seem like it was setting up for some sort of revisit. 

 

Picard visiting the prophets and sisko via the wormhole would be a novelty element of the new show but that definitely won't happen I'm sure. 

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I’ve just realised I’ll be very upset if O’Brien doesn’t make an appearance on Picard at some point.

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1 hour ago, makkuwata said:

I’ve just realised I’ll be very upset if O’Brien doesn’t make an appearance on Picard at some point.

Maybe if JLP gets arrested for something his cell mate could be O'Brien and they spend the episode reminiscing about the past.

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9 minutes ago, Thor said:

That Enterprise S1 finale ... Oh boy. :lol:

Are there as many scenes in the porno chamber as I remember? Memory tells me it was very overused. Usually for T'Pol, strangely.

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14 minutes ago, Papaya Dance said:

Are there as many scenes in the porno chamber as I remember? Memory tells me it was very overused. Usually for T'Pol, strangely.

Porno chamber ... are you referring to decontamination where they all strip down to their underwear? About three times. 

 

The fact those scenes stuck in your mind so vividly says more about you. /T'Pol. 

 

Edit: That said, there sure were some scenes that had T'Pol in certain "situations", like having Archer's face buried in her tits. :lol:

 

Edit edit: And now it's season 2, so of course Hoshi's top has to come off. She covers herself up, but it's too late, Malcolm's seen everything. :coffee:

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T’Pol’s new uniform for season 3 genuinely contributes to the impression of the show improving.

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