The old Man Utd Thread

[Oh Danny Boy]

I have to say I get annyoed when people come out with rubbish as musehunter has, saying Ronaldo singlehandedly won the league and european cup last year. It's just ludicrous. Ronaldo is a fantastic player but as the stats show, Utd have got over losing better ones than him. I still classify Cantona as a better player than Ronaldo.

If Ronaldo wasn't playing in your squad you wouldn't have come close to winning them both. Ronaldo's magic has constantly won you games you otherwise wouldn't have, and his goals have constantly made up for your lack of potency up front. Throughout that season i saw a very good squad who achieved what they did because of Ronaldo, who was during that season the best player in the world. The man was beating teams single handedly, if it wasn't for him Chelsea would have won the league and european cup double, no doubts about it.

[Lucky]

The man was beating teams single handedly, if it wasn't for him Chelsea would have won the league and european cup double, no doubts about it.

Just a small point, I hear what you're saying about the league, but surely Ronaldo didn't have much to do with Barca knocking Chelsea out and going on to win the CL.

[Oh Danny Boy]

Just a small point, I hear what you're saying about the league, but surely Ronaldo didn't have much to do with Barca knocking Chelsea out and going on to win the CL.

i meant the season before last

[Lucky]

i meant the season before last

In that case I agree with you

[DC Lemon]

The man was beating teams single handedly...

And lest we forget, he also single-handedly won the World Cup and Euro 2008 for Portugal.

[Liamness]

I think when Park has had a run of games, he looks incredible. Definately a first teamer for me.

[MojoChin]

If Ronaldo wasn't playing in your squad you wouldn't have come close to winning them both. Ronaldo's magic has constantly won you games you otherwise wouldn't have, and his goals have constantly made up for your lack of potency up front. Throughout that season i saw a very good squad who achieved what they did because of Ronaldo, who was during that season the best player in the world. The man was beating teams single handedly, if it wasn't for him Chelsea would have won the league and european cup double, no doubts about it.

Ronaldo certainly helped but he did not win anything single handedly. Also, if we did not have Ronaldo the past couple of years, I'm sure Fergie would have made acquisitions in key areas and worked a formation that worked out of that. Who's to say how many goals Rooney would have got last season if he was playing through the middle. You only have to look at his record for England recently to see he can contribute more up front. With or without Ronaldo I am sure Fergie will work a system out that keeps us winning games. He has done it for 26 years now, Ronaldo has only been at Utd for 6. (1 longer than Cantona by the way.)

[redbloodcell]

I've said it before but I think Carrick was bought in to replace Scholes with the intention of playing Hargreaves alongside him, it's just worked out slightly differently in the end. I agree it is a big season for Anderson and it should be interesting to see where Ferguson plays him.

You should play Carrick next to Anderson if you're going for a 4-4-2.

[MojoChin]

You should play Carrick next to Anderson if you're going for a 4-4-2.

It should be a rotation between them 2 and Fletch I reckon.

[phresh]

If Ronaldo wasn't playing in your squad you wouldn't have come close to winning them both. Ronaldo's magic has constantly won you games you otherwise wouldn't have, and his goals have constantly made up for your lack of potency up front. Throughout that season i saw a very good squad who achieved what they did because of Ronaldo, who was during that season the best player in the world. The man was beating teams single handedly, if it wasn't for him Chelsea would have won the league and european cup double, no doubts about it.

This post only really makes sense if we time travel back to last summer and he leaves then. What point are you actually trying to get across?

His influence this season hasn't been like last and I think most people would agree that it was the lack of goals conceded at the other end of the pitch the won us the title. Without Vidic we would never have gone on however many games it was without conceding and would likely have never got back into the title race.

[ckny]

I still classify Cantona as a better player than Ronaldo.

No way. I love Cantona an unhealthy amount but he's probably not even in Ferguson's best five players. Ronaldo is a better player. He's also better than David Beckham ever was - by a large distance.

I'm excited for next season now. It's a massive, massive blow losing Ronaldo but it opens up so many possibilities. I was thinking today that maybe Rooney will just slip into the Ronaldo role, and he, Tevez and Berbatov will play as the forward three as we played in the Champions League winning season. Then I had a scary thought that Ferguson has Danny Welbeck in mind as his replacement.

[cantonarv]

No way. I love Cantona an unhealthy amount but he's probably not even in Ferguson's best five players. Ronaldo is a better player. He's also better than David Beckham ever was - by a large distance.

I'm excited for next season now. It's a massive, massive blow losing Ronaldo but it opens up so many possibilities. I was thinking today that maybe Rooney will just slip into the Ronaldo role, and he, Tevez and Berbatov will play as the forward three as we played in the Champions League winning season. Then I had a scary thought that Ferguson has Danny Welbeck in mind as his replacement.

Cantona = King.

End of.

[FATEone]

Actually I'm just someone who likes to come in here to discuss football, which I generally do in a fairly polite manner. I'm not quite sure what you're basing that analysis on as I'm never hugely confrontational or abusive and most of the time do my best to ignore the trolling, moreso than most so I don't see how a couple of (not wholly unreasonable) comments on your posts amounts to me being an "evil little s**t" or any of the contents of the other rant. If your arguments were more cohesive and less abusive you might get a better reception, as coming into a United thread (or indeed any team's thread) time and again and going "Your team is shit, your players are cocks and all the fans of said team are inbred, smelly wankers! Right, now here are my thoughts on football... you c**ts!" isn't going to persuade anyone of anything except that you are looking to pick fights on the internet, which is pointless. Surely if you feel that strongly about something it's better to actually discuss it with people and try and make them see your point of view in a straightforward manner, rather than undermining any point you may have by surrounding it with unfocused anger and insults which can make you come across a little like the Chickenhawk from Foghorn Leghorn cartoons.

Best Player in the World my hole!

Best Player at getting the ball and shooting no matter where he is on the pitch, or what foot its on, despite any other options that might be there. Oh and scoring 1 out of every 10 shots against any team outside the top 6.

The thing is though, that has been Utd's tactic for the last 2 years, so what the fuck are you gonna do now?

I expect to see Rooney back at his best again or even better, he seemed to be stifled recently with Ronaldo there. That still leaves the problem of having no wingers, central midfielders (well Anderson could push on), right back, or keeper. That £80mill won't go far.

Ronaldo will make Real no where near what Beckham did. And Beckham is and was by far a better player.

You lot make me laugh, it's like the only players that exist are attackers or something? Considering the amount of time you spend sitting behind the ball against any decent team, I'd have thought you'd be more inclined to acknowledge that a footballer who can defend, or pass for that matter holds as much importance as one who can shoot and score.

So where exactly did I do that?

[fatbob]

In the post that was removed for being offensive?

[FATEone]

Great to see Fateone back In the thread

To suggest our entire team has been built around Ronaldo shooting from wherever he likes for the past two years is bordering on the insane. Ignoring that his strike rate this season was more or less the same as 2 years ago we quite simply wouldn’t have won anything were that the case.

I appreciate that you have tried to back up your point with statistics but can you use

 tags to try and make it readable.

Obviously I'm exaggerating and taking the micky a bit, but the point I'm making is, don't all go on like it's no loss when clearly he has been the difference for you in a lot of games, whether he's a team player or not, which for the past two years he hasn't been. The season you won the league again after Chelsea bought it 2 years running, he was looking like an amazing player, cos he was doing what a winger should do, exceptionally well, with some sick goals thrown in and all. Then he decided he was the best and duely went about proving it, at the expense of an all round game.

[FATEone]

In the post that was removed for being offensive?

No.

That's the first thing I posted, then he came out with his bollocks, and I got annoyed, and became offensive, wrongly. But I'm sick of people going 'oh you're an undercover Liverpool fan' and shit of that nature instead of explaining to me how I might be wrong.

[ckny]

I only skim read the thread the day it was announced, but did anyone really say we wouldn't miss Ronaldo? If they did they're deluded. We're going to miss his enormously. The thought of who we could bring in and the possibilities for next season are exciting though.

[Liamness]

Yeah, he's a great player, any club would be better off with his services. Doesn't mean he's worth £80m though.

[FATEone]

You know what I'm close to giving up here, to many of you lot's delight I'm sure. Why is Ronaldo a better player than Beckham? I'm asking for a meaningful list of reasons please. I have never ever seen Ronaldo tear up a good team. In fact he always goes missing against the best teams. Whereas I remember Real Madrid pissing Utd off the park, and just to let you know, I always support English teams against foreign ones, until Beckham came off the bench. He was outstanding, created everything for Utd and you won the game 4-3 if I remember correctly. That's the ltrue test of a great player, if he can do it when it really matters or not. Ronaldo hasn't done that yet.

[Liamness]

Ronaldo weighs about 180 pounds, apparently. A pound of pure gold costs a bit less than £1000 on the market today. So, if we divide £80m by £180k, we find that Real Madrid have paid for Ronaldo about 50 times his weight in gold.

[ckny]

Ronaldo absolutely blitzed Arsenal in two Champions League semi finals. He was brilliant when we stuffed Roma 7-0. I still think he was great in the Champions League Final against Chelsea. Against Inter he was brilliant this season. He put in great shifts in the wins over Liverpool and Arsenal at the tail end of last season, scoring in both IIRC. Putting in a man of the match performance against a so called bigger team isn't all that important anyway. Consistency throughout a season is, and Ronaldo had that for us.

Reasons why he's better than Beckham? He scored 42 goals last season, 26 in this. He has better technical ability on the ball, blistering pace and puts the shits up any full back in the world. Nobody can pass or cross a ball better than David Beckham, even now. But Ronaldo's intricacy and skill, speed and awareness, power and goalscoring threat make him a better player. In my opinion, that is. And no, I wont be posting reams of statistics to argue my case. Unless Fifa issues every manager and captain with dossiers on each player before they cast their World Player of the Year vote.

[FATEone]

Ronaldo absolutely blitzed Arsenal in two Champions League semi finals. He was brilliant when we stuffed Roma 7-0. I still think he was great in the Champions League Final against Chelsea. Against Inter he was brilliant this season. He put in great shifts in the wins over Liverpool and Arsenal at the tail end of last season, scoring in both IIRC. Putting in a man of the match performance against a so called bigger team isn't all that important anyway. Consistency throughout a season is, and Ronaldo had that for us.

Reasons why he's better than Beckham? He scored 42 goals last season, 26 in this. He has better technical ability on the ball, blistering pace and puts the shits up any full back in the world. Nobody can pass or cross a ball better than David Beckham, even now. But Ronaldo's intricacy and skill, speed and awareness, power and goalscoring threat make him a better player. In my opinion, that is. And no, I wont be posting reams of statistics to argue my case. Unless Fifa issues every manager and captain with dossiers on each player before they cast their World Player of the Year vote.

I wasn't asking for statistics, but what you gave. They're fair points to a degree. But Arsenal, or Roma aren't 'best' teams status and I'm sorry, but as I said to everyone in here before the Inter game neither are Inter. Please tell me how he has intricacy or awareness. He does not play any kind of defence splitting passes, or even looks for them. He has speed, power, and a shot. His Skills have become redundant, nowadays he does 6 step overs and passes it backwards if he can't find half a yard for a shot. You're doing Becks a diservice an' all, by overlooking all the work he does off the ball, something Ronaldo doesn't understand in English or Portuguese.

[Marzipan Travolta]

Looks like Valencia is close to a done deal. £16m.

http://www.football365.co.uk/story/0,17033...5376570,00.html

Looks like it's been their intention for a while, as we suspected.

[oli]

Looks like Valencia is close to a done deal. £16m.

http://www.football365.co.uk/story/0,17033...5376570,00.html

Looks like it's been their intention for a while, as we suspected.

I get the impression that Valenica was on the cards whether Ronaldo left or not

[phresh]

Yeah, it always looked like he'd be coming at some point. Will be really interesting to see how he does at United, his goal scoring record isn't great at Wigan (who's is?!) but he's quick and skillfull and will defend too. I'd rather have him on the pitch than Nani to be honest.

The one thing the Ronaldo sale has done, much like ckny has said is to make the transfer window a lot more exciting for us. I don't think Fergie will go crazy buying players, there isn't any point but it will be interesting to see if he goes for a fairly straight replacement (in Ribery) or trys to adapt the team to a more Barcalona like formation with someone like Benzema. I also think Ribery's age will count against him and some reports have suggested as such. I'd take Benzema in a heartbeat, and at 21 (?) you can still mould him to the style of the team. Benzema/Berbatov(or Tevez maybe)/Rooney would be an electric frontline.

[oli]

Yeah, it always looked like he'd be coming at some point. Will be really interesting to see how he does at United, his goal scoring record isn't great at Wigan (who's is?!) but he's quick and skillfull and will defend too. I'd rather have him on the pitch than Nani to be honest.

The one thing the Ronaldo sale has done, much like ckny has said is to make the transfer window a lot more exciting for us. I don't think Fergie will go crazy buying players, there isn't any point but it will be interesting to see if he goes for a fairly straight replacement (in Ribery) or trys to adapt the team to a more Barcalona like formation with someone like Benzema. I also think Ribery's age will count against him and some reports have suggested as such. I'd take Benzema in a heartbeat, and at 21 (?) you can still mould him to the style of the team. Benzema/Berbatov(or Tevez maybe)/Rooney would be an electric frontline.

I read somewhere that Munich said if Ronaldo was worth £80m then Ribery was worth £90m. Ferguson should go to a meeting with Munich and just sit there with his tongue firmly pressed into his chin for an hour then just get up and leave

[phresh]

Bayern are just trying to up his price tag knowing that a bid will probably come in from somewhere. His valuation also fails to take into account that the marketability of that ugly git is nothing like that of Ronaldo's, which is one of the main reasons his transfer fee was so high.

[El Pibe]

Ronaldo is not exactly a looker!!

[fatbob]

I think Bayern might be pricing Ribery out of the market for us, especially when combined with the fact that at 26 he is close to peaking already. Its a shame, he one of, if not my favourtie players around at the moment, and his style of play and personality would be a perfect fit for us I feel. With Rooney taking up a more central role, Ribery coming in behind on the left or right would be a mouth watering prospect.

If you believe the Raf H at the Guardian we've already had bids of £50 million + rejected, I doubt we will go higher than that, as thats bonkers as it is.

Thing is; Ribery wants out, but Bayern are no fools and know that while Real, City, Chelsea and now United have serious swinging dicks they are going to try and squeeze every million they can out of him, its a sellers market for them, one of the most profitable teams around. However, I think that as the summer goes on the price will go down. Ribery also wants to go somewhere hot(ter - than Munich pressumedly?), and I think Barca would be his first choice, but I don't know if they will bid for him unless they make some major changes, Real will bid for him, probably a shit-load so its down to whether he just wants to be another name on the roster behind Ronaldo, Kaka and Villa or go somewhere else and push up the world rankings as the star player. City will probably bid for him, and even meet Munich's stupid valuation.

I realy want Ribery, but not at the cost of our entire Ronaldo windfall, even though he would pretty much fill his shoes IMO.

Valencia is a good buy, and when you put a talent in a strong team like United they will start to flourish.

The second Tevez decides t go to City then sign up Karim down from Lyon.

Other than that, I doubt SAF will bring in any other big names, we need our right back position strengthening no matter what some people are saying, no matter how good a prospect Rafael is, its a big fucking weak spot that position at the moment, Brown is strong cover for Rio and Vida along with Evans and was never intended as anything else, despite doing great last season. Neville is gone, just gone, and Big John can't cover every postion at once, especially since he'll now be playing on the right wing! Alves would have been the best choice but that is too late, Johnson is a real contender and looks to have the 1st choice role for England tied down, he is consistendly one of the best performing players in the Premiership in that position, write him off at you peril.

[fatbob]

Also, as it now looks that Johnson is going back to Chelsea, that leaves Bosingwa looking for an out possibly, IIRC one of Fergie's long tern targets before he went to London. Bayern are also suppossedly after him, so at the very least could be a small bargaining chip with a view to getting Ribery...