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Back on the midfield sitch..

 

I was reading that Ole is pretty hot on getting Declan Rice, and is willing to wait until next year. Not wanting a short term fix.

I get it, get the right guy, if that's who he wants then sure

 

I just kinda feel like United probably need two DMs in the squad anyway, I imagine Matic will leave next summer. I kinda feel like going for a Bissouma or someone now shouldn't even stop them going for Rice or whoever next summer too? 

 

I think Fred and Mctominey are going to be playing a lot again this season - which is fine - but, that does effectively take a more effective forward thinking player out of the side. Also, when one of them is injured you end up dropping Pogba in next to Fred, which is a waste of Pogba and puts a lot of pressure on Fred to be everywhere and not be too Fred-y.

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Just now, fatbob said:

Back on the midfield sitch..

 

I was reading that Ole is pretty hot on getting Declan Rice, and is willing to wait until next year. Not wanting a short term fix.

I get it, get the right guy, if that's who he wants then sure

 

It is very, very unlikely Rice goes anywhere other than Chelsea. His heart is totally set on it. If United had the cash plus Lingard to make a swap I would shudder to think what the wages would be.

 

United's squad is walking a very fine line without a midfield upgrade.

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Oh yeah? I'm not convinced United couldn't get him if they tryed, but also he's not the only person who could do the job.

 

It's looking pretty clear there won't be an incoming DM today, a real missed oppertunity I think. 

 

Varane and Sancho are amazing additions, and really level up the starting XI. Ronaldo is a weird bonus. But I think that a quality DM is what makes the side a real challenger.

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If the midfielder isn't got, the window has failed to address the one glaring problem in the squad. No Varane, Sancho and Ronaldo makes it a success. Unless they give van der Beek a proper spell in midfield and refuse to deploy Pogba deep again.

 

The interesting thing about the squad make-up, should Lingard and Cavani leave today, is Rashford suddenly becoming the most-suitable back-up to Bruno. Would be interesting to see given how much of his playmaking ability gets muted from wide.

 

Edit: That should be Cavani staying then. If they could get a price for Lingard and bring in a midfielder, it would be the best business in a very long time. It's so important.

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It's vital we get a midfielder, really. Sancho and Ronaldo are fantastic signings, but not what we absolutely needed.  Verane was one we needed, and will improve us a lot. I think we throw so many players forward that we need to play two defensive midfielders, otherwise we're close to playing 4-1-5. We're on a tightrope in that area of the pitch where a couple of injuries or suspensions will destroy our season.

 

McTominay has just had an operation on a groin problem. We don't know how long that will take to recover from. They can do amazing things surgically these days, so it might not be long, but you don't know. Regardless, imagine a scenario when he misses a couple of months, whether through this or another injury.  You're then wondering whether to play Pogba, Matic, or Donny alongside Fred.

 

Fred himself isn't really good enough for a team that wants to challenge for the title. He plays with enthusiasm and energy, and you have to appreciate the work he does in there putting out fires. At the weekend he was having to try to stop crosses coming in from both flanks.  However he's Fred, and as hard as he tries he still does Fred things. He passes to the opposition, he commits needless fouls in dangerous areas, he falls over, he shoots from thirty yards with his wrong foot.  I'm being harsh on him here. Most of the time he's fine.

 

Matic can't run anymore. He still has his ability to read the game and see where the danger is. He can pass the ball, he never gets outmuscled, and he knows when to drop into the centre of defence.  However teams just run past him. In possession he's so ponderous he sometimes gets caught in dangerous positions, and he takes the momentum out of attacks.

 

Pogba can only play in there when we're dominating the game. In those passages of play he's fantastic. When we're up against it, he's a liability.

 

Van De Beek is an enigma. We haven't seen much from him yet. We all seem to want him to play, but is that based on his actual output or just hope? Can he play as a deeper midfielder?  Does he know the position well enough? Does he have the physical capabilities?

 

Say both of McFred were out for a game. Whoever we play in there, the chances are we lose that match.

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Let's assume Lingard leaves, and there are no further incomings. Let's also accept Pogba has no place playing anywhere other than on the left.

 

First XI

 

Henderson

 

Wan-Bissaka

Maguire

Varane

Shaw

 

McTominay

Fred

 

Sancho

Fernandes

Pogba

 

Ronaldo

 

 

Second-string XI

 

De Gea

 

Dalot

Bailly

Lindelof

Telles

 

Matic

van der Beek

 

Greenwood

Rashford

Martial

 

Cavani

 

 

I've little problem with Jones as an option if he gets his fitness back. He's been solid before and has a better class of player around him now. Mata is a go-to for seeing out games already won. Diallo and the other young lads are wild cards. I'm picking Henderson over de Gea because he comes off his line, and distributes more accurately.

 

It's not a bad squad at all IF Ole insists on those players in those positions. With a top-level number six in for Matic, bumping one of McFred to the bench, it's suddenly capable of winning anything.

 

Edit: If Lingard stays, he's an upgrade on James for the disciplined attacker in tough away games.

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Fred is weird. I think his problem is, the pressure. I think he makes a small mistake, cracks under the pressure, tries to overcompensate, dwells on the problem fucks up again becuase his head isnt in it. He's a capable and talented player but makes basic fuck ups.

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2 hours ago, GamesGamesGames said:

Hand over de Jong, you skint shits.

 

Another example of United fans casually thinking a top team, however financially crippled, are willing to hand over one of the most impressive young midfielders in the world they spent £77m on. Perhaps we can swap Lingard for the generational talent of Pedri who is the future of the club. It's not like Barcelona can't mess up, they let Arthur go, but as rated as he was, that's still a step below De Jong's potential. I think Kovacic would be more reasonable, even if he's in a team that i think will win the league and Tuchel won't want to let him go, he's still behind Jorginho and Kante and mostly back up/rotation and a £60m bid might have tested Chelsea.

 

I'd like a midfielder mind but it's far too late now. I think Van De Beek can play deeper in midfield though not as a battling defensive minded midfielder fans seem obsessed with. Basically similar to Gundogan, moves the ball quickly, covers ground. His confidence is probably completely shot now and if he plays one game in this hyper individualistic United people expect him to be some wizard who has to assist or score to deserve his position rather than just link up the play like I expect him too.

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36 minutes ago, GamesGamesGames said:

Let's assume Lingard leaves, and there are no further incomings. Let's also accept Pogba has no place playing anywhere other than on the left.

 

First XI

 

Henderson

 

Wan-Bissaka

Maguire

Varane

Shaw

 

McTominay

Fred

 

Sancho

Fernandes

Pogba

 

Ronaldo

 

 

Second-string XI

 

De Gea

 

Dalot

Bailly

Lindelof

Telles

 

Matic

van der Beek

 

Greenwood

Rashford

Martial

 

Cavani

 

 

I've little problem with Jones as an option if he gets his fitness back. He's been solid before and has a better class of player around him now. Mata is a go-to for seeing out games already won. Diallo and the other young lads are wild cards. I'm picking Henderson over de Gea because he comes off his line, and distributes more accurately.

 

It's not a bad squad at all IF Ole insists on those players in those positions. With a top-level number six in for Matic, bumping one of McFred to the bench, it's suddenly capable of winning anything.

 

Edit: If Lingard stays, he's an upgrade on James for the disciplined attacker in tough away games.

 

Small nitpick: I think once Rashford is back fit, he absolutely starts (i'd hope so at least). The balance of him and Sancho has the potential to cause teams incredible problems. Pogba either plays in the double pivot or rotates. Pogba should be playing 8 or 10 rather than 6, but Rashford is increible when he's fit so I think he's going to be starting.

 

Good options to have!

 

As an aside, there were all those rumours about them moving towards a 433. I can't see that happening with these midfielders, except for against teams which barely press high. It'll be interesting to see what effect the Varane and Maguire pairing has on covering for those defensive midfield problems.

 

Mctominey has surprised me before, maybe he'll become an elite defensive pivot. I don't think that's him though - him and Fred seem far more box to box types.

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22 minutes ago, Loik V credern said:

 

 It's not like Barcelona can't mess up, they let Arthur go,

 

...they traded Arthur for Pjanic...yeah...

 

they're also about to lose Ilaix Moriba to RBL for like €20 mil!?!

 

 

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1 hour ago, Loik V credern said:

 

Another example of United fans casually thinking a top team, however financially crippled, are willing to hand over one of the most impressive young midfielders in the world they spent £77m on. Perhaps we can swap Lingard for the generational talent of Pedri who is the future of the club. It's not like Barcelona can't mess up, they let Arthur go, but as rated as he was, that's still a step below De Jong's potential. I think Kovacic would be more reasonable, even if he's in a team that i think will win the league and Tuchel won't want to let him go, he's still behind Jorginho and Kante and mostly back up/rotation and a £60m bid might have tested Chelsea.

 

I'd like a midfielder mind but it's far too late now. I think Van De Beek can play deeper in midfield though not as a battling defensive minded midfielder fans seem obsessed with. Basically similar to Gundogan, moves the ball quickly, covers ground. His confidence is probably completely shot now and if he plays one game in this hyper individualistic United people expect him to be some wizard who has to assist or score to deserve his position rather than just link up the play like I expect him too.

 

It was a joke, you tedious dolt.

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1 hour ago, 5R7 said:

...they traded Arthur for Pjanic...yeah...

 

they're also about to lose Ilaix Moriba to RBL for like €20 mil!?!

 

Yeah they traded a highly rated young Brazilian who fans would say could perform like Xavi with a chunk of time to get there with a much older midfielder who hasn't done anything that was entirely done for financial reasons even though it doesn't seem to make sense. Barcelona fans did care, care less now Pedri has been so good.

 

Ilaix Moriba wants more money and Barcelona aren't willing to bend. Not dissimiliar when Pogba left.

 

18 minutes ago, GamesGamesGames said:

It was a joke, you tedious dolt.

 

Well i removed 'Even though it was a joke' because i wasn't sure given it's not funny and decided it was more in line with united fans going on and on and on and on about signings.

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1 hour ago, fatbob said:

 

 

Small nitpick: I think once Rashford is back fit, he absolutely starts (i'd hope so at least). The balance of him and Sancho has the potential to cause teams incredible problems. Pogba either plays in the double pivot or rotates.

 

You're right, most likely, but Pogba shouldn't be anywhere near those deeper midfield positions. He can't play there, but he can play very well on the left, as can Martial albeit in a different way.

 

If the squad is looking to compete on all fronts then there'll be rotation all over the place, and looking at the current squad the only question mark is Matic's mobility. That's assuming you don't fuck about playing Pogba deep, playing Martial on his own up top....

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And done. I'm quite optimistic about this one. Bielsa did a great job on improving Harrison's final ball and I think James has similar issues. 

Edit: I meant to post this in the general thread but I guess it's relevant. 

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good greif, so Saul to chelsea (Chelsea will pay €4m loan fee and will have €35m option to buy !?!), Camavinga (for less than £40mil!?!?) to Real, and Moriba (£20mil!) to RBL ... but we couldnt find money for one of them...ffs

 

 

although i think PSG are the biggest laughing stock of the window, not selling mbappe for £200mil, and he will leave for nothing...lunacy!

 

i mean...we are gonna lose pogba the same way...but...nobody tried to buy pogba

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@5R7 PSG are hardly a laughing stock, they’ve done amazing business and kept Mbappe too.

 

They have no need of the money, they’re a state PR club, keeping Mbappe is a win for them I think.

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Shame about Saul. He’s not what they need long term I don’t think, but on a loan even just having another person who isn’t Matic to be in that midfield too would be a really useful thing to have.

 

Doesn’t make sense that they didn’t pursue this further unless they had a better option in mind… which seems like they don’t.

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All this means is that an 11th hour deal for Rice is on the cards.

West Ham have been spending the cash, they ,ust have something up their sleeve.... United have sorted a deal, 60/70 mil plus Lingard, but it's hushed up to allow WH to buy at reduced prices, 10:55 tonight... "Here we Go!" Declan's a Man United player :omg:

 

 

 

 

 

 

I "might" have had a beer earlier 😛

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1 hour ago, MikeBeaver said:

All this means is that an 11th hour deal for Rice is on the cards.

West Ham have been spending the cash, they ,ust have something up their sleeve.... United have sorted a deal, 60/70 mil plus Lingard, but it's hushed up to allow WH to buy at reduced prices, 10:55 tonight... "Here we Go!" Declan's a Man United player :omg:

 

 

 

 

 

 

I "might" have had a beer earlier 😛

 

Even by old United standards they would have gone some to keep that quiet! Still, it's a mental end to the transfer window so what the hell.

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