is the wii really too expensive?

[Massive Invisible Dog]

I don't mean bundling extra controllers with the machine, I mean the remote and nunchuck should be sold together rather than seperately, since the two are established as being pretty much essential together. It would reduce consumer confusion when buying extra controllers, since instead of having to buy "this" and "this" you just have to buy "this" instead. At least you don't have to buy a frigging memory card.

Catch my drift?

No. The nunchuk is more or less a concession to existing gamers, and there's going to be loads of software that only needs the remote, so it makes sense to package it seperately for as little as possible.

[MK-1601]

It's weird, the more Napoleon posts, the more I'm warming to the £180 price.

I'm glad they included a nunchuk in the basic package too: leaving it out would make it much harder to justify making games that used it. Which NoE would undoubtedly have used as justification to delay Metroid Prime 3 to 2078.

[TheSlugFormerlyKnownAsNap]

Saw this in the beginning of the thread. I own a 360 and besides Chomehounds (which nobody else likes) I have yet to play any games on it that reach any "heights".

Perhaps you're referring to the graphic tech. The tech stuff might be dandy, but the art direction on most 360 games is terrible IMO.

I was actually referring to the 'heights' of the pricing of games, with the 360 games having a higher RRP than any current gen consoles.

FWIW I love the 360 and its games so far, but that was not the point of my post and isn't the topic of this thread either.

[lampkin]

It also doesn't say how those statistics are calculated. Ours is the 'average wage', theirs is the 'average worker's wage'. That implies that perhaps the figures for the US are excluding people such as CEOs whereas our statistics take those people earning ridiculous wages into account. The average bloke/woman in the street earns less than £22,900.

I would say wage figures in the UK are very skewed by high earners, we have a very large gap between the rich and poor. I expect this is probably the same in the US though. However, I did a *quick* search on the US average and it points to an average wage around $35k - $40k...

http://www.ofm.wa.gov/trends/tables/fig102.asp

"Connecticut, with a median household income of $56,409, supplanted New Jersey as the country's highest wage state in 2003, the most recent year available. New Jersey slid to second, at $56,356, followed by Maryland, Massachusetts and New Hampshire.

Mississippi had the lowest median income, at $32,397. West Virginia, Arkansas, Louisiana and Montana rounded out the bottom five.

The median household income for the nation — half were higher, half were lower — was $43,318."

http://www.usatoday.com/money/economy/2005-11-29-wage_x.htm

Urm, these figures seem to paint a very different picture...

[scruffycat]

I was of the opinion that it was slightly too expensive at first but I'm coming round to the idea that actually it's not too bad. The different prices for different regions is a kicker though.

I'm still not sure if I will get one at launch or not, I'm excited about the Wii but if I bought one and a couple of games and an extra controller then it might just put the price beyond what I want to play. Nah, who am I kidding, I will be buying one.

[Super Craig]

Here's something I don't get. Wasn't there a discussion on here a while ago where it was worked out that the tech inside the remote is quite cheap and thus shouldn't affect the prices compared to other controllers?

[Massive Invisible Dog]

Here's something I don't get. Wasn't there a discussion on here a while ago where it was worked out that the tech inside the remote is quite cheap and thus shouldn't affect the prices compared to other controllers?

What was it based on? Had someone dissected a controller and looked up the price of every single component?

[TheSlugFormerlyKnownAsNap]

Napole0n, basically what I get from your reply to my post, is "It's mainly overpriced because Nintendo wanted to open up a new market and they've been saying it would be cheap".

In other words, if Nintendo wouldn't have said anything about how they wanted to make it affordable (which imho, it still is), the machine wouldn't be overpriced?

Pretty much yeah.

For myself the price isn't THAT important, as I can afford it and I'm definitely willing to give at a chance. At the same time, a cheaper price (also on controllers) and region-freeness would have meant launch-day purchase without a doubt. Now I'm swinging between importing one at launch, buying local at launch, maybe first try it out before buying or maybe even waiting until next year when some more games have appeared and better deals become available*.

* Knowing myself I don't think I'll be able to resist anyway.

[Super Craig]

What was it based on? Had someone dissected a controller and looked up the price of every single component?

I see you've went back to being an arsehole again. It was obviously speculation based on what was known about the controller at the time.

[Massive Invisible Dog]

I see you've went back to being an arsehole again. It was obviously speculation based on what was known about the controller at the time.

So it was based on more or less nothing then?

[TheSlugFormerlyKnownAsNap]

Bonkers.

Not really. The question was 'is it too expensive?'. Considering Nintendo's "Mission Statement" to position a nice affordable console for the whole family, gamers or non-gamers alike, I think it's too expensive. Whether the machine itself will be worth its money is another question altogether, which will depend more on the games than on the hardware IMO.

[tiedtiger]

EDIT: For 180 we get...

Wii Console

Wii Remote with strap

Nunchuk

AC Adapter

Wii console stand

Wii A/V cables

Sensor bar

Sensor bar stand

Two AA batteries

Wii Sports

Even better.

180 for that lot is a steal.

[El Pibe]

No. I don't think it is too expensive.

You can buy the box, take it home and play straight away! Also, if you pick up another controller, you'll get Wii Play as well. Bundled correctly, I think the Wii price is just fine.

[Massive Invisible Dog]

Has the Wii Play/Remote bundle been properly confirmed for Europe then?

[warci]

if it had been 150 to 200 €'s at launch with wii sports and -TWO- controllers i'd have picked it up.

what kind of moron includes a party game wich will supposidly show off the soical/multiplayer aspect of a new console and only includes one controller.

[Mr.Crowley]

I hear we'll get a pretty nifty cardboard-box to go with that too, and for a limited time, stores will be bundling free wrapping paper with every Wii.

[El Pibe]

titles like Oblivion, GRAW, PGR3, TDU, FIGHT NIGHT etc,

<yawn.jpg>

If that's the best it has after a year...

[Massive Invisible Dog]

if it had been 150 to 200 €'s at launch with wii sports and -TWO- controllers i'd have picked it up.

what kind of moron includes a party game wich will supposidly show off the soical/multiplayer aspect of a new console and only includes one controller.

€150 with two controllers and a game? Fuck that, I want it for €50 with four controllers, every launch game and a Faberge egg.

[El Pibe]

if it had been 150 to 200 €'s at launch with wii sports and -TWO- controllers i'd have picked it up.

what kind of moron includes a party game wich will supposidly show off the soical/multiplayer aspect of a new console and only includes one controller.

One that wants people to buy extra controllers? You know, to make money?

[Massive Invisible Dog]

<yawn.jpg>

If that's the best it has after a year...

Oh for fuck sake. Stop it.

[Warszawa]

One that wants people to buy extra controllers? You know, to make money?

Well, yes. But at the same time, the £180 price is a false one if you want more than a few minutes entertainment out of it. No one wants to spend hours playing Wii Sports on their own, no one *could*. It would simply get too tedious....which is why Nintendo should have also launched with a single-player bundle with, say, Zelda or even....Excite Truck or something. It would all look a lot better if that were the case.

[Warszawa]

... Uuuung...

It's true though. You can disagree with however many comments of mine that you like, but that one is cast iron fact. It's a multi-player game, pure and simple. It looks like it would be great fun in multi, but the most boring thing in existence in one player.

[El Pibe]

It's true though. You can disagree with however many comments of mine that you like, but that one is cast iron fact. It's a multi-player game, pure and simple. It looks like it would be great fun in multi, but the most boring thing in existence in one player.

Says you. I've played SingStar on my own at times - trying to beat scores set my the girlfriend, or friends That's one of the most enjoyable multi-player games ever made. I've also played friendlies on PES on my own.

Why wouldn't you play Wii Sports on your own, especially if there is a high score table?

It just feels like you're clutching at straws to criticise.

[Massive Invisible Dog]

It's true though. You can disagree with however many comments of mine that you like, but that one is cast iron fact. It's a multi-player game, pure and simple. It looks like it would be great fun in multi, but the most boring thing in existence in one player.

Except they're all, apart from tennis and boxing maybe, games which could easily be played by taking it turns with one controller.

[emps]

Business wise, nintendo are correct to price it at this level, but it is rather sickening to see so many customers leap to their defence. The corporation is just greedy. Nothing more nothing less. Don't make excuses for them.

Who's making excuses for them. The price is good value by any contemporary measure. The problem with the price is twofold: it doesn't appear to be mass-market enough and it doesn't match our expectations. But bear in mind that we aren't the mass-market, so our opinion on that amounts to fuck all, and when Nintendo set our expectations about its expense they always spoke in absolute terms, and like I said, price is always relative. It was us that assumed cheap meant 'Gamecube price'.

Going by the differences between here and Japan I think we probably have reason to complain about the comparative expense of the console, but even so it isn't a rip-off in any sense, other than the usual NoE nonsense. The price didn't match what we were hoping for, that's too bad for us, but it' still well-priced for what it does. The question that remains is if the price is good enough for to expand the market. Every indication is that they're going to begin by aiming at the current gamers but that doesn't tell us anything about their plans for the price. More likely than not they're trying to test the waters to see if there will be a decent enough number of non-gamers interested before they make any decisions on price-drops.

Obviously for the consumer it’d be better if it was cheaper than it is, but that says nothing at all. The concern we should have about its pricing should not be about the extra outlay over whatever expectations we had, it should be about if Nintendo have priced themselves from achieving their goals, as that would see the usual drying up of third party support loom over the console which I can’t see anybody wanting to happen.

EDIT: And again, the price is an issue only given the context Nintendo's now confused message and the controller prices. Not having two remotes in the box is a far bigger issue than it costing £180.

[Beitel]

Bundling WiiSports with the Wii is better than a singleplayer game like Zelda (well, the best thing would be ofcourse to have the option) because Nintendo wants that people buy the Wii just like they buy a Playstation - for WiiSports, or PS's Singstar.

[Warszawa]

Says you. I've played SingStar on my own at times - possibly one of the most multi-player games of all time. Trying to beat scores set my the girlfriend, or friends.

Why wouldn't you play Wii Sports on your own, especially if there is a high score table?

It just feels like you're clutching at straws to criticise.

No, I just don't think it would be a lot of fun in single-player....it's not deep enough. It's a shame there's not a single-player bundle, that's all. I'll buy it anyway, but the fact remains that I need to pay another £80 to get a great amount of entertainment from my Wii initially.

As for the 360 & PS3, that's also true. But then no one heralded them as bargain of the century.

Bundling WiiSports with the Wii is better than a singleplayer game like Zelda (well, the best thing would be ofcourse to have the option) because Nintendo wants that people buy the Wii just like they buy a Playstation - for WiiSports, or PS's Singstar.

But you get Wii Play with the controller. So you're going to have a multi-player game if you purchase one of the extraordinarly overpriced controllers anyway. It would have been nice to have a bit of choice, as you say.

[Massive Invisible Dog]

No, I just don't think it would be a lot of fun in single-player....it's not deep enough. It's a shame there's not a single-player bundle, that's all. I'll buy it anyway, but the fact remains that I need to pay another £80 to get a great amount of entertainment from my Wii initially.

As for the 360 & PS3, that's also true. But then no one heralded them as bargain of the century.

Games require depth to be fun in aingleplayer? Man, I can't believe I wasted all those hours playing the minigames in Super Monkey Ball on my own for 'fun'

[Warszawa]

Games require depth to be fun in aingleplayer? Man, I can't believe I wasted all those hours playing the minigames in Super Monkey Ball on my own for 'fun'

It depends on the type of the game. If I had control over my player in Wii Tennis, I could see myself finding more in single player. As it is, I'm only controlling the swing of the racket, which isn't going to provide me with much fun.

The Monkey Ball mini-games are a perfect example, actually. I've had the occasional quick blast in single-player, but there's nothing to hold the attention for an extended period.

[mats_j]

Well, i know. You may find the Wii launch lineup interesting but i think it isn't (except for Zelda of course). That is not the point. I just said that by using only Chromehounds as an example to show a machine's worth which has titles like Oblivion, GRAW, PGR3, TDU, FIGHT NIGHT etc, is not very logical and it's more like useless bitching than argument.

I find Chromehounds much more entertaining than "Oblivion, GRAW, PGR3, TDU, FIGHT NIGHT", however illogical that might seem to you. Sorry for not complying with the "universal taste".