Sport Liverpool Football Club

[hub2]

Not a massive Pennant fan but he seems to be lively enough today.

[GC Zombie]

damm lagging feed!

At least you're watching it. I can only find the arse game.

[Stilly]

4-2!

[hub2]

Hah, hattrick!

[Dandy_Sephy]

BENNI HAT TRICK

BAM!

about time too

[Liquid Myth]

To be fair to Liverpool, they are playing against Havant AND Waterlooville!

I like that one.

[Twyford]

Yossi's Giants.

[hub2]

That's sealed it then. No Torres or Gerrard required.

[Dandy_Sephy]

That's sealed it then. No Torres or Gerrard required.

Thank christ. benitez must have given them the hairdryer treatment

[hub2]

I think he'll get another. He was very close a few minutes ago.

[Das]

Lucas has shown real class today. Best player on the pitch.

[Dandy_Sephy]

No, thank Yossi.

Quite

[ras el hanout]

No actually, I didn't read that today. I read that back in November when I was busy telling you all not to be fooled by the hoo-hah revolving around Rafa's press conference. But feel free to keep accusing me of being fickle, and lead by the opinion of others. I also said that you should find that interview in its entirety. It's online in video form, maybe you should look it up. I was cringing throughout the whole thing.

Look, ramone. I don't want to fall out with you again because believe it or not I respect your opinion. I rarely agree with it but I respect it because it's clear to me that it is your own. I'd appreciate it if you could credit me with the ability to form my own opinions rather than accusing me of going along with popular opinion. I've read loads about this and not just recently. I've not been happy with them since May.

As for crying about them taking money out of their other franchises/clubs to give to us: I don't think that needs addressing; it's clear that will never happen, seeings as they secured the club with a loan, then went on to secure a further loan for the stadium against the club's assets. £105m debt secured against the club. Even under Moores, things were never that bad. And under Moores the manager still had the same amount of money to spend and knew that his job was secure. These fellas have taken over, promising us so much but delivering nothing, so far. Maybe that will change but looking at their history as owners of sporting institutions I think it is more likely that it will not. I hope I'm wrong on that score but I think our best bet is to hope DIC get them out and do things the right way.

But for example yesterday Hicks is going on about how important it is to win the title. You don't quote that one. This whole owner thing, we don't really know what's going on and it annoys me because if you doubt Rafa it's because you're easily swayed by the sensationlist media. But you're fine to doubt the owners.

And the new stadium looks super-duper.

[dogsout]

But for example yesterday Hicks is going on about how important it is to win the title. You don't quote that one. This whole owner thing, we don't really know what's going on and it annoys me because if you doubt Rafa it's because you're easily swayed by the sensationlist media. But you're fine to doubt the owners.

And the new stadium looks super-duper.

Actions speak louder than words, ramone. So far all they've done is talk. The last stadium plans they unveiled looked good as well remember. I've never accused you of being swayed by the media with your opinions either.

[Warszawa]

The owners have lied so far.

No more money than usual.

Debt piled on.

They've also shown themselves vile and incompetent by talking to someone who's never managed a proper football team before and broadcast that to the world. You only need to look at the way Hicks' US sports teams are run to find out a thing or two about what he considers 'success'.

[dogsout]

I agree about Yossi, but not when he's played out wide. He's good there but he's not amazing. He plays much better behind the striker. Given the current form of our second strikers maybe Rafa should give him a go there. I'd like to see him given a run in the team behind Torres.

Who agrees with me now?

[ras el hanout]

Well they are building a stadium which is why we needed them in the first place but they do seem totally incompetent. I mean, why that shit with the stadium? Why tell us we're not getting the one we didn't even ask for. The new one looks awesome.

You should be happy with them as I reckon they'll stick with Rafa now simply to appease the fans - and fork out for Mascherano, a player we don't really need. More clued owners would have sacked him off.

[ras el hanout]

Who agrees with me now?

Me!

[dogsout]

Well they are building a stadium which is why we needed them in the first place but they do seem totally incompetent. I mean, why that shit with the stadium? Why tell us we're not getting the one we didn't even ask for. The new one looks awesome.

You should be happy with them as I reckon they'll stick with Rafa now simply to appease the fans - and fork out for Mascherano, a player we don't really need. More clued owners would have sacked him off.

I don't want them to make decisions to appease the fans. I want them to act in the best interests of the club. Backing Rafa may or may not be in the club's best interests. Loading it with debt definitely isn't. Only £105m is secured against the club. The rest is secured against Kop Holdings Group. There's a problem there; Kop Holdings has no assets and if the banks come knocking they can just default on the debt and it'll go back to the club. The same thing happened with the Stars and they're now $200 million in the red.

Fuck it, anyway. There isn't a thing we can do about it but voice our opinions. I think the most positive thing we can do at the moment is get behind the team and wait and see what happens off the pitch.

So, yeah... If we keep playing 4-4-1-1 then Yossi and Torres upfront please, Rafa.

----------------Reina

Finnan----Carra--Sami--Arbeloa

Pennant--Stevie--Masch--Babel

--------------Yossi

------------------Torres

For the next game please.

Edit: Masch is suspended, is he not? Xabi in for him then.

[Wallpaper]

Why do you guys need a new stadium? Is it just capacity or is Anfield falling apart?

[dogsout]

Capacity. With the fan base we have, we could be making much, much more on a match day than we currently do.

[ras el hanout]

Where's Kewell gone? He's not injured again is he ffs?

[dogsout]

I don't know. As far as I'm aware he's injury free. He's been poor in his last couple of appearances and always looks fucked by the start of the second half. He doesn't have long to win that contract extension now.

[Kelthink]

Barnsley! Man. I actually would've hoped for Arsenal or Man Utd just to get a strong opponent, but they're facing each other off. Ho-hum.

[ras el hanout]

From The Daily Mirror

David Maddock 28/01/2008

This game was supposed to be about the gulf between the haves and the Havants. Instead, a quite remarkable FA Cup tie served merely to highlight what it is Liverpool simply don't have right now.

It seems almost churlish to dwell on the Premier League side's failings when their non-league opponents performed so miraculously. So bravely. So brilliantly. Yet the approach of the tiny Blue Square South side put into context what is going so badly wrong at Anfield.

There weren't just five leagues and 123 places between these two sides, there was a whole world separating them. That was established by Havant's wonderfully refreshing attitude from the first whistle to the last.

They may have led twice and pushed their illustrious opponents to the limit, and they may have scared the death out of Liverpool by seriously threatening the biggest shock in the competition's history. Yet still they managed to enjoy themselves and the moment...and that was almost the biggest humiliation of all for the home side.

AdvertisementListen to their captain and midfield inspiration Jamie Collins describing the hilarious events as the end of the game approached, when Steven Gerrard was sent on as a late substitute for Liverpool. Only then can you truly understand the gap between the two sides - and the state that Rafael Benitez's team are in.

"When he came on I was standing next to him at a corner and the first thing I said to him was 'can I have your shirt?' He just laughed and replied: 'Sorry, the little man has already beaten you to it,' talking about Alfie Potter," Collins smiled.

"Then, as the Kop was singing You'll Never Walk Alone, I couldn't help myself and joined in. I was singing it at the top of my voice and he looked at me like I was a weirdo, like I was an alien. But then I don't suppose he gets that too much in the Premier League!

"Then I turned around and told him about what he did to me. I'm a West Ham fan and I was at Cardiff two years ago when he scored that 30-yard screamer in the last minute of the final. I said to him, 'You broke my heart'. I don't suppose I was ever going to break his! "We were just determined to enjoy it.

Singing You'll Never Walk Alone along with 40,000 people is something we'll never do again and it was magical.

We were like fans coming into Anfield on the coach. We all had our video cameras out and to get clapped off by the Kop at the end of such an incredible day was unreal."

The race for Gerrard's shirt was almost as competitive as Havant's approach during this epic contest. As Havant midfielder Shaun Wilkinson explained, the minnows did have a plan...but that went out of the window when swaps were made at the end. "We agreed before the game that the 16 players would get their 16 shirts and we would draw numbers out of the hat because that would be the fairest way," he said.

"But Alfie got Gerrard's and I don't think he's giving that one up. Someone else got Jamie Carragher to sign his, so he said he's not letting that go. Jamie Collins is a West Ham fan and he got Mascherano's. I was on the bench at the end and I went for Torres, but he was surrounded."

Yet amid all that, on 88 minutes to be precise, only a fabulous reflex save by Liverpool keeper Charles Itandje denied the visitors the goal that would have made the score 4-3.

As Wilkinson added: "We are fit but they are fitter because all they live for is football, football, football. So we knew tiredness would play a part. But we kept our discipline and rode our luck and achieved an amazing feat."

It WAS amazing. But what does it say about Liverpool? In the first half there was a look of fear on their faces and not one player in the starting 11 was prepared to step up and take responsibility. Before Yossi Benayoun equalised for a second time on the stroke of half-time, there was a feeling in the air that history could be made. In truth, Liverpool were pathetic.

Who must take the blame for that? The players, of course, because they were woeful. They lacked character, they lacked desire, they lacked leadership. But the manager has to start taking his share of the blame too.

If he gets Javier Mascherano before the end of the transfer window, as owner Tom Hicks promised yesterday, then he will have been given £50million NET by the American owners to spend in less than six months.

He has invested that in a massively expensive squad, but they are a frightened team devoid of confidence.

Without Gerrard and Fernando Torres they are so ordinary it is painful.

And yet Liverpool fans have pushed themselves into a corner because of their knee-jerk reaction to American ownership in recent weeks.

When Hicks admitted he had spoken to Jurgen Klinsmann, it roused fans into protests insisting Benitez must stay. Yet those same supporters are now beginning to wonder whether the Spaniard is the man for the job.

In demonstrating their anger against the Americans, they have offered unconditional support to Benitez who is now fireproof, even though his record does not stand up to scrutiny.

It is a perverse situation but then Liverpool fans have always been perverse. The only hope now is that - with the Anfield ownership issue settled for the time being - things can settle down sufficiently to allow Benitez to concentrate on his job.

Perhaps all the behind-the-scenes politics have taken the manager's eye off the ball. If so, then he needs to refix his gaze because his team is in danger of becoming a laughing stock.

On Saturday we laughed WITH Havant because their fairytale story was so refreshing and they played their part with such infectious enthusiasm.

But we laughed AT Liverpool and given the proud history of this club, that is a sorry state of affairs.

This is my current concern.

[Graham S]

Only £105m is secured against the club. The rest is secured against Kop Holdings Group. There's a problem there; Kop Holdings has no assets and if the banks come knocking they can just default on the debt and it'll go back to the club.

Is this true? If that can happen, how is the additional debt not secured on the club?

[dogsout]

Hicks did the same thing with the Dallas Stars, whilst insisting the debt was secured against the holding company rather than the franchise. They've fallen to such mediocrity that the holding company couldn't keep up with the repayments and defaulted on the debt, all of which was subsequently shifted on to the Dallas Stars' books.

[dogsout]

From The Daily Mirror

David Maddock 28/01/2008

This is my current concern.

That article does a good job of highlighting exactly what some of us mean when we refer to media outlets as sensationalists;

Liverpool fans have always been perverse?

None of the starting 11 took responsibility yet Yossi scored a hat-trick.

He either can't count or hasn't done his research because Rafa's net spend would actually be £40.3M in the last 6 months, and that doesn't include the £9.6M we'll be recouping with the sale of Momo.

I'm sure this fella has written loads of articles about how ordinary Arsenal look without Adebayor and Fabregas, and the same with the Mancs and Ronaldo and Rooney.

Before you accuse me of going too much in the opposite direction: I've already said I am worried by our form, and have been for some time. I've also said I am starting to doubt Rafa's ability to instill the confidence required for a successful challenge in the Premiership. There's no doubt in my mind that the manager and players have been adversely affected by all of this nonsense, and as I've said time and time again: there are sections of the media that can't wait to twist the knife. However, it is clear that for whatever reason we have under performed in the league and that isn't good enough. Rafa deserves some stick for that, it just annoys me that so many journalists see fit to write half truths and fiction when they should be operating in facts. After all, if he's doing such a bad job, the facts should be (and are in places) pretty glaring.

[Kelthink]

That guy is extraordinarily retarded. Nothing without Gerrard and Torres? We've played some duff games with them playing, so obviously they aren't 'the magic touch' that some media dipshits keep spouting. And £50 million net spend given? We earned £32 million from the Champions' League run so that's a load of fuckin' arse.

[Warszawa]

Net spend since the Yanks came in so far is about £23m, if I recall correctly. That was prior to the Skrtel purchase & Sissoko's departure. If Mascherano comes in it'll take the net spend to about £35m. If Carson, Riise & Crouch depart in the summer as expected, we're going to be on about -£20m from the get-go for next season. I think that in the summer Everton had a higher net outlay, and Spurs are on the verge of spending the best part of £15m this window on Woodgate & Hutton.

I'm interested in us being linked with Aimar - He's not been in the limelight as much of late, but he could be wonderful foil for Torres for us.