The old Man Utd Thread

[FATEone]

But United have a perfectly good goal dissallowed? Oh, we'll ignore that as it doesn't fit the stereotype...

I think a penalty could have been given for the touch on Gampst, but I do think he went down pretty easily. If someone taps my shoulders when i'm running, my legs don't automatically give way.

well it wasn't a corner in the first place so it's kind of nullified isn't it.

[phresh]

They do show consistency. They consistently punish everyone else, and consistently don't punish Utd.

I probably don't need to remind you that Ferguson has been the only manager to receive a touchline ban for comments on referees this season. Or maybe I do. Anyway, what should the FA be punishing us for?

[phresh]

Pederson went down easily, but he hasn't dived, as there has actually been an infringement! Rafael has pulled him back by the shoulder, that is a Pen. I understand the confusion for you guys, as fouling is an integral part of your defensive technique, but it is against the rules none-the-less.

Anyway Good Luck against Inter, hope you do 'em over and foul the shit out of 'em if you have to, I don't mind it in Europe lol

I'm sorry but if the contact from Rafael doesn't cause him to go down, which it didn't, then it's a dive.

[FATEone]

Gerrard dives just as much as anyone in the Premiership, Ronaldo included.

You're talking out of your arse yet again I see. I've seen Gerrard dive 3 times I think and it pisses me off to a degree I can't even describe, I hate that shit with a passion. But that's it. To compare Ronaldo to him in those terms is ridiculous, the nearest you can get is Drogba, and even then Ronaldo's a head and shoulders above.

[phresh]

Ronaldo will leave a leg in or go down easily yeah, but if it's OK for Pederson it should be OK for Ronaldo right?

[Liamness]

I'm sorry but if the contact from Rafael doesn't cause him to go down, which it didn't, then it's a dive.

The ref was either scared or unsure, the rules say there was illegal contact and he went down though. There's some grey area, but presumably he should at least make a decision.

[phresh]

For that rule to work the illegal contact has to be consistent with him going down, which in this case I don't believe it was. At the end of the day sometimes it would have been given and sometimes the defenders will get away with far worse, I think we can all at least agree that there is a lack of consistency.

[FATEone]

I think he's probably referring to Gerrard's dive a few weeks ago which was almost identical, and as embarassing, as Ronaldo's yesterday.

Defense is going to look a little ropey against Inter if Evans is out. Is Neville fit? He could play center with Rafael or Fletcher on the right.

Inter aren't great defensively though IMO. Utd's best form of defence could be attack. Not a great situation for you lot with the injured defenders though, it's hard to think of a way around it. If Neville's fit then should be fine, if not??? the only other player I honestly believe could competently cover that postion would be Rooney, if Ferdinand marshalled him the whole game and he was disciplined enough to listen and stay.

[phresh]

I think Rooney would agree with you but not so sure about the coaching staff!

[Liamness]

I would suggest, if we really need cover in that area, why not Carrick? He's got the height, pace, tactical awareness, and it's be fun to see him spraying balls around out of defence. Seems like the best out of some bad options. Rooney for me is probably in good competition for our second choice goalkeeper spot, but I dunno about playing him at centre-back. As many have said, our best form of defence may be attack. Just keep them pushed back, we'll be defending so high up the pitch Carrick will feel right at home.

[FATEone]

I'm sorry but if the contact from Rafael doesn't cause him to go down, which it didn't, then it's a dive.

well no it's not. Rafael fouled him, that's a fact. he messed up by going down, you could see his body turn as he was pulled, he should have tried to fight on, that's what I prefer to see, but if he really felt he was being impeded enough to lose the chance he should have just stayed up and stopped to make his appeal to the ref. If the same happens to Ronaldo my opinion is the same, trust me. throwing a leg out to find contact or going over without it is a dive, because your creating a foul that wasn't actually there.

[FATEone]

I probably don't need to remind you that Ferguson has been the only manager to receive a touchline ban for comments on referees this season. Or maybe I do. Anyway, what should the FA be punishing us for?

no you don't. I know he was. but when you have a player that has kicked out at other players I think 5 times this season and nothing is done, people will get the arse about it, especially when others are punished for the exact same thing or sometimes less. You can't say oh the guy had a go at him first, because everyone saw what happened to SWP to make him kick out, and the fact is; that is instantaneously, instinctively reacting to having a ball blasted into you at point blank range, whilst you're on the floor from being fouled. I would say 99% of people would have reacted like that.

[FATEone]

I think Rooney would agree with you but not so sure about the coaching staff!

ability-wise he could. if you watch the way he reads runs and tackles he could definately defend, he would just have to constantly remind himself to stay on his feet and shadow.

[FATEone]

I would suggest, if we really need cover in that area, why not Carrick? He's got the height, pace, tactical awareness, and it's be fun to see him spraying balls around out of defence. Seems like the best out of some bad options. Rooney for me is probably in good competition for our second choice goalkeeper spot, but I dunno about playing him at centre-back. As many have said, our best form of defence may be attack. Just keep them pushed back, we'll be defending so high up the pitch Carrick will feel right at home.

yeah obviously Rooney will never be there, but I reckon he could. you'd lose that threat up front though of course and that's honestly what I believe could get you the result everyone seems to be doubting.

Seriously though, they ain't that good. His Chelsea side were definately better, Adriano is really not a great finisher, and Ibrahimovic best player in the world!? kiss my arse!

Evra V Maicon will be a great battle though I think.

[redbloodcell]

If I were a United fan going into this tie with a makeshift CB pairing I'd be quite worried, Jose's Inter relish counter-attacking football and you can pretty much guarantee he'll target whoever comes in as the weak link. Zlatan looks more determined than he has in ages and even Adriano hasn't looked as much of a mental wreck as he used to the few times I've seen him play this season.

[phresh]

well no it's not. Rafael fouled him, that's a fact. he messed up by going down, you could see his body turn as he was pulled, he should have tried to fight on, that's what I prefer to see, but if he really felt he was being impeded enough to lose the chance he should have just stayed up and stopped to make his appeal to the ref. If the same happens to Ronaldo my opinion is the same, trust me. throwing a leg out to find contact or going over without it is a dive, because your creating a foul that wasn't actually there.

We'll just agree to disagree then. What Pederson should have done is try and get the shot out or actually go down when Rafael really does pull back on him. By going down when he did, and like he did, he made the decision easier for the ref.

[phresh]

If I were a United fan going into this tie with a makeshift CB pairing I'd be quite worried, Jose's Inter relish counter-attacking football and you can pretty much guarantee he'll target whoever comes in as the weak link. Zlatan looks more determined than he has in ages and even Adriano hasn't looked as much of a mental wreck as he used to the few times I've seen him play this season.

If we go in without a recognised centre half then we will play as we did against Barcelona at OT with Ronaldo up front to try and catch them on the break but defend in numbers making counter attacking difficult. Inter have got a few dangerous players but they are nowhere near as good as his Chelsea team so I stil fancy us over the two legs.

[Trigg]

They do show consistency. They consistently punish everyone else, and consistently don't punish Utd.

You have some kind of complexion.

Pederson went down easily, but he hasn't dived, as there has actually been an infringement! Rafael has pulled him back by the shoulder, that is a Pen. I understand the confusion for you guys, as fouling is an integral part of your defensive technique, but it is against the rules none-the-less.

Anyway Good Luck against Inter, hope you do 'em over and foul the shit out of 'em if you have to, I don't mind it in Europe lol

He went down easy, but didn't dive? Ok then, by that reasoning Ronaldo very rarely dives. He does go down easy with minimal contact but thats alright, right?

At the end of the day though, it would have been a very soft penatly in my eyes. Pederson could have carried on the run and had a shot at goal and I think the Ref as thought "he's trying it on here" as lets be honest there really was much contact and the hand brushed the shoulder. It's hardly going to make his feet give way.

well it wasn't a corner in the first place so it's kind of nullified isn't it.

Nope, it wasn't. It was a free kick though.

You're talking out of your arse yet again I see. I've seen Gerrard dive 3 times I think and it pisses me off to a degree I can't even describe, I hate that shit with a passion. But that's it. To compare Ronaldo to him in those terms is ridiculous, the nearest you can get is Drogba, and even then Ronaldo's a head and shoulders above.

No I'm not, just because I don't agree with you totally biased anti Man Utd view doesn't mean I'm talking out of my arse you fool.

He's dived more than 3 times though hasn't he? He just doesn't get the coverage from the media like the foreign player do (Ronaldo/Drogba etc) He dives just as much as anyone else in my opinion and some of them have been a lot more cringe worthy than Ronaldo on Saturday.

----

So, Inter. Well, O'Shea's injury was some brusing on the heel I think so he might well be ready for Tuesday, So that could be a back four of Rafael, Rio, O'Shea and Evra which in the grand scheme of things isn't too bad. Especially as O'Shea as been playing some solid football recently. If he doesn't make it it'll be very interesting to see who does play at the back.

I fully expect to see a 3 man midfield of Carrick, Giggs and Fletcher for this one to provide some cover and try and control the midfield as Inter do have a powerful, strong midfield.

Then its a case of Rooney, Ronaldo supporting Berbatov. Capable of something special so lets hope them 3 can cause some problems. Think it's important for us to get a goal and keep it tight at the back. A 1-1 or 2-1 defeat and I'm fairly confident of growing through.

[DC Lemon]

You're talking out of your arse yet again I see. I've seen Gerrard dive 3 times I think and it pisses me off to a degree I can't even describe, I hate that shit with a passion. But that's it. To compare Ronaldo to him in those terms is ridiculous, the nearest you can get is Drogba, and even then Ronaldo's a head and shoulders above.

Ronaldo's dive at the weekend WAS pretty much the same as Gerrard's against Chelsea, but I had

in mind when comparing the two in the embarrassing stakes. If Liverpool supporters aren't as embarassed by that as I am by Ronaldo's behaviour, then so be it.

[phresh]

I expect Park will play as he was left out at the weekend. I expect it will be Fletcher-Carrick-Park across the middle with Ronaldo-Rooney-Berbatov up front with Rooney dropping back to the left midfield spot.

[fatbob]

Is O'Shea injured?

I agree with FATEone (!!) with reguards to attack being the best defence, playing attacking players out of position to defend [probably won't work, saying that if they stuck Carrick in the hole in front of the centre backs it wouldn't be the worst outcome defensively, with Scholes/Fletcher in front going forward with Park and Ronaldo on the wings.

[Trigg]

I expect Park will play as he was left out at the weekend. I expect it will be Fletcher-Carrick-Park across the middle with Ronaldo-Rooney-Berbatov up front with Rooney dropping back to the left midfield spot.

I don't expect to see Park if we do play a 3 man midfield as that would mean playing in the centre I don't think he's played there all that often for us? If the defenders were all fit, then I'd fully expect to go 4-4-2, but the fact we're stretched at the back makes me think we might throw any extra body in midfield to help us out.

I guess it really depends on who's fit an able. I thought O'Shea would be available for this one game so I'd be happy with him playing along side Rio, with Evra and Rafael as full backs. Although Rafa would have to play substantially better than what he did against Blackburn!

No Giggs/Scholes?

Who do you expect to be at the back?

I'd most certainly play Giggs, experience counts in these games and he's been in bloody good form. The fact that Scholes played on Saturday might be a bit too much for him playing on the following Wednesday. Otherwise I'd play him as well.

[El Pibe]

...fouling is an integral part of your defensive technique, but it is against the rules none-the-less.

Much like Jamie Carragher?

[fatbob]

At least Fabio is with them!

[phresh]

In a 3 man midfield I would expect Fletcher to play on the right, Carrick in the middle and Park on the left so to keep tabs on their right back. Rooney and Ronaldo will operate on the flanks with Berbatov up front.

Did see someone suggesting that Rafael and Fabio will play with Evra in the middle but I cannot for the life of me see that happening!

[fatbob]

Wait a minute....

BBC and Utd site are saying that Raphael isn't with the squad?!

Travelling squad

Goalkeepers: Van der Sar, Foster, Kuszczak.

Defenders: Ferdinand, Evra, O'Shea, Evans, Fabio, Eckersley.

Midfielders: Giggs, Park, Carrick, Nani, Scholes, Possebon, Gibson, Fletcher, Ronaldo.

Forwards: Rooney, Berbatov, Tevez, Welbeck.

[fatbob]

I assume he would rather have Eckersley as central cover as Fletcher or O'Shea could play at right back if needed.

If only Hargreaves wasn't dead.

[Trigg]

In a 3 man midfield I would expect Fletcher to play on the right, Carrick in the middle and Park on the left so to keep tabs on their right back. Rooney and Ronaldo will operate on the flanks with Berbatov up front.

Did see someone suggesting that Rafael and Fabio will play with Evra in the middle but I cannot for the life of me see that happening!

I'd go with that apart from Giggs in the place of Park.

I wouldn't be surprised if both O'Shea and Evans start you know, especially O'Shea as his injury wasn't meant to be anything serious. I'd be happy for O'Shea to play actually, his form as been good recently.

[Majora]

I thought Park would play but I think Giggs has an equally strong chance of starting. He's only played 10 minutes in the past two games, he's in good form and has loads of experience. I think it'll definitely be Giggs/Park, Carrick, Fletcher in the middle. Scholes played the last two games, I can't see him playing a third in the space of a week.

[phresh]

I'd rather see Giggs as an impact player for the last half hour or so, and park being rested at the weekend seems to hint at him being selected. Not sure why Rafael isn't in the squad, but hopefully Evans and O'Shea will be fit. I thought O'Shea did well at RB against Fulham and you couldn't ask for a much more solid replacement.