The Tomb Raider games

[Nick R]

Anyone played any of the pre-Angel of Darkness Tomb Raider games recently? Do their puzzles and atmosphere make them still worth playing today, or are they horrendously dated by their rotating-on-the-spot controls and the regular grid spacing of their level design?

The original Tomb Raider was a game that everyone I knew who had a PS1 seemed to own. Consequently I've played through the Lara's Mansion training level and the first two levels several times, but never any further. How did the PC and Saturn versions compare to the PS1 version? Were the extra levels in the "Unfinished Business" PC release any good?

Never played the sequel, but I remember some criticism about the introduction of human enemies and the game as a whole being weighted more toward action than exploring.

I was a reader of C&VG around the time the Tomb Raider III came out, and I seem to remember them making a big fuss about the return of save crystals. I remember my friend and I spending a long time time attacking the quad bike minigame in Lara's mansion, but I don't think I ever played any of the actual levels. I think it was around this time that the games started introducing levels set in modern-day cities, inviting criticisms like "Anyone remember when she used to actually raid tombs?"

Never played The Last Revelation or Chronicles. By that time I was reading Dreamcast magazines, which gave those two games very average review scores due to the tired formula and previous-gen origins:

The original - the blueprint, the archetypal Tomb Raider - though enjoyable, was riddled with flaws from the start. The greatest frustration of the game was, and is, its control method. Movement is never fluid. Never. Lara has always awkwardly bounced off corners and jumped directly up when you know you pressed Left. Every move must be meticulously programmed, failed, re-programmed, failed and finally programmed in a way that works. The step up, step back and jump method was always dodgy. The level design has always been this series' strongest point (excluding the horrible Tomb Raider II).

...

[Chronicles] is a comparatively good adventure by Tomb Raider measures. All the ingredients are here: 3D levels, new toys, solid - if dated - graphics, and a half-decent story. However, the ingredients make a cake we're tired of eating, for no matter how many cherries Core Design squeeze into this gateaux, the sponge is stale and old. There's bound to be a hardcore band of Tomb Raider fans reading, and if you can tolerate the same game as you've played four times before with the above extra features, you'll probably be quite happy. But you deserve better. Nostalgically enjoyable though the game can be, we couldn't recommend you buy this above the majority of Dreamcast titles just because it's from a heavyweight dynasty. You're using a fantastically-powerful console - why should you have to play high-resolution PlayStation games with awful control methods?

Angel of Darkness may have been a disaster, but it made a really good Edge Making Of!

As for the Crystal Dynamics games, they might not be retro, but we might as well cover them here. Which of them are worth playing? Earlier today I saw this thread, which in turn led to this and, er, this, so it's clear that opinions on Legend vary quite a bit! The PC demo of Anniversary was one of the first things I tried out when I upgraded to my current PC, and I quite enjoyed it.

[Lorfarius]

I played the Saturn version of Tomb Raider after saving for months thinking Sega had released the better console

Out of all the Saturn games I played in the early days, TR was the only one I finished. I can still remember walking into the large cavern with the Egyptian statues, taking a running jump and leaping into the pool that was miles below. Or that thrill when you first met the bear and found the secret alcove nearby, the epic chorus music that kicked in with discovery....just..

[Pochacco]

The original Tomb Raider was a game that everyone I knew who had a PS1 seemed to own. Consequently I've played through the Lara's Mansion training level and the first two levels several times, but never any further. How did the PC and Saturn versions compare to the PS1 version? Were the extra levels in the "Unfinished Business" PC release any good?

I only ever played and completed the original Tomb Raider on the PC when I was at University. I remember staying up through the night until 9am the next day to complete it one time. I was running it on an overclocked Pentium 90 (to 120) with a 3D Monster GFX card installed. I didn't own a PS1. I would have said graphically the game looked a lot better on the PC that on the PS1.

I still have 2 and 3 for the PC but never got round to playing them all the way through. I think the third one came in some big box with loads of goodies but what they are now escapes me, let alone where I put the thing.

[roberthazelby]

Anyone played any of the pre-Angel of Darkness Tomb Raider games recently? Do their puzzles and atmosphere make them still worth playing today, or are they horrendously dated by their rotating-on-the-spot controls and the regular grid spacing of their level design?

If you can get past the 'scruffy' graphics and slightly clunky controls there's still fun to be had, and they'll cost you absolute peanuts.

The original Tomb Raider was a game that everyone I knew who had a PS1 seemed to own. Consequently I've played through the Lara's Mansion training level and the first two levels several times, but never any further. How did the PC and Saturn versions compare to the PS1 version? Were the extra levels in the "Unfinished Business" PC release any good?

I remember playing the Saturn demo of Tomb Raider to death, and then getting the full game for Christmas. I played it loads during that holiday season, and ended up completing it around early January. I've played most of the TR games since then, but the only other one that I've played to the end is the latest Crystal Dynamics one, which I found to be the only game that captured the atmosphere of the first.

With regards to the PC and Saturn versions - I remember seeing a P166 (without a 3d card) trying to run the game and it was painful.

The Saturn release was the original, and it's not too different from the PS1. I remember setting up my Saturn and a friends' PS1, putting in the game, and the two of us trying to work out what was different.

If memory serves me rightly the PS1 version was a little smoother, but the Saturn version loaded levels quicker. The save crystals on the PS1 were mirrored, but on the Saturn they were solid blue. Also, you got some weird (and pointless?) handstand move on the PS1 which wasn't available on the Saturn version.

[Wools]

I’ve not played any of the PC versions of Tomb Raider, but I’m a big fan of the classic games and the recent Crystal Dynamic series.

The first 3 Core Designed games are the best as they remain true to the original vision, staying faithful to the mixture of exploration, puzzles and combat.

Tomb Raider is my favourite of the bunch and one of my favourite games ever made. Although it has none of the additions, vehicles or complex architecture of the sequels, it retains the purity of the original design and is one of the easiest to go back to. I disagree with that Dreamcast Magazine quote about the original series, where Lara jumps one way when you pressed another. I will always remember some criticism of the game back in 1996 where people moaned about jumps that require a leap of faith. I never saw this as the entire world is built on blocks and Lara can only ever jump a set distance. All that players are required to do is stop, have a look round and judge whether you can make that jump in the distance, or fit through that tiny rock with a swan dive.

Tomb Raider II is brilliant and has some welcome location changes, such as the beautiful Tibet with snow-capped mountain ranges to explore. Along with the scenery, the engine has been tweaked to allow for some great lighting changes, with the highlight being the Flares that can now be equipped and thrown. This creates some wonderful moments back in the PS1 era, where you could throw a flare down a cavern and it would light the sides all the way to the bottom of the pit.

Tomb Raider III is a mixed bag. It has a greatly improved resolution along with some other visual improvements that help sell the world more effectively. There’s some great looking water, weather effects, wildlife and overall, the world looks far more alive with detail. The only snag with that comes some very tricky sequences where the user is asked to jump at right angles and scale huge cliffs that are far more punishing if you slip or misjudge a ledge. The original Tomb Raider has no scene that is comparable so Tomb Raider III can be far more punishing.

Of course all the games have aged, the graphics have become pixelated, the digital movement is cumbersome in a 3D world, the combat regularly involves nothing more than jumping over the enemy whilst holding down fire and the puzzles require finding a key to open a door. However the atmosphere is overwhelming, the art style is wonderful, the pace is perfect and the music is orchestral and grand, yet quiet and sparse at the same time.

The original 3 games in the Tomb Raider series are brilliant and I can’t recommend them highly enough.

As for the Crystal Dynamic games, all of them; Tomb Raider Legend, Tomb Raider Anniversary & Tomb Raider Underworld are playable and you should specifically pick Underworld & Anniversary. Anniversary is a wonderful remake of the original and Underworld, even with its faults, is a better game than Uncharted 1, despite what people would have you believe.

[Soulstar]

I briefly saw a friend play the demo on the PS1 around christmas 1996 shortly after I bought a Sega Saturn myself, however I never did get the game and even later during 97 when I eventually got hold of a PS1 too, I alseo didn't bother picking it up. It wasn't a game I ever intended on playing, however i've found myself in several situations playing some of them.

The first one I did play and complete was TR 3. I was bought this along with a few other games for christmas in 98. It wasn't something I was particularly interested in, however I eventually stuck it on and played it through to completion. The graphics were pretty good for the time but it was quite pixelated, as were most 3D games. This one though more so because of the intense detail. The areas were huge and it took me a while to beat, as well as being pretty darn difficult. The boss sequences tended towards the instant deaths if you got one thing wrong in a few situations. I really did enjoy the variety of areas however, and especially liked doing the London Underground level. There was even an Area 51 stage where you'd find yourself within a UFO that I thought was cool. On the last section in Antarctic I think, the water would reduce your oxygen meter much quicker due to the cold and one specific place was pretty much impossible to get to and from without losing a little health. I'd seen a passage written about this in a magazine and they pointed out the same thing.

I once briefly started Tomb Raider 4 The Last Revelations while at uni in my first year simply because I happened to have been given a wallet full of CDR's with PS1 games on. As 90% of those were crap, and on top of the fact that I did attempt to play Soul Reaver but it crashed on the first boss every time, I turned my attention to this one but for some reason never carried on past the first few levels. Strangely enough I can never remember why that was. I couldn't say much about it apart from that the graphics were the smoothest i'd seen them on the PS1.

A few years ago I started Legends on the GC at my uncles house and still have yet to finish it still as I'd almost got to the last level or something along those lines. This one felt very different and much more gimmicky. It was a female james bond action game with lots of cheesy cut sequences and seemed much much easier. This was most likely down to the whole ability to continually pick up ammo and health at almost every encounter with a set of enemies. The controls being easier also added to this, but then having good controls is a good thing I suppose. Being able to see things better is another thing which was often more difficult from what I remember on TR3. The pixelated style of the PS1 gave rise to the inability to notice things quite as easily such as certain ledges. As it has already been mentioned in this thread, TR3 was definitely the hardest ive played, but it felt the most rewarding when I finally did it.

And then this leads onto the only other TR game i've played, and that was TR Chronicles on the DC. I was trying out a CDR game and just quickly decided to check this one out as i'd completely forgotten about it. It was one of those that came out so late into the PS1 life and seemed to pass by quite quickly. I remembered seeing it in the shops and thinking not another one already, then it was gone and forgotten about. Only when I noticed in in a list of games did I think to myself, ah thats TR5.

It did remind me of the older games in comparison to Legends, however the biggest disappointment for me was the whole story. It was more the way they had created a set of 4 areas that didn't really link together in any way what so ever. All it was, was a collection of past reminiscant stories told by some guys after they learned that Laura may have died or was at least missing since TLR. The problem for me was that just as you'd get into one of the areas, you'd then start a completely fresh story with entirely new weapons or even a compeltely different Laura (young Laura) and never get any of your items or weapns from the previous levels again. It was very clunky in its design too and had a really awful jumping section which I hated and got through by juming in an unofficial direction to get to the destination ledge quicker hence bypassing all the slopes. The kitchen bit was laughably stupid too with the cheif. I did persevere and finished all 12 stages but wouldn't really recommend it unless you really wanted to play them all for some reason.

I created a thread on this one here while I was playing it, so you could check out some more about it here.

http://www.rllmukforum.com/index.php?showtopic=234951&st=0&p=7522809&hl=+tomb +raider&fromsearch=1entry7522809

After reading through the thread again, it reminded me of the glitches and general bad programming put into that one. It was definitely a quick money maker before they'd have to step up the game on the next gen consoles. As someone said, "entirely forgettable".

[locke_211]

I remember controversially thinking that Legends was worse as a Tomb Raider game than The Angel of Darkness. Tomb Raider is all about big, complex, sprawling environments with complex and at times obscure puzzles you need to search out. I loved the series enough to grapple with the awful controls in Angel of Darkness and it has all these elements in it, so I played it to the end and enjoyed it. Legends, as a supposed return to form by a team that knew what it was doing, in comparison completely missed the point of the series - no items, completely linear levels. I played it through and enjoyed it for what it was, but after the complexity of Angel of Darkness from a design and layout point of view, it was rubbish as a TR game.

[Soulstar]

Yeah you're right that was definitely a thing I should have added about Legends, the pure linearity of it. As a game it's alright but not quite what you expect to see from a TR game and was definitely the easiest one i've played.

[The Shockmaster]

Angel of Darkness was the first one I played. I got to a bit where I was jumping up and around a nightclub in Paris and was like... eh.

I quite liked Legend in a sub Sands of Time sort of way.

[Unofficial Who]

My favourite is still the first one and some of the environments are still amazingly complex. The Anniversary version actually has less complicated environments but it's fantastic how it plays with your expectations if you're a long time fan by making you approach several structures from a completely different angle.

They did screw up the T-Rex battle though. Stupid quick timey badness. The original was much better with a really neat environment with lots of hiding places. And the realisation that the little dinosaurs that run at you weren't actually running for you...they were running away from something much bigger!

[Gorf]

Here's one for you, was the 1st tomb raider released on Saturn or ps1 first?

I'm sure it came out on the Saturn a few weeks before ps1, have I gone mad?

[Soulstar]

Roberts post does mention it being the Saturn that got released first. Wouldn't be Supprised if that was the case.

[Unofficial Who]

Here's one for you, was the 1st tomb raider released on Saturn or ps1 first?

I'm sure it came out on the Saturn a few weeks before ps1, have I gone mad?

Definately Saturn first. I remember playing this on the Saturn and finding out that the PSOne version was going to look even better. That and Final Fantasy 7 made the decision for me.

[Cthulhu Steev]

Here's one for you, was the 1st tomb raider released on Saturn or ps1 first?

I'm sure it came out on the Saturn a few weeks before ps1, have I gone mad?

The Saturn version came out about six months before PS1. I remember stopping at a HMV after Unconvention and picking it up on a whim, I think that was November and I was still trying to finish it over Christmas. Brilliant game, but I don't ever want to go back to it just in case it ruins the memory.

[Lorfarius]

Brilliant history of the first game here:

[Unofficial Who]

Reminds me. Ages ago I posted up a scan of an old Amiga image where the pose of the woman was exactly like the pose of Lara in one of the PSOne loading screens.

The Amiga screen art was done by a young artist by the name of Tony Gard

(Damn it I didn't scan it! I hope I still have it on the hard drive.)

Edited July 25, 2011 by tssk

[DarhkFox]

I remember my mate got a TR demo with his PS1. This, Ridge Racer and D Derby nearly made me buy a PS1.

I ended up getting a PC a few months later for college. I got TR2 - i remember spending most of my time in the first area because i kept getting stuck

The only TR game i played for more than a few hours was either the third or fourth PS1 game. I quite enjoyed it, but again never finished.

I think in my time ive played all the TR games, but some only for a short while.

Mind, I am looking forward to the new one quite a bit.

[Meh]

Last Revelation is so horribly underrated. It felt like a proper TR game, for a start.

[DarhkFox]

Last Revelation is so horribly underrated. It felt like a proper TR game, for a start.

actually i think thats the one i played.. was a decent game.

[Lorfarius]

Last Revelation is so horribly underrated. It felt like a proper TR game, for a start.

Is that the one where you play Lara as a little girl? If so the opening level was a nightmare to play so not surprised few people stuck with it. That bit where you had to line up a jump to hit a swinging rope was a sticking point of difficulty to me.

[SqueakyG]

For me it started by being STUPIDLY WRONG. My friend had a new Sega Saturn (while I was still on 16-bit) and he excitedly showed me a demo of the first Tomb Raider. I played it and thought it was crap. I remarked that "It will never take off." The 3D was glitchy and messy, and the pointy-titted woman steered like a tank. Not as good as 2D platformers.

What an idiot.

I got a PlayStation and got Tomb Raider anyway (because I kind of felt I had to), and I loved it. It was a revelation! (no pun). My mum tutted when she saw the box cover. It was almost as embarrassing as porn.

I was able to see the difference between Saturn and PlayStation: the PS1 save crystals were transparent and reflective, but the Saturn save crystals were mesh. Remember that's the way the Saturn tried to do transparency.

I never bothered with other Tomb Raiders. I watched people play TR2 but it didn't seem to have the same atmosphere. Human enemies just make Lara a mass murderer.

[Lorfarius]

I never liked TR2, it just never felt as adventurous. Moving to towns etc and dropping the caves, mountain areas was a real mistake. There just wasn't the same interest or mystery.

[SqueakyG]

You know what? It used to PISS ME OFF whenever people pronounced Lara Croft's name as "Laura Croft". Like WTF? How in the hell can you not know her name is Lara?

Then I discovered something interesting. Everyone calling her Laura was American. It turns out the American accent just doesn't know how to pronounce "LAH-RAH". They are calling her Lara, it just sounds like Laura!

[Unofficial Who]

Found it!

Compare the pose in this loading screen

to the pose of the girl by teenager Toby Gard in the tope left of this panel

(Sorry for the bluriness...I don't have the original hardcopy anymore. All the images on this page are by Gard as far as I know.)

[Nick R]

It's more a coincidence than a Gard signature combination of pose and camera angle - any artist will agree that it's more interesting to have a figure with their weight leaning on one leg than to have them stand up straight, and that camera angle makes sense for showing what an explorer/adventurer character is looking at (especially if you want to show off their bum ). But having them published in two different mediums several years apart? Well spotted!