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The RROD thread


j.m.ratkos
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What pisses me off about this is MS won't credit you for the time your 360 is away for the time you paid for live. Bastards/.

Maybe the policy has changed - I received a free 1 month top-up card with my repaired unit. On the other hand, it went tits-up again after 2 hours, so maybe they knew something in advance :ph34r:

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EB in the US think the failure rate is 30-33% :ph34r:

http://www.dailytech.com/article.aspx?newsid=7892

Nearly one in every three Xbox 360 consoles fail, according to retailer reports

By several metrics, the Xbox 360 is the most successful console so far of this generation. Despite the startling pace of the Wii, the Xbox 360 still has the most consoles sold worldwide and the longest list of games and exclusives. For a gamer looking for online-enabled high-definition gaming today, the Xbox 360 appears to satisfy those needs.

One often overlooked factor when considering a console purchase is reliability, an area that is becoming apparent where the Xbox 360 falls short. Anecdotal evidence is heavily pointing to Microsoft’s latest console as being significantly more prone to failure than what consumers are accustomed to.

Microsoft has said before that its Xbox 360 failure rate falls within three to five percent, what it believes to be well within industry standards. Internet reports from Xbox 360 owners, however, suggest that the failure rate is much higher than that.

In an effort to gain a more accurate picture of Xbox 360 failure rate, DailyTech decided to poll retail outlets that sell the Xbox 360 and with it the option to purchase an in-store extended warranty. Out of all Xbox 360 extended warranties sold, we wanted to know how many were claimed by consumers with defective consoles, thus giving us a more accurate failures percentage.

After contacting several retailers from various regions in North America, the responses were unanimous: the Xbox 360 is the least reliable gaming console in recent history. Current EB Games or GameStop employees who offered information did so under strict anonymity, as it is against company policy to reveal such information to the public. Furthermore, our sources confirmed that EB Games revised its Canadian warranty policies during early 2007 for consoles solely due to the failure rate of the Xbox 360.

EB Games held conference calls for its Canadian stores informing them of the new policy changes and revealing alarming failure rates of the Xbox 360. “The real numbers were between 30 to 33 percent,” said former EB Games employee Matthieu G., adding that failure rate was even greater for launch consoles. “We had 35 Xbox 360s at launch I know more than half of them broke within the first six months (red lights or making circles under the game discs). Two of them were dead on arrival.”

Interestingly, Microsoft has acknowledged that the initial batch of Xbox 360 consoles made during the launch window suffer from below average reliability. In response to an overwhelming defect rate of launch consoles, Microsoft agreed to repair all machines manufactured in 2005 free of charge, and issue a refund for those who already paid for repairs of launch units up until January 1, 2006.

The three flashing red lights – commonly referred to in gaming communities as the “Red Ring of Death” – is a sign of an Xbox 360 hardware failure. The sign is apparently common enough that Microsoft has added an option to its 1-800-4MY-XBOX support line that names “three flashing red lights” specifically.

As a result of the high failure rate of the Xbox 360, EB Games corporate nearly doubled the prices of its one-year, over-the-counter warranty. While the previous warranty would give a customer a brand new console in exchange for the broken one, the new policy now states that the customer will receive a refurbished console instead. The move was made because it was becoming too costly for the retailer to give the customer a brand-new machine, which still carries a store cost close to the MSRP. The price increase and policy change wasn’t exclusive to only the Xbox 360, however, as it also applies to all other Sony and Nintendo consoles sold.

The failure rate nearing a third of all Xbox 360 consoles was found at other retailers too. A Best Buy customer service department manager, who wished to remain unnamed, said that failure rates for the console were “between a quarter to a third” of all units sold.

“We see a ton of [Xbox 360s] come back all the time. We strongly push our customers to buy our service plans no matter what they buy, but it is especially important for them with the Xbox 360,” said the manager. “It’s a lucky thing for us that Microsoft extended the factory warranty to one year, because we were having a hell of a time dealing with the launch units. Now we don’t have to deal with those broken [Xbox 360s] until their second year, for those who have purchased the two year plans.”

In late 2006, Microsoft boosted the warranty of all Xbox 360 consoles to one year, up from 90-days previously. For gamers who are out of warranty, however, a replacement or repair will cost Xbox 360 customers $140.

When compared against other systems, the Xbox 360 is failing at higher rates than its current competitors and predecessors. Former EB Games worker Matthieu G. said that the failure rates for all other consoles were not high enough for the retailer to consider revising its policies, and guesses that that most other console systems have a failure rate of less than one percent, including the PlayStation 3. Another EB Games manager, when asked if the store warranty was worth it, conceded that in the hundreds of Wii units sold at that location thus far, zero have come back as defective.

Despite the overwhelming evidence that the Xbox 360 is a relatively unreliable games machine, Microsoft officials refuse to comment on its failure rate. Peter Moore, VP of Microsoft’s entertainment division, said to the Mercury News, “I can’t comment on failure rates, because it’s just not something – it’s a moving target. What this consumer should worry about is the way that we’ve treated him. Y’know, things break, and if we’ve treated him well and fixed his problem, that’s something that we’re focused on right now. I’m not going to comment on individual failure rates because I’m shipping in 36 countries and it’s a complex business.”

Similar questions regarding the Xbox 360 hardware met with the man responsible for the design of the console, Todd Holmdahl. He too sidestepped the issue with the Mercury News, saying, “I would say we don’t have a high defect rate. The vast majority of people are really excited about their product, and that we are targeting profitability for next year.”

Asked differently about whether or not the Xbox 360 falls into the ‘normal’ three to five percent return rate, Holmdahl said, “We don’t disclose the actual number,” and “We don’t comment on that.”

No piece of technology, no matter how well designed, should be expected to completely free of failure. The key metric is whether or not a product falls within industry standards of acceptable failure rates – and from findings based off retailer-supported warranty returns, the actual rate of failures could be six to ten times greater than what Microsoft is letting on.

Regardless of what the actual failure rate is, there is consumer perception that the Xbox 360 is a less reliable machine than its competitors. That fact alone should encourage Microsoft to do more than just avoid all comments on failures and only preach on the wonderful experience of its consumer base.

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FUCK!

I've just moved into my new flat yesterday, and i'm still living out of the boxes. So in a moment of rest from the unpacking I decide to boot up my 360 for a bit. I plug it and and i'm excited about showing it to my new flatmates on the big screen when...

Three Red Lights.

FUCK!

Is there any hope? that either i'm just doing something stupid, or of getting a free repair. I'm not happy. its been a srtressful couple of days and this is really all I need.

you are probably getting the "other red ring" the one for not plugging everything in properly, take out the AV lead and power lead and plug them back in again.

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My mate has had the ring of death and got his machine swapped by Game; after downloading an update about a month ago, his second machine started messing up, he had it collected by UPS, it has been with them for a month, he called them last friday and they said it was being worked on...

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you are probably getting the "other red ring" the one for not plugging everything in properly, take out the AV lead and power lead and plug them back in again.

Not unless he's having difficulty counting up to four.

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Ok, some advice needed folks, if that's OK.

Bought a 360 premium from Boots.com about 10 days ago, and all appeared well, until I noticed that the PSU was getting REALLY loud after continued periods of play. It's pretty much at the point where the high pitch squeel it eminates becomes unbearable and I have to turn it off.

I'd heard reports that the 360 is a noisy console, so I put it down to that initially, although I've since checked out a couple of friends consoles and their PSU's seem pretty much silent. Mine is louder than the actual machine. So basically, I'm convinced that the PSU is faulty.

I had a conversation with an MS support guy, who suggested that components of that type often vary in noise due to 'environmental conditions', at which point I said that a PSU sounding like a fridge is unacceptable and that I want it replaced. He then suggested I talk to Boots, so I rang them.

Boots said that I can send it all back to them for a replacement, so I packed it all up ready to be sent off; until I realised that the website was listing the 360 as 'out of stock'. So I rang them back, and was told that the 360 has been discontinued, and that my only option is a refund.

I'd go for the refund option and get a new unit from somewhere else, but the only reason I bought one in the first place was due to the low price point of less than £200, due to their discounted price and first time customer coupon offer.

So yeah, I think the best thing to do would be to get my PSU replaced through MS, which I'm about to arrange. I know someone with a spare PSU, so I wouldn't have any 360 'downtime'.

My main question is, shall I bother going for the extra 2 year warantee for £60? I need to respond within 10 days - which is nearly up, but I've filled out the form and it's ready to send.

I'm annoyed that I'm even thinking about buying extra cover for an machine that seems flawed by design, but it's tempting to just swallow their jizz and try to forget about it - safe in the knowledge I'll be covered for 3 years.

What would you do in my situation? If it helps, my console was manufactured on 15/08/2006. Any word on improvement to the manufacturing process?

Cheers guys.

ps. I hope it works out for you guys that are fighting to get your units placed by the retailers. This whole thing is a shambles on MS' part.

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I never did understand why this thread wasn't merged in with "All XBox 360 Owners: Problems?". I mean, it even namechecks that thread in the title.

Actually it says all 360 owners are problems. Sounds like a vicious hate crusade from Sony! :blink:

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I believe that MS have started putting the additional heatsinks we're seeing in repaired models in their newer machines, and I keep hearing reports about how the newer drives are much quieter, plus it's common practice to continually revise hardware to reduce costs to the manufacturer, so I'd feel pretty safe in saying "Yes, newer consoles are better made than old ones". However, the launch machines were supposed to have utterly dire lifespans, so any improvement on those isn't saying much.

Personally, I'd go for the additional warranty, unless you fancy taking Deeptone's route and trying to push the SoG Act on the retailer if/when your console fails after 12 months.

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Just to add, they haven't improved the disc drive units - in the way that they house the discs. I nudged the console and my Forza disc became dislodged before churning up. Thankfully the 'scratches' seem to be plastic residue from the inside of the drive rather than deep scratches on the disc itself as I managed to clean it up pretty well.

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two 360s here, purchased 06/01/06

still going strong...

it doesn't help, but it does "indicate" that there are good boxes out there... right?

I think it's just luck of the draw. I have a friend with a launch console (imported from Germany I think), and he tends to be a little heavy-handed with his gear. He's opened it up and *ahem* voided the warranty, but it's still behaving as it should. He said it did once give him the dreaded Red Ring for a day, but after leaving it alone overnight, it was fine and hasn't casused any problems since.

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Ok, some advice needed folks, if that's OK.

Bought a 360 premium from Boots.com about 10 days ago, and all appeared well, until I noticed that the PSU was getting REALLY loud after continued periods of play. It's pretty much at the point where the high pitch squeel it eminates becomes unbearable and I have to turn it off.

I've never heard of the PSU making any noise at all before...it certainly shouldn't. I'd get that replaced before it sets your house on fire!

The way things are going, £60 for 2 years coverage is a good investment. :blink:

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Isnt that a four red ring? cause am pretty sure we got that here at work when I forgot to plug in the component cable.

I thought it was that as I was plugging it into a wall mounted plasma, into the connections underneath the bloody thing. So I thought the three red rings might be because I had the components in the wrong colour inputs. But when I tested it on my small portable downstairs, it was still borked. boo. I'l try it one more time today before I phone microsoft and see what they have to say. (as if I dont know already :P)

Another thing that really got on my tits yesterday was that i cant plug the Wii into the plasma either. There is'nt enough clearance between the connections on the back and the wall for the scart block to fit.... Grumble. So this means that I need to get some kind of scart block extention. boo. Or maybe I should just go component, it'd be better quality (If I could ever find a cable) But i'd have to keep switching the conection between wii and 360 on the back.

Bugger,

bugger all round. :blink:

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So this means that I need to get some kind of scart block extention. boo. Or maybe I should just go component, it'd be better quality (If I could ever find a cable) But i'd have to keep switching the conection between wii and 360 on the back.

That's the problem I had, so bought a VGA cable for the 360.

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Why aren't Sony or Nintendo making the most of this and highlighting the poor reliability to sway customers to their consoles? If I was in charge of Sony PR I'd run full page ad's in the national press with the poor reliability statistics of the 360.

Of course the PS3 isn't entirely fautless, but it's nowhere near the death rate of 360s

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Oh, but does'nt the whole VGA thing bring its shed load of fuckups with it? I've never ventured into the thread because i never went trhough VGA before.

Dunno...there seems to be an interminable debate about which is better, which to me only says that either is fine.

Seems ok to me anyway, though I had to make a lot of adjustments from the component settings.

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Oh, I thought there was all sorts of problems with some games being uncompatible with VGA or something? Or maybe I just got the wrong end of the stick.

Oh, right...I did have to switch back to component to get the original Manhunt working...but I assumed that was just because it was an original Xbox game which only ran at 50Hz. Must look into this.

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Why aren't Sony or Nintendo making the most of this and highlighting the poor reliability to sway customers to their consoles? If I was in charge of Sony PR I'd run full page ad's in the national press with the poor reliability statistics of the 360.

Of course the PS3 isn't entirely fautless, but it's nowhere near the death rate of 360s

"The 360 is irrelevant."

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Why aren't Sony or Nintendo making the most of this and highlighting the poor reliability to sway customers to their consoles?

To be honest, do they need to waste money highlighting the issue further? Everyone knows the 360 has huge reliability issues by now.

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To be honest, do they need to waste money highlighting the issue further? Everyone knows the 360 has huge reliability issues by now.

So why not make the most of it and put the boot in? I'm sure if a parent was buying a console for their child and was undecided, and didn't know about the reliability issues then having it highlighted would surely put them off buying a 360?

If you had known about this before you bought your 360, would you still have got one? I'm not sure I would.

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Why aren't Sony or Nintendo making the most of this and highlighting the poor reliability to sway customers to their consoles? If I was in charge of Sony PR I'd run full page ad's in the national press with the poor reliability statistics of the 360.

That sort of advertising (negative comments about opponent's products) is on rather shaky legal ground - it probably wouldn't be wise for them to go down this route - especially as the reliabilty statistics we've got still aren't really "official".

Were there to be a proper, independent statistical report done into it, then it may be possible, but the current statistics still probably don't add up to something legally defensible - yet.

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I think it's just luck of the draw. I have a friend with a launch console (imported from Germany I think), and he tends to be a little heavy-handed with his gear. He's opened it up and *ahem* voided the warranty, but it's still behaving as it should. He said it did once give him the dreaded Red Ring for a day, but after leaving it alone overnight, it was fine and hasn't casused any problems since.

Christ in a basket...

I go to check my friend's site today, and what do you know, his launch box died on Saturday.

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two 360s here, purchased 06/01/06

still going strong...

it doesn't help, but it does "indicate" that there are good boxes out there... right?

Y'see that's what we need...a thread where all forum 360 owners post stating whether they have had any problems or not. That way we can get some idea of the percentage of machines failing.

If I remember my research studies well enough, 200 responses would even make it statistically significant.

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