Rage - by id Software

[T Pot]

the updated installer is an option...they key word you use is mandatory. MS cant do it because of none hdd owners. annoying yes but the ps3 version will have way more problems than 2 discs and compressed textures. that shit pad and crap online for a kick off.

Ah shite, forgot about those damned core/arcade users!!!

But still, an option to intall to harddisk would be great. No diskswaps, better res textures.

And i agree what you say about the PS3 pad and online. I can't use the DS3 for shooters, at all. But if it comes to it, i might well be doing so for this and Doom 4 (If that comes to consoles)

[SeanR]

What!?! Oh fuck!

How much are PS3s these days?

[Paulando]

No, mandatory installs are bad. I'd rather textures in the distance be a little blurred to be honest.

[angel]

Ah shite, forgot about those damned core/arcade users!!!

But still, an option to intall to harddisk would be great. No diskswaps, better res textures.

And i agree what you say about the PS3 pad and online. I can't use the DS3 for shooters, at all. But if it comes to it, i might well be doing so for this and Doom 4 (If that comes to consoles)

we all suffer because of the initial "retard pack" (remember that phrase?) without the hdd. its absurd. i for one cant wait for this new dash....halo 3, bioshock etc installed....what a difference that will make

oh by the way did you ever see my ps3 pad with the rubber sticks removed? massive improvement.

[Hello Goaty ♥]

I dont even know what this game is.

So its much of a muchness.

[Corleth the Fey]

So, hold on. 9GB on a DL DVD isn't enough dataspace to hold Carmack's new 'mega texture'? Not defending Microsoft's decision to use DVD's here (but it's not like they had any other choice at the time) but it sounds like John C has got a little carried away with himself.

[T Pot]

So, hold on. 9GB on a DL DVD isn't enough dataspace to hold Carmack's new 'mega texture'? Not defending Microsoft's decision to use DVD's here (but it's not like they had any other choice at the time) but it sounds like John C has got a little carried away with himself.

Two 9GB DVDs is barely enough!

[SeanR]

digital content delivery FTW!

[Corleth the Fey]

Two 9GB DVDs is barely enough!

Barely enough for what though? What is this 'mega texture' of? The human genome? A accurate map of the Cosmic Background radiation? A generic FPS sandy world?

[Raide]

Does everyone really think there is going to be a huge different in the PS3 and 360 versions, considering that RAGE is supposed to be built to work well on all major platforms?

I am sure the 360 install feature will help out but since nobody has really seen RAGE on PS3 and 360 to fully compare what they are like, it sounds odd for the dev to come out and say "Damn, we may need 2 DVD's." Is that such a problem...really?

[Sigourney Beaver]

Does everyone really think there is going to be a huge different in the PS3 and 360 versions, considering that RAGE is supposed to be built to work well on all major platforms?

I am sure the 360 install feature will help out but since nobody has really seen RAGE on PS3 and 360 to fully compare what they are like, it sounds odd for the dev to come out and say "Damn, we may need 2 DVD's." Is that such a problem...really?

I get the feeling they would've preferred three discs but MS would've charged them more.

[roadkill]

So, hold on. 9GB on a DL DVD isn't enough dataspace to hold Carmack's new 'mega texture'? Not defending Microsoft's decision to use DVD's here (but it's not like they had any other choice at the time) but it sounds like John C has got a little carried away with himself.

Not as simple as that. Part of the point is it needs to stream the data off the disk, and whilst there may strictly be space for it you won't get optimum times.

When you're doing disk streaming like that you lay out the data on the disk in ways to optimise it for read time, not for storage space. You can even write the same thing several times in different places or deliberate areas of emptiness (a certain amount of which probably exists anyway), Blu ray simply gives more options for doing this.

[Corleth the Fey]

DVD 1:-

DVD 2:-

Rage - hmm sounds like Haze!

Not as simple as that. Part of the point is it needs to stream the data off the disk, and whilst there may strictly be space for it you won't get optimum times.

When you're doing disk streaming like that you lay out the data on the disk in ways to optimise it for read time, not for storage space. You can even write the same thing several times in different places or deliberate areas of emptiness (a certain amount of which probably exists anyway), Blu ray simply gives more options for doing this.

Cheers. I see now, though I do already understand the concept of placing data on a disc in the 'right areas' for maximum read speed. It seems the PS3's slow Blu-ray speed isn't going to affect this game. Don't see this game being too hot though. No doubt someone else will put the tech to good use.

[Dimahoo]

But if you go into some areas in the wasteland, like behind a fence where nobody will typically go and explore, this is where the 360 version may look a little blurry compared to the PS3."

Well, at least not until you mentioned it you silly twats.

SERIOUSLY though - i think this is probably the nearest we'll get to Motorstorm on the 360, or even Road Rash....it had better be good.

[SeanR]

Barely enough for what though? What is this 'mega texture' of? The human genome? A accurate map of the Cosmic Background radiation? A generic FPS sandy world?

shave.

the entire game in a single continuous texture.

Wrapped over the geometry.

[Uzi]

This is one of those things which is a bit meaningless until we see the versions running side by side to see exactly how far the differences are (in which time- fanboys will argue over every possibility or scenario).

Or even if the game will be good enough to warrant the argument or debate in the first place.

[Corleth the Fey]

shave.

the entire game in a single continuous texture.

Wrapped over the geometry.

Please point me to a site that's going to inform and impress me with why one big texture is better than several smaller ones.

[SeanR]

This is one of those things which is a bit meaningless until we see the versions running side by side to see exactly how far the differences are (in which time- fanboys will argue over every possibility or scenario).

Or even if the game will be good enough to warrant the argument or debate in the first place.

Shut up you, I'm buying a PS3!

[Dimahoo]

I must admit, until i see some physics or special effects i'm not too fussed. I mean, i'm assuming the driving will be fairly "stock" - you know, offroad vehicles and/or bikes.

Also Pure is coming out which has taken some of the edge off this (inthe driving arena that is).

[Corleth the Fey]

I must admit, until i see some physics or special effects i'm not too fussed. I mean, i'm assuming the driving will be fairly "stock" - you know, offroad vehicles and/or bikes.

Also Pure is coming out which has taken some of the edge off this is the driving arena that is.

Now Road Rash - I want! I hope it's more like that. Shame those screenshots I posted are just screaming - Doom/Quake! We haven't done anything different Id fans!

[Dimahoo]

Yeah i know - as ever i forget now, but they did mentioned something about max max. It may have been the typical "post apocolyptic" scenario thing but i'm sure there was a driving element to it at the E3 tech demo they were showing.

I must admit, these "brown" games are getting on my tits a bit.

[roadkill]

Please point me to a site that's going to inform and impress me with why one big texture is better than several smaller ones.

It's not uniform in resolution. Some areas can be higher res than others. (It will also load the areas nearer you at a higher resolution than those further away). The major benefit of this is that creating the assets for it is hypothetically much easier.

The whole idea isn't very new or complex at all, it just requires a lot of work to make it work. The amount of dynamic reshuffling of texture memory this will produce is terrifying (though obviously designed to minimise this), and that's quite slow on certain systems.

Personally I'm deeply dubious, but we will see.

[JohnC]

I get the feeling they would've preferred three discs but MS would've charged them more.

That's what was said in the Rage thread when this very matter was discussed in it a week or so ago, yes.

[Raff]

Which makes me think... with the upcoming update for the 360 allowing games to be installed, why can't it have a mandatory install so the textures can be decompressed and whatnot. And for those who don't have live, therefore not being able to get the update this autumn, also include the update on the disk, so all xbox can play it.

You've missed the crucial point entirely. They wanted to put it on 3 DVDs, but Microsoft's licensing structure deters this to the extent that it would cost too much to be worthwhile.

Rather than fannying about with installs and updates, all that needs to happen is for Microsoft E&D to pull its thumb out of its arse.

Because as every sane person knows, changing a disk every 6 hours is not a big deal.

[MK-1601]

Which makes me think... with the upcoming update for the 360 allowing games to be installed, why can't it have a mandatory install so the textures can be decompressed and whatnot.

Because the game would still need more than two DVDs worth of data and the install footprint would be impractically large.

annoying yes but the ps3 version will have way more problems than 2 discs and compressed textures. that shit pad and crap online for a kick off.

Things which don't seem to have hurt GTA4 or COD4's fortunes, but I guess it's all subjective.

Don't see this game being too hot though. No doubt someone else will put the tech to good use.

Maybe you should wait until we know anything at all about how the game plays before trying to predict?

the entire game in a single continuous texture.

Actually each area of the game has a base megatexture; objects in the world will also be separate. </pedant>

Please point me to a site that's going to inform and impress me with why one big texture is better than several smaller ones.

ETQW should help you get the general idea. Being able to have unique texture for every part of the environment gives massively more scope for detail and naturalism. Once you've seen it, tesselating landscape textures (like Oblivion's grass-grass-grass-rock-snow, etc) look incredibly cheesy by comparison.

[mushashi]

Carmack already gave the answers to the questions people are asking.

1. Microsoft denied his request to require mandatory install to a harddrive.

2. Microsoft make it financially unfeasible for him to consider putting the game on more than 2 DVDs as they charge a royalty per disc

3. X360 discs don't have 9GB of usable storage, security and other crap takes up a fair chunk of it, it's more like 6.8GB

[angel]

to be fair though iDs games are fairly easily ignored nowadays

[Wroth]

With all this talk about which version everyone's getting, I'm dissapointed at the complete lack of any mention of the clearly superior PC version.

[SeanR]

With all this talk about which version everyone's getting, I'm dissapointed at the complete lack of any mention of the clearly superior PC version.

Pffft, foolish mortal

PS3 version PWNS j00

So I'm buying a PS3 JUST for this game...

[MK-1601]

to be fair though iDs games are fairly easily ignored nowadays

It's "Id".