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Xbox 360 Cheerleader Disappointed By Sales


Graham S
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What a completely awful massive big load of nonsensical bollock-tripe.

In what way?

UbiSoft were begging the French government for funding to stave off an hostile takeover from EA, Namco were bought out by Bandai (which doesn't appear to have helped much) and Capcom have only just started to turn profit these past 18 months after shedding a large number of staff and stuidos and cancelling a large number of games.

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The 9 million figure seems to be the figure most news websites are carrying at the moment. NexGenWars.com also has the Xbox 360 on 8,971,584 consoles sold as we speak - given, their figures are based on estimates. Whatever the case, the situation now is certainly nothing like the one Edge randomly painted last month.

Nextgenwars is an awful site based on seemingly random numbers. This site (seems to) wait until the numbers are released from a respected source before releasing them.

As it shows, you are completely incorrect about the 360 being ahead of the PS2 at this point in its lifetime. And look how well the PS2 sold in its first Christmas when it was stocked. This is the first sign that all is not well with 360 sales as it was expected to sell double what it is selling in November and December. At the moment the 360 seems to have just transferred the Xbox userbase from one console to another (which of course sells at a loss).

http://www.vgcharts.org/usaconscomps.php?n...=PS2&type=2

The home page also favours Edge's figure of 6 million (at the time) rather than yours.

http://www.vgcharts.org/

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fantastic post there coxy. cheers for the info.

7.2 million consoles is still a healthy installed base after a year though. and it'll probably be closer to 9 by the end of the holidays (lots of people get money as presents).

I still think the 360 is in about the same shape as the PS3. The wii really could end up surprising a lot of people, me included.

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7.2 million consoles is still a healthy installed base after a year though. and it'll probably be closer to 9 by the end of the holidays (lots of people get money as presents).

Yes, MS have got some good figures up on the board especially when it comes to software (the reason the gamecube was a failure).

360 vs PS2

http://www.vgcharts.org/usaconscomps.php?n...=PS2&type=3

360 vs Xbox

http://www.vgcharts.org/usaconscomps.php?n...2=XB&type=3

The second one in particular shows how much better the 360 is doing than the Xbox even though on hardware sell-through it is slightly behind. November's hardware figure is the only bad one (relatively of course) in the 360's life so far. December's figure will be very interesting.

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I'm amazed that Viva Pinata performed that poorly.

Hindsight being 20/20 and all that, I'm not so surprised. It's just too... weird. It's not obvious (from a glance at the title/cover) what it's about or who it's aimed at.

Even if the kids have been made aware of it (is the TV show airing yet?), it would have to be a Tickle-Me-Elmo-like phenomenon among that age range to justify the parental purchase of a £50 game (on top of a £300 console, which is currently being bundled on the high street with an 18-rated game).

...

As for the topic at large: Microsoft have followed a reactionary strategy with the Xbox and the 360. So by being first to market they've been at the mercy of their predictions of how the other hardware manufacturers were going to play this generation. I think they've made a fair stab at it - making a machine that technically outclasses the previous gen machines by a good distance. Of course, nobody in their position a year ago would have been able to predict the Wii or the ongoing PS3 troubles.

Burai is right on the money, I think - this generation has jumped the gun as far as what consumers want, which has only been emphasised further by the rise of non-hardware intensive, 'touch generations' style games.

Whereas Boyatsea's argument seems to boil down to 'never mind the quality, feel the width'; achieving massive success within a niche doesn't ensure that you'll break out of it, it could have quite the opposite effect even.

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Nextgenwars is an awful site based on seemingly random numbers. This site (seems to) wait until the numbers are released from a respected source before releasing them.

As it shows, you are completely incorrect about the 360 being ahead of the PS2 at this point in its lifetime. And look how well the PS2 sold in its first Christmas when it was stocked. This is the first sign that all is not well with 360 sales as it was expected to sell double what it is selling in November and December. At the moment the 360 seems to have just transferred the Xbox userbase from one console to another (which of course sells at a loss).

http://www.vgcharts.org/usaconscomps.php?n...=PS2&type=2

The home page also favours Edge's figure of 6 million (at the time) rather than yours.

http://www.vgcharts.org/

VGCharts has an awful reputation, fella. I'll take your criticism of NexGenWars, but please come up with something slightly more concrete than VGCharts. That site is fucking laughable.

Plus, the chart you quote there is for North American sales, not worldwide.

And no, I'm not wrong about the PS2. It first launched in March 2000, and over a year later shipment figures passed 6.4 million units - that's a fact. I had to research sales figures for my dissertation a couple of years back, and I have them to hand next to me right now. In comparison, Microsoft has apparently shipped its 10 millionth console last month.

Whereas Boyatsea's argument seems to boil down to 'never mind the quality, feel the width'; achieving massive success within a niche doesn't ensure that you'll break out of it, it could have quite the opposite effect even.

That wasn't my point. My point was, hit 10 million first, and you're more likely to secure the backing of the publishers and developers. Simple, but true.

And, as I said, this has already started to happen - even before Microsoft has broken that 10 million sales barrier.

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VGCharts has an awful reputation, fella. I'll take your criticism of NexGenWars, but please come up with something slightly more concrete than VGCharts. That site is fucking laughable.
Well vgcharts has always matched the figures from the official North American and Japanese monthly sales charts when I've looked. I'm not sure where they get the rest of the world figures from. I couldn't actually find the breakdown on the nexgenwars site. Where do they get their figures from?
Plus, the chart you quote there is for North American sales, not worldwide.

And no, I'm not wrong about the PS2. It first launched in March 2000, and over a year later shipment figures passed 6.4 million units - that's a fact. I had to research sales figures for my dissertation a couple of years back, and I have them to hand next to me right now. In comparison, Microsoft has apparently shipped its 10 millionth console last month.

Ahh, I see what you're doing. You're taking the fact that the 360 launched worldwide simultaneously and then comparing it to the old model of console releases where launches were staggered. For instance this chart shows that the PS2 was nearly 4 million consoles ahead of 360 at this point in it's life, which we both agree on.

http://www.vgcharts.org/japconscomps.php?n...e=2&align=0

However for the chart showing the North American launch you want to compare 1 year's worth of 360 sales against 6 month of PS2 sales. Hmmm, I can see the point you're trying to make with regard to publisher's but I don't think they base their projects on such short-termist views. I completely disagree that the 360 is doing better than the PS2 at this point in its life. All you're really saying is that the 360 launched globally and the PS2 didn't.

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I think the biggest problem for the Xbox 360 and also the PS3 is this:

Nobody asked for them.

I remember reading Edge pre-PS2 and developers and publishers alike were all crying out for new hardware to work on. They'd exhausted everything that the PSone had to offer. Similarly, gamers were begining to get tired of the crude, limited 3D capabilities as engines and franchises got recycled over and over ad nauseum.

The PS2 was massively desired by everyone in the industry and consumers alike.

But the Xbox 360?

The desire was there amongst your hardcore types, such as people who post on forums. But elsewhere PS2 and Xbox game sales were still incredibly high, we were (and still are) being treated to amazing looking and playing games and overall, people were still incredibly happy with their purchases. PS2 was the biggest selling home console for the month of November in the States, in spite of two new platforms released that month, which speaks volumes.

In the industry times have never been harder. With PS2 it was a step too far for many developers and publishers who still continue to fold on a regular basis. You've got the likes of Eidos, Sega, Activision, Namco, UbiSoft and Capcom, once giants in the business, clinging on for grim death. And then suddenly Microsoft announce new hardware and suddenly where those aforementioned publishers are trying to reorganise and restructure, they've now also got to factor in the resources to develop for new hardware that neither they nor their customers had asked for.

So you've got this machine selling solely to hardcore online gamers and only the hardcore online games selling for it. You've got stores desperately bundling high-profile, but ultimately ignored games like Smackdown, Viva Pinata and Sonic with hardware just to clear stock of games that would have sold brilliantly on PS2, but just have no audience on 360. And as a result you've got publishers like EA and Eidos announcing that big games like Burnout and Tomb Raider are getting new and exclusive PS2 and PSP games with no next gen versions in sight just to take up the slack. In Japan, you've got the biggest RPG franchise jumping ship to a handheld, simply because there's nowhere else for it to go where it would sell the sort of units that it should.

For most punters the PS2/Xbox/GC were enough. The PSone era was crude, but PS2 and it's ilk brought solid 3D, decent sound, perfected controllers and great gaming experiences. The 360 and PS3 offer all of that but slightly nicer looking with online services that people don't want, hi-def, that people can't access, higher game prices, higher accessory prices and a far, far smaller choice of games.

And when you've got the PS2 and the DS offering such great value for money with the games that people really want, the next generation is such a hard sell.

POTY. Are you an industry journalist? Because if you aren't, you should be.

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That's what annoyed me about the news piece in last month's Edge - "360 trails Xbox". The Xbox was the third console in the last generation - the 360 has been the first this time around, and it's outsold the sales totals both the PS2 and Dreamcast had amassed at this stage in their lives.

I've started to notice a slight bias towards the 360 in Edge recently. I can't recall them ever having such a bias before - as sure a sign as any that Edge is starting to drop in quality.

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I've started to notice a slight bias towards the 360 in Edge recently. I can't recall them ever having such a bias before - as sure a sign as any that Edge is starting to drop in quality.

Edge is BIAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAASSSSTTTTTTTTTTT.

Phew! Has been a while.

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However for the chart showing the North American launch you want to compare 1 year's worth of 360 sales against 6 month of PS2 sales. Hmmm, I can see the point you're trying to make with regard to publisher's but I don't think they base their projects on such short-termist views. I completely disagree that the 360 is doing better than the PS2 at this point in its life. All you're really saying is that the 360 launched globally and the PS2 didn't.

Well, that's certainly a factor. An accomplishement, in fact. One that Sony couldn't match with the PS3, in fact. But the figures are the figures - it's sold more than the PS2 had done at this stage in its life. The fact that launched globally is not something you can criticise Microsoft for.

As far as the publishers go, they base their decisions on cold hard facts. With PS3 shortages expected until next summer, they're more likely to make money on former PS3 exclusives if they make them multi-format, because of the 360's bigger userbase. They are concerned with profit, and that's about it.

I've started to notice a slight bias towards the 360 in Edge recently. I can't recall them ever having such a bias before - as sure a sign as any that Edge is starting to drop in quality.

Towards the 360?

God no. The problem with Edge is it feels like it has to make up for its past mistakes. We can all forgive them for singing merrily from the Jaguar and 3DO's songsheets - we were all excited back then. But ever since it has felt this constant need to apologise for itself. It got dangerously close to liking the 360 a few months back, but ever since then its withdrawn to the safe option of the brand power of the PlayStation for fear of making a fool of itself again by backing the wrong horse.

It's behind the Wii - and quite rightly so. Regardless, even if the Wii ends up being a long-term flop, Edge will still be able to say that creatively, it was a great console and was so worthy of support. But backing the PS3 on the strength that it might one day do something special is laughable, especially when you then suggest that it makes the 360 look ancient.

Instead of feeling the need to display its opinion all the time, Edge should just tell us the facts. The PS3 is very powerful, the controller feels cheap, and it doubts that its online service will be able to compete with Live. Leave it at that. Don't finish off what could have been a great article with some 'the PS3 can take you anywhere' nonsense. It reads like it had been written by Sony's PR consultancy.

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ARGH, lets not let this thread turn into the EDGE letter page please?

"EDGE is biased against [console manufacturer 1]!"

"EDGE is biased against [console manufacturer 2]!"

"EDGE is biased against PC games!"

"EDGE is biased against handheld formats!"

"EDGE is biased against [console manufacturer 3]!"

BORING.

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ARGH, lets not let this thread turn into the EDGE letter page please?

"EDGE is biased against [console manufacturer 1]!"

"EDGE is biased against [console manufacturer 2]!"

"EDGE is biased against PC games!"

"EDGE is biased against handheld formats!"

"EDGE is biased against [console manufacturer 3]!"

BORING.

The Edge letter page is nothing like that.

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ARGH, lets not let this thread turn into the EDGE letter page please?

"EDGE is biased against [console manufacturer 1]!"

"EDGE is biased against [console manufacturer 2]!"

"EDGE is biased against PC games!"

"EDGE is biased against handheld formats!"

"EDGE is biased against [console manufacturer 3]!"

BORING.

I'm not sure what letters page you've been reading.

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God no. The problem with Edge is it feels like it has to make up for its past mistakes. We can all forgive them for singing merrily from the Jaguar and 3DO's songsheets - we were all excited back then. But ever since it has felt this constant need to apologise for itself. It got dangerously close to liking the 360 a few months back, but ever since then its withdrawn to the safe option of the brand power of the PlayStation for fear of making a fool of itself again by backing the wrong horse.

It's behind the Wii - and quite rightly so. Regardless, even if the Wii ends up being a long-term flop, Edge will still be able to say that creatively, it was a great console and was so worthy of support. But backing the PS3 on the strength that it might one day do something special is laughable, especially when you then suggest that it makes the 360 look ancient.

Instead of feeling the need to display its opinion all the time, Edge should just tell us the facts. The PS3 is very powerful, the controller feels cheap, and it doubts that its online service will be able to compete with Live. Leave it at that. Don't finish off what could have been a great article with some 'the PS3 can take you anywhere' nonsense. It reads like it had been written by Sony's PR consultancy.

o/\o

This is EXACTLY what I've been feeling over the past few issues.

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