Sport Football Thread 2011/2012

[Elseb]

He's got plenty of previous for it. I don't mind the guy though as at least he'll hold his hands up when he's got carried away. Anyone who gets a rise out of Martin O'Neill is fine by me anyway. I hate that guy's guts.

Why do you hate O'neill? I've always thought he was a popular guy. I think he's a great manager and comes across really well.

[Art Vandelay]

Why do you hate O'neill? I've always thought he was a popular guy. I think he's a great manager and comes across really well.

I think he's pretty overrated and quite limited as a manager. I'd forgive that but I find his dislike of Wenger to be bordering on the obsessive. He just comes across as a massive weirdo by bringing up how he doesn't get on with him about 3 dozen times a season. Literally nobody cares.

[Elseb]

He did wonders with Leicester, won a couple of cups i seem to recall.

He did a great job at Celtic, obviously people will say this isn't difficult but he still has to win the titles.

He got Villa to sixth place in the league and kept them there for a few season.

He has come to Sunderland and at the moment has done a fairly decent job, only time will tell.

I would say the above is quite an impressive CV. That's just me though.

[The Fox]

He left Celtic and Sunderland the same way: with squads full of ageing players on big money. He is also absolutely horrific at signing players. Good if you want someone to come in and get the best out of what you've got, but useless if you give him any money.

[Rev]

He did wonders with Leicester, won a couple of cups i seem to recall.

He did a great job at Celtic, obviously people will say this isn't difficult but he still has to win the titles.

He got Villa to sixth place in the league and kept them there for a few season.

He has come to Sunderland and at the moment has done a fairly decent job, only time will tell.

I would say the above is quite an impressive CV. That's just me though.

Just because he's done well doesn't mean he's not a dick.

[DeadRussian]

I'm not totally sold on O'Neill. On one hand, he's one of Clough's boys, he seems a bright lad too (finished studying law at Dublin University, I believe), which is always refreshing in the world of football, does a decent job wherever he goes and his regular choice of assistant manager (who didn't go with him to Sunderland this time - didn't fancy the move) is my old next door neighbour.

On the other hand, he's a right prickly twat.

Also, today today he basically said "You should never complain to the referee, except Lee Cattermole was totally correct in swearing his tits off at the referee this time".

He's alright, I guess.

Nice hair, MARTIN.

[Guest]

Just because he's done well doesn't mean he's not a dick.

Ferguson, for example.

[Guest]

Catching up on more footie...what a total utter crime that Danny Murphy didn't play for England more. He's been one of the best passers in the middle of the park we've had for the last 10 years.

Yet, of course, he wasn't seen as a runner, or a tackler, or all else that the good English types should be.

Ridiculous - two assists today and the first Dempsey goal was such a wonderfully weighted pass. If Scholes had played that the pundits would be spaffing over it endlessly.

[Stig]

[Sirloin]

O'neill is only no good with lots of money, the value he got for Leicester was amazing, Lennon, Izzet, Elliot, Cottee, Savage and more. None were a big fee. And he made some decent buys with Celtic too.

[bowser123]

How long will Cattermole's next ban be? Will it be a five match ban, based on the assumption that 10th booking = 2 games + straight red = 3(?) games .

Nope because a straight red isn't 3 games unless it's violent conduct.

Presumably he'll get done for foul and abusive language which is 2 games going off what happened to Rooney last season.

It will be 2+2 though.

[Stig]

He's been given a 4 match ban. 1 for getting his 10th yellow of the season and the other three for the red.

[bowser123]

He's been given a 4 match ban. 1 for getting his 10th yellow of the season and the other three for the red.

Nope, it's 2+2.

Red card offences:

1 GAME

Handball which denies a goal scoring opportunity

Denying a goal scoring opportunity with a foul

Second Yellow card

2 GAMES

Foul and abusive language

3 GAMES

Serious foul play

Violent Conduct

Spitting

Extra games (these only apply before certain dates):

1 game= 5 yellows or 2 red

2 games= 10 yellows or 3 reds

[Daley]

Not sure if anyone saw it last night but there was a documentary on BBC2 about QPR. It's now on iPlayer.

http://www.bbc.co.uk...Four_Year_Plan/

Was pretty good. What surprised me most was that pretty much all of the things revealed in this were at one time or another in the newspapers. I just assume the papers are always talking shit rather than sometimes but they actually get it right sometimes.

Also Paladini sounded pretty much exactly like the guy from the Ladbrokes advert.

And the bit where Briatore was trying to work out how to communicate with the bench from the directors box to tell him what subs to make was amazing. Plus it was always the managers fault. All 177 of them before they got Warnock. They even bitched about him after losing their first league game in December or something.

[dan_tm]

Just came in here to post about that, I've just finished watching it on iPlayer...

The first half of it was some of the best television I've ever seen. I was a bit disappointed when they inevitably started getting more successful once Warnock arrived on the scene though, not because of my Wednesday allegiances (I actually have a fair bit of respect for Warnock and he would have been a good shout for our new manager had he not gone to Leeds a couple of weeks ago), but because I couldn't stand Briatore and the rest of his mob. That said, I did like that Amit guy, he seemed to be genuinely happy for the club, rather than just the Premiership pay-packet.

I'm surprised that no reference was made to Briatore joining the club after being forced out of F1 for basically match-fixing races though.

It's well worth watching for anyone with the slightest interest in the business behind football.

[SaintM]

Aye, the Italians really didn't come out well in that programme. Briatore seemed to be exactly how I thought he'd be.

[Sportello]

http://www.scotprem.com/content/default.asp?page=s2&newsid=11135

The Scottish Premier League are launching an investigation into Rangers dating back to 1998. It's over apparent side-payments to players.

If Rangers players were given side-contracts and the club hid them from the SPL they could end up having their league titles since 1998 stripped from them; the investigation only stops at 1998 because that's when the SPL was formed.

I wonder what other accountancy wheezes Sir David Murray and his comedy successor Craig Whyte got up to?

[Glasgowchivas]

Rangers redundancies being announced now. Gregg Wylde is the first player released.

[Sportello]

Rangers redundancies being announced now. Gregg Wylde is the first player released.

Decent young player. He'll do alright for himself with a Championship club.

He said he asked to go so his wages might save someone's job. If true then he's got a bit of class. Good on him.

[SMD]

http://www.scotprem.com/content/default.asp?page=s2&newsid=11135 The Scottish Premier League are launching an investigation into Rangers dating back to 1998. It's over apparent side-payments to players. If Rangers players were given side-contracts and the club hid them from the SPL they could end up having their league titles since 1998 stripped from them; the investigation only stops at 1998 because that's when the SPL was formed. I wonder what other accountancy wheezes Sir David Murray and his comedy successor Craig Whyte got up to?

Sorry, what do side contracts mean? And why would it be an issue, unless we're talking that they were hidden from accounts and therefore the taxman as well?

[a big boy]

Not sure if anyone saw it last night but there was a documentary on BBC2 about QPR. It's now on iPlayer.

http://www.bbc.co.uk...Four_Year_Plan/

Was pretty good. What surprised me most was that pretty much all of the things revealed in this were at one time or another in the newspapers. I just assume the papers are always talking shit rather than sometimes but they actually get it right sometimes.

Also Paladini sounded pretty much exactly like the guy from the Ladbrokes advert.

And the bit where Briatore was trying to work out how to communicate with the bench from the directors box to tell him what subs to make was amazing. Plus it was always the managers fault. All 177 of them before they got Warnock. They even bitched about him after losing their first league game in December or something.

Yeah it was incredibly in-depth portrail of the inner workings of a club that I don't think is comparable to anything seen before. Briatore genuinely comes across as a bit mental - the kind of person that's just incapable of self doubt and won't accept anything less than perfection from others because he's perfect himself, obviously. From the point of view of his stewardship it was nothing more than luck that got us promoted rather than relegated, because it sure as hell wasn't his good judgement that led to the appointment of Warnock, or the signings of Faurlin (from the Argentine 2nd division) and Taarabt.

What the film did not detail (apart from a little at the end where Amit (chairman) is talking to Mittal (his billionaire father in law) about Briatore's sudden renegging on a deal to by out his shares) is how much the club suffered from his ridiculous tight fistedness immediately following promotion. He made absolutely no funds available to Warnock, so QPR fans to sit by and watch Norwich and Swansea hoover up all our summer targets while we had to make do with the likes of Kieron Dyer on a free, as he negotiated the best sale price for himself. He finally sold to Fernades only a few days before the end of the transfer window, who was accordingly forced in to the undignified panic buying the club has since become synonymous with. Warnock now has the reputation of being "awful" in the Premier League, but the truth is he never had a transfer window to build the team. If we get relegated this season there's no doubt in my mind it'll because of that lost summer.

Still, all of that does have to be balanced against the fact he did actually save the club from liquidation, I suppose...

[Rev]

Sorry, what do side contracts mean? And why would it be an issue, unless we're talking that they were hidden from accounts and therefore the taxman as well?

I would assume (baselessly) they announced one wage that the Rangers company paid, then paid another wage to make it up to what the player wanted through an outside company. There are quite a few reasons to do that (most obviously, to make it seem like the club is making more of a profit) even if all the tax is paid as normal. Although tax avoidance does seem fairly likely.

[a big boy]

Just came in here to post about that, I've just finished watching it on iPlayer...

The first half of it was some of the best television I've ever seen. I was a bit disappointed when they inevitably started getting more successful once Warnock arrived on the scene though, not because of my Wednesday allegiances (I actually have a fair bit of respect for Warnock and he would have been a good shout for our new manager had he not gone to Leeds a couple of weeks ago), but because I couldn't stand Briatore and the rest of his mob. That said, I did like that Amit guy, he seemed to be genuinely happy for the club, rather than just the Premiership pay-packet.

I'm surprised that no reference was made to Briatore joining the club after being forced out of F1 for basically match-fixing races though.

It's well worth watching for anyone with the slightest interest in the business behind football.

In fairness that was in 2009 when he was already in charge. Quite a lot was made at the time that FA/Football League Rules over being a fit and proper person to own a club might force him to step down... I guess that was one subject he didn't let the cameras document.

[Squigs]

SPL rules D9.3 and D1.13 impose a prohibition on players receiving payments for playing football or participating in an activity connected with football except where such payments are made in accordance with a form of contract approved by the SPL and require that all such contracts are submitted to the SPL within 14 days of being entered into.

In other words, Rangers have apparently been making payments outside of those stipulated in the approved contracts, possibly to avoid taxes.

Just read that Wylde went without a redundancy package, and that Mervan Celik has also agreed to leave.

[Sportello]

Sorry, what do side contracts mean? And why would it be an issue, unless we're talking that they were hidden from accounts and therefore the taxman as well?

I would assume (baselessly) they announced one wage that the Rangers company paid, then paid another wage to make it up to what the player wanted through an outside company. There are quite a few reasons to do that (most obviously, to make it seem like the club is making more of a profit) even if all the tax is paid as normal. Although tax avoidance does seem fairly likely.

It's not entirely clear, but as far as I can tell yes - it's thought these side-contracts were a way to get around paying tax.

The SPL had rules saying the player's full contracts had to be registered to stop things like tax avoidance, third party ownership and the like. Although it's thought that rule might only have been introduced in 2006, so it might not go back as far as 1998.

If it's found the players had side contracts since 2006 then it's possible Rangers have illegally fielded players and may have their league trophies stripped. It's all a bit up in the air at the minute, obviously.

[Guest]

Probably Disciple, the cheeky scamp.

We just looked awful in the second half, Harry had the look of simmering fury about him too. Gary had it spot on when he was going on about shape and players not doing what they were supposed to be, Bale and VDV especially but also Sandro and Parker.

I would never neg people who mentioned Bale diving. The guy's a jug eared cheat.

[Daley]

Quote of the day no doubt:

Swansea manager Brendan Rodgers when questioned about taking the Chelsea job:

"I am trying to build my career and not destroy it."

[Charliemouse]

Quote of the day no doubt:

Swansea manager Brendan Rodgers when questioned about taking the Chelsea job:

I expect he knows the players at Chelsea would struggle to play the way he wants to play and they would end up doing no better as they are now.

It is like when he was the manager for Reading, the players he had there just could not play the way he wanted them too and he was sacked in 5 months. He was quite lucky at Swansea as they already sort of played his way under Martinez.

[Daley]

I love Phil Jones.

[Rev]

Odd Chelsea news of the day for me is that they've given Ramires a new 5 year contract. Whilst he's a decent enough player, it's hard to imagine him being a crucial part of the team in 5 years. If a manager comes in with a different approach he could easily be surplus in 5 months. Odd.