Sport Liverpool Football Club

[SomeNaiveChump]

Rafa's rotation system....ring any bells? Please leave the thread before you spout even more shit.

If he's in rotation for the first team then he is a first team striker, yes?

Well, Pizarro isn't in rotation for the first team at Chelsea. He is fifth choice and will never play if everyone is fit. He is many classes below their other strikers and yet many classes above Voronin. Hence 39 points.

[dizogg]

Benayoun is top class. He's Israel's best player and he's skillful, quick and a professional. And a fuckload better than Sidwell, for instance.

[Das]

If he's in rotation for the first team then he is a first team striker, yes?

Well, Pizarro isn't in rotation for the first team at Chelsea. He is fifth choice and will never play if everyone is fit. He is many classes below their other strikers and yet many classes above Voronin. Hence 39 points.

Pizarro is a first team striker. Would he play for the reserves if everyone was fit? No, he'd be on the bench. He is a FIRST TEAM striker.

[SomeNaiveChump]

Once again, Sidwell plays in a different position and is NOWHERE NEAR the Chelsea first team barring massive injury + Africa Nations problems. Benayoun is first choice for Liverpool.

Benayoun can play in several positions, so - which one of Joe Cole, Malouda, SWP, Lampard or Ballack would he displace from a Chelsea squad?

[SomeNaiveChump]

Pizarro is a first team striker. Would he play for the reserves if everyone was fit? No, he'd be on the bench. He is a FIRST TEAM striker.

He wouldn't get anywhere near the bench, ever, with everyone fit. There are four strikers clearly ahead of him in the pecking order. This is not complicated.

[Das]

Once again, Sidwell plays in a different position and is NOWHERE NEAR the Chelsea first team barring massive injury + Africa Nations problems. Benayoun is first choice for Liverpool.

I don't think you understand what "FIRST TEAM" means. I think you mean STARTING ELEVEN, don't you?

[SomeNaiveChump]

I don't think you understand what "FIRST TEAM" means. I think you mean STARTING ELEVEN, don't you?

With everyone fit, Sidwell would never even make the bench. Ever. You still think that qualifies him as a 'first team' player who is fair game for comparison with Mascherano or Gerrard? Or are you just making it up as you go along?

[V3zna]

O'Shea is as good as Finnan. Eboue is better. Pizarro is much, much better than Voronin.

See also: O'Shea doesn't get anywhere near the Man Utd team and Pizarro doesn't get anywhere near the Chelsea team, with everyone fit.

Benayoun and Voronin are FIRST CHOICE players for Liverpool, hence 39 points.

To be fair I should have used Wes Brown rather than O'Shea as an example. But if you think O'Shea / Brown are as good as Finnan and Eboue is better then you're either blind, retarded or both.

[Das]

He wouldn't get anywhere near the bench, ever, with everyone fit. There are four strikers clearly ahead of him in the pecking order. This is not complicated.

Voronin doesn't make the bench sometimes. What does that mean?

[Das]

With everyone fit, Sidwell would never even make the bench. Ever. You still think that qualifies him as a 'first team' player who is fair game for comparison with Mascherano or Gerrard? Or are you just making it up as you go along?

He is a fucking FIRST TEAM player. He plays in the FIRST TEAM. Just because he is a ginger retard who sits on the bench unless you have lots of injuries, he is still a FIRST TEAM player. Jesus wept.

[V3zna]

O'Shea blatantly would get a game. He's better than Hyppia and as good as Finnan. He may not be spectacular but never lets anybody down. He's also a fuck load better than post injury Heinze at both CB and FB. The lad also scores last minute winning goals at away grounds

O'Shea is simply not and never will be as good as Finnan. He's not even in the same league as the current Hyppia never mind the one in his prime. When you look back at the best right backs the Premier League has seen then fair enough, Gary Neville is the best, but I would put Finnan in second place. Such a consistant player at both Fulham and Liverpool.

Stop trolling with the last minute goals bullshit as well you wanker. This is the Liverpool thread, not the general football one.

[SomeNaiveChump]

To be fair I should have used Wes Brown rather than O'Shea as an example. But if you think O'Shea / Brown are as good as Finnan and Eboue is better then you're either blind, retarded or both.

Once again, O'Shea and Brown are NOT first choice players. Finnan IS. What is difficult about this? The Liverpool equivalents of O'Shea and Brown are Fabio Aurelio and Jack Hobbs.

Eboue (and Sagna for that matter) is clearly better than any of the above apart from maybe Brown. This is one of the reasons Arsenal are 12 points clear of you.

[SomeNaiveChump]

He is a fucking FIRST TEAM player. He plays in the FIRST TEAM. Just because he is a ginger retard who sits on the bench unless you have lots of injuries, he is still a FIRST TEAM player. Jesus wept.

Um, no he isn't. If he's a first team player then let's wheel out Hobbs, Leto and El Zhar as Liverpool first teamers. Fun for everyone!

[Das]

Once again, O'Shea and Brown are NOT first choice players. Finnan IS. What is difficult about this? The Liverpool equivalents of O'Shea and Brown are Fabio Aurelio and Jack Hobbs.

Eboue is clearly better than any of the above apart from maybe Brown. This is one of the reasons Arsenal are 12 points clear of you.

Oh, so you're using "First choice" now, are you? Well done, that's much clearer...but unfortunately you're still talking absolute bollocks.

The Liverpool equivalents are actually Hyypia and Arbeloa who are both better than Brown and O'Shea.

[SomeNaiveChump]

Oh, so you're using "First choice" now, are you? Well done, that's much clearer...but unfortunately you're still talking absolute bollocks.

The Liverpool equivalents are actually Hyypia and Arbeloa who are both better than Brown and O'Shea.

So why are you on 39 points again?

And have you ever seen O'Shea do a Bramble like Arbeloa did on Saturday?

[Das]

So why are you on 39 points again?

Erm...why are you still in the "Liverpool Football Club" thread, trolling. I've already told you to fuck off.

[SomeNaiveChump]

Because you comics are maintaining that you should be doing well and being rock solid top four with Voronin and Benayoun in the team.

[Graham S]

Sami Hyypia admitted that speculation over the club's future is beginning to affect the players. "In football things can happen very quickly but the players hope that, if there are arguments, they can be sorted out," Hyypia said. "We seem to be becoming like Newcastle. Every time we pick up a paper there seems to be something new."

"Becoming like Newcastle." My worst fears are being realised.

[Das]

Because you comics are maintaining that you should be doing well and being rock solid top four with Voronin and Benayoun in the team.

Oh fuck off, seriously.

[Guest]

Let's be honest Sidwell is too ginger to be good. The only good ginger player ever was Paul Scholes and he went mental near the end.

[V3zna]

Because you comics are maintaining that you should be doing well and being rock solid top four with Voronin and Benayoun in the team.

You'll not find much support for Voronin in this thread but Benayoun has a half decent pedigree, that's undeniable. He's not in the same league as Ronaldo or Hleb but then again few are.

[Das]

You'll not find much support for Voronin in this thread but Benayoun has a half decent pedigree, that's undeniable. He's not in the same league as Ronaldo or Hleb but then again few are.

Most definitely. I actually think Voronin is shit, but he's not as shit as Pizarro. He's had a few decent games and scored a few goals where as Pizarro has done nothing apart from claim a goal that bounced off the back of a goalkeepers head.

[SomeNaiveChump]

Most definitely. I actually think Voronin is shit, but he's not as shit as Pizarro. He's had a few decent games and scored a few goals where as Pizarro has done nothing apart from claim a goal that bounced off the back of a goalkeepers head.

If you would look back further than a couple of months, you'd find that Pizarro's pedigree is way stronger than Voronin's. Also if Pizarro had started as many games as Voronin this season, who's to say he wouldn't have made a stronger contribution?

[Guest]

You'll not find much support for Voronin in this thread but Benayoun has a half decent pedigree, that's undeniable. He's not in the same league as Ronaldo or Hleb but then again few are.

Indeed, while I named checked, etc, I don't believe he's good enough from what he's shown...or MAYBE he's not played enough! Wouldn't be a surprise.

Hleb was awful when he first came to Arsenal. He'd lose the ball more often that Jimmy White.

I think we CAN say that Liverpool don't have quite the squad/team that the other teams do? Or do people disagree and think they're as good as Man U/Chelsea/Arse.

It would be interesting (aka sad rubbish) to do a Starting 11/Top 16 or so comparison (11+5 subs) and see how the dice falls. Who wants to! GO!

[SomeNaiveChump]

You'll not find much support for Voronin in this thread but Benayoun has a half decent pedigree, that's undeniable. He's not in the same league as Ronaldo or Hleb but then again few are.

Well yes, but if you want to compete as part of the big four, he will *have* to be in the same league as Ronaldo, Giggs, Joe Cole, Malouda, Hleb, Rosicky.

And so will Kewell/Riise come to think of it. Not to even mention anywhere else on the pitch.

[Guest]

He's had a few decent games and scored a few goals where as Pizarro has done nothing apart from claim a goal that bounced off the back of a goalkeepers head.

To do that takes some skill to be fair.

[V3zna]

Well yes, but if you want to compete as part of the big four, he will *have* to be in the same league as Ronaldo, Giggs, Joe Cole, Malouda, Hleb, Rosicky.

I've talked about this outside of this forum many times. The options to purchase top class widemen are severely limited right now, especially with financial constraints. These players just don't exist. All the premium wingers are snapped up and at top clubs. We are going to have to unearth an unknown gem or use a system that plays to our strengths using the current personnel.

For what it is worth the only winger out there that I can see that might meet our needs is Roma's Mancini. That's very debateable though.

Is it me or is there a lot of editing going on in this thread?

[bowser123]

To be fair I should have used Wes Brown rather than O'Shea as an example. But if you think O'Shea / Brown are as good as Finnan and Eboue is better then you're either blind, retarded or both.

Stop trolling with the last minute goals bullshit as well you wanker. This is the Liverpool thread, not the general football one.

Aw, come on, it was very light hearted and hardly trolling considering all the other stuff in there. Ignore that and address the rest.

Like I said, both O'Shea and Brown are miles more consistent and reliable than Hyppia, not to mention much more versatile. Hyppia used to be fantastic but he aint now. You seen either player be as vulnerable as Sammi this season? You (well, maybe not you personally, but LFC) wanted to sign Heinze. I know for a fact, that post injury, both O'Shea and Brown were miles better.

In retrospect I have done Finnan a disservice. He has many of the same qualities of Neville, and maybe just like Irwin of years ago is steady, isn't recognized by opponent fans. That said, I certainly haven't towards Hyypia.

So why are you on 39 points again?

I'm curious, too.

Maybe the manager is shite? If the squad is as strong as they claim (best around was said earlier in the thread), that Liverpool rotate as much as other sides then maybe the manager is fucking up by rotating for the wrong games? Or he's swapping the wrong players?.

What I found interesting was Torres was dropped for Birmingham, a game they drew at home. Yet he played in the League Cup a week later. Fair enough, he's taking the LC seriously. So why the weak team against a much stronger Chelsea side in the LC?

I'm just amazed that the likes of Kuyt (surely the worlds greatest defensive striker) and Benayoun are being defended. That stat still amazes me- Sunderland have obtained more wins and points at home than Liverpool. Those players Disciple listed sure aren't good enough against top sides. You've lost (and conceded) so few and drew so many, it strikes me that those players aren't even good enough to beat average Premiership sides.

My take is Rafa has roughly spent as much as Ferguson, the problem is it's been £6M here, £8M there on second choice players. Ferguson has been able to identify a player and get him. They've paid more, but bought fewer players of a much higher quality. £27M on Rooney... Crouch, Morientes, Kuyt, Bellamy cost broadly the same, are they better players? Was Cisse a Houllier signing? I think you can look through the team and find things like this.

I'm genuinely intrigued.

[Takizawa]

O'Shea is as good as Finnan.

[Takizawa]

He wouldn't get anywhere near the bench, ever, with everyone fit. There are four strikers clearly ahead of him in the pecking order. This is not complicated.

Now they've signed Anelka you mean..?

Wow these last few pages are full of comedy nonsense, O'Shea as good as Finnan