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Football Thread 2011/2012

SMD

By SMD
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dan_tm

dan_tm

Posted
Posted

So you're saying there's an actual conspiracy rather than just being based on the law of averages/bad ref positioning/lack of dug-out replays, etc?

I'd suggest 'well known phenomenon' would be a more appropriate term, as opposed to 'conspiracy'.

Surely even the most avid Man United fans admit that they receive referee bias from time to time? I didn't realise there was even a debate on that issue to be honest.

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hub2

hub2

Posted
Posted

hahaha, insane. What do you want them to do? Match them?

Of course not, but the 'tactic' has been known about for a season or two now. It's your ONLY chance against Barca unless you're maybe Real Madrid, so I don't think it's noteworthy per se.

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Guest

Guest

Posted
Posted

I'd suggest 'well known phenomenon' would be a more appropriate term, as opposed to 'conspiracy'.

Surely even the most avid Man United fans admit that they receive referee bias from time to time? I didn't realise there was even a debate on that issue to be honest.

Well yeah, of course we receive bias from time to time, just like every other club. I honestly don't think we get any more decisions for, or against, us than any other team. It just gets in the media more because of who we are, which leads people to believe it's true.

It's basically just a media driven misconception. Unless somebody can show me the stats to prove otherwise.

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bowser123

bowser123

Posted
Posted

Well yeah, of course we receive bias from time to time, just like every other club. I honestly don't think we get any more decisions for, or against, us than any other team. It just gets in the media more because of who we are, which leads people to believe it's true.

It's basically just a media driven misconception. Unless somebody can show me the stats to prove otherwise.

http://www.debatable...ions.com/tables

That hasn't been updated for the latest round of games but it's saying United have been on the end of more bad decisions that have cost points then have gone for them. I found it interesting they're claiming the massively rich and well supported Stoke and Bolton have had the most go for them this season.

http://blogs.indepen...n-old-trafford/

That one is a record of penalties conceded in the last 6 years by the home side.

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The Fox

The Fox

Posted
Posted

Arsenal beat them at the Emirates last year playing an open attacking game. I thought Barca were there for the taking last night - they were poor going forward (by their very high standards), kept losing the ball and their defence looked porous.

That's not how I remember it. I seem to remember Barcelona totally dominating possession while Arsenal and Koscielny in particular kept them at bay with some last ditch heroics, then when Barca started to tire in the last 20 minutes, we came at them and hit them twice on the counter. Rope-a-dope, basically.

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Petrousgyre

Petrousgyre

Posted
Posted

That's not how I remember it. I seem to remember Barcelona totally dominating possession while Arsenal and Koscielny in particular kept them at bay with some last ditch heroics, then when Barca started to tire in the last 20 minutes, we came at them and hit them twice on the counter. Rope-a-dope, basically.

Weird simplification. Kos had a great game and they certainly tired towards the end - mainly because they didn't have the possession they're normally afforded. We defended well but we had a bunch of chances, especially in the second half. I watched the game again a few months ago - whilst we were lucky to go in only 1-0 at half time they were lucky to walk away only conceding two. Some stats from that game:

Possession

  • Arsenal 47%
  • Barcelona 53%

Attempts on target

  • Arsenal 8
  • Barcelona 7

Attempts off target

  • Arsenal 3
  • Barcelona 3

Corners

  • Arsenal 4
  • Barcelona 1

Compare with last night:

Possession

  • Milan 38%
  • Barcelona 62%

Attempts on target

  • Milan 2
  • Barcelona 5

Attempts off target

  • Milan 3
  • Barcelona 12

Corners

  • Milan 0
  • Barcelona 2

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SaintM

SaintM

Posted
Posted

http://www.debatable...ions.com/tables

That hasn't been updated for the latest round of games but it's saying United have been on the end of more bad decisions that have cost points then have gone for them. I found it interesting they're claiming the massively rich and well supported Stoke and Bolton have had the most go for them this season.

http://blogs.indepen...n-old-trafford/

That one is a record of penalties conceded in the last 6 years by the home side.

The data in that second link is meaningless. They need to have the number of denied penalty claims, rather than the number of penalties. Of course, that's pretty hard to agree to a quantifiable scale for denied penalty claims. Especially when it comes to Liverpool as they're denied about 15 penalties a game according to Suarez ;)

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The Fox

The Fox

Posted
Posted

Weird simplification. Kos had a great game and they certainly tired towards the end - mainly because they didn't have the possession they're normally afforded. We defended well but we had a bunch of chances, especially in the second half. I watched the game again a few months ago - whilst we were lucky to go in only 1-0 at half time they were lucky to walk away only conceding two. Some stats from that game:

What were the possession stats like in the first half though? Or even after 60 minutes? I'd imagine they weren't that close to 47/53. And I never said our approach was the same as Milan's, just that I didn't remember it as "open, attacking" football from Arsenal until fairly near the end.

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Petrousgyre

Petrousgyre

Posted
Posted

What were the possession stats like in the first half though? Or even after 60 minutes? I'd imagine they weren't that close to 47/53. And I never said our approach was the same as Milan's, just that I didn't remember it as "open, attacking" football from Arsenal until fairly near the end.

Well we certainly attacked them and the game was quite open - not sure what else you're reading into that. It wasn't a case of them "totally dominating possession", as I said they tired for a reason. When compared to last nights rather dreary game it absolutely was open and attacking from the home side. Arsenal, for better or worse don't really have a plan B.

Edit: Sorry, without wanting to go on and on about it - this from the Guardian's match report - on the first half:

Arsenal withstood that comparison. Even when the visitors took the lead through Villa in the 26th minute it came in a spell where they might just as easily have fallen behind. Neither team was particularly convincing when seeking to thwart the other. Their heart is not in such work.

That openness made for a frenetic yet also adroit spectacle. Barcelona could well have had a lovingly crafted opener after a quarter of an hour. Andrés Iniesta picked out Messi and he laid the ball back to Villa before breaking free on the return. It may only have been the wish to take the goal with a flourish that undermined him as a dinked shot went beyond the far post.

Arsenal were at least as effective then in unpeeling a back four. Following good work by Theo Walcott, Fábregas lobbed a pass to Van Persie, who rattled a shot that was saved by Valdés. Even if Wenger's men blundered in their effort to spring the offside trap, Messi sending Villa in for the opener, Arsenal had been trying to dictate the terms of the match and so break a Barcelona rhythm that is as natural as a pulse.

You should watch the game again if you get the chance - it was a great, great game.

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Oh Danny Boy

Oh Danny Boy

Posted
Posted

I'm getting fed up now, how do the incompetent morons at the FA manage to justify their six figure salaries?

Little over two months till the Euros and no sign of a new England manager, so while the coaches of France and Sweden etc are preparing their squads, plotting their strategies and swotting up on their opponents England remain unable to prepare. Does the FA think the England job is just a rich man's fantasy football? Scribble a squad on a piece of paper and earn £6m. There should be a manager here right now scouting the players of England's opponents, learning their strength's and weaknesses, getting to know the squad, learning how to maybe get the best out of Rooney, or whether Terry is still up for the task or whether Wiltshire will be fit enough come June and countless other little factors that all must be acted upon to give the final squad a chance of success. Instead we are increasingly looking at a situation where England will be entering this tournament blind which will only end in abject humiliation.

Thank you FA i look forward to the summer and watching England become the laughing stock of world football once again. :facepalm:

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dizogg

dizogg

Posted
Posted

I'm getting fed up now, how do the incompetent morons at the FA manage to justify their six figure salaries?

Little over two months till the Euros and no sign of a new England manager, so while the coaches of France and Sweden etc are preparing their squads, plotting their strategies and swotting up on their opponents England remain unable to prepare. Does the FA think the England job is just a rich man's fantasy football? Scribble a squad on a piece of paper and earn £6m. There should be a manager here right now scouting the players of England's opponents, learning their strength's and weaknesses, getting to know the squad, learning how to maybe get the best out of Rooney, or whether Terry is still up for the task or whether Wiltshire will be fit enough come June and countless other little factors that all must be acted upon to give the final squad a chance of success. Instead we are increasingly looking at a situation where England will be entering this tournament blind which will only end in abject humiliation.

Thank you FA i look forward to the summer and watching England become the laughing stock of world football once again. :facepalm:

Tbh we'd struggle to do any worse than WC 2010...

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lolly

lolly

Posted
Posted

Some good games and great goals in the Europe League tonight. Best was Rauls. He's still got it.

I've had such a man-crush on Raul over the years.His lob about 5 mins later nearly came off too, brilliant piece of skill and vision that just missed.

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Oh Danny Boy

Oh Danny Boy

Posted
Posted

The new manager will be Redknapp, the FA know it, there's no hurry.

but if he is there would be no time to prepare once the season ends. Redknapp will know nothing about who his best team is and would know nothing of his opponents. He'll go to the Euro's blind and return with his reputation in tatters as the media feast upon another abject display on the world stage.

The job can't offered to someone on the eve of the Euro's. If the FA really want Redknapp and possessed some common sense they would have got someone in straight after Capello went whose job is to manage England in the Euro's and give the job to Redknapp permanently for the World cup qualifiers where he can start afresh.

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milko

milko

Posted
Posted

I reckon Redknapp probably watches quite a lot of Premier League football and has a pretty good idea who he'd take. Whoever takes over there's no more England squad get-togethers til after the league finishes so it makes little difference what job they have now anyway. Pearce will probably carry on being assistant so all this wonderful prep work he's doing will still be valid.

I was saying the other day I don't do that bookmark-to-say-I-told-you-so but I reckon I might have to on this one!

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