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Destiny: FIN


Gorf King
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The fact that, as you state, a disc-based version that contains TTK and all the content so far is available for only £6 more than the TTK download alone just underlines this fact - if the expansion is worth £40, that means the original game, TDB and HoW together only cost £6. Of course, that's bollocks. None of us has yet played TTK, but to call a £40 expansion (likely only one expansion of three during the year) 'excellent value for money' is laughable, and slightly worrying. How much you enjoy the game is irrelevant - and how much time you've spent grinding in it even moreso - it's an extremely high price for a single piece of DLC.

But those people who buy the full game with all expansions won't be getting anywhere near the same experience as we did. VoG for the first time blind, trying so hard to become 30, leveling weapons and armour by farming mats, watching the game develop, and being interested in every intricacy of every weekly update.

They will simply rush through all of that content to chase the end game, whatever that ends up being. Spending £80 per year to play Destiny with a regular rllmuk clan seems fine to me. However, I would be miffed if I was playing on xbone.

On another note, I really really hope they drop 360 and ps3 support for Destiny 2, allowing for much more expansive worlds.

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SOoXspA.jpg

So anyone outside of the US will be denied a multi-stage quest/mission until next year which should be part of the TTK content we are already being charged 50% more for. Now I know how Xbone users must feel. I wonder if they will also make the XP grind twice as bad in TTK to offset the bonus XP consumable. Good job I can't stop throwing money at my screen!

Also this is giving me a lovely tingly feeling:

The limited edition Destiny can will also feature Red Bull athlete, member of professional eSports organization OpTic Gaming, and Destiny super-fan Michael "Flamesword" Chaves. Chaves will offer his expertise and experience as an eSports athlete and coach to help guide players through the quest.

"I'm really excited to be a part of this partnership," said Michael "Flamesword" Chaves, Red Bull eSport athlete. "I love that Red Bull and Destiny have a shared sense of adventure, camaraderie, and pushing boundaries that both brands embody. As a former Coach of OpTic Gaming and Team Captain of my current squad, I'm always looking to help others be at their best. I am very much looking forward to coaching the Destiny community through the quest and help everyone Become Legend!"

How fucking insulting is that?

special Destiny-branded 4-packs of Red Bull will be available exclusively at Walmart that contain a Mega XP Accelerator, giving Destiny players an even greater advantage leading up to the launch.

and that does not sound game balance breaking at all...

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I should start a list of all of you who claim not to be buying TTK. Of course you will! Considering the amount of hours we put in, it's excellent value for money.

On that note, the legendary version (which comes with all content to date, and TTK) is £46 on the Tesco website.

And when it comes down to £25 I'll grab it.

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See as an Xboner it's ridiculous that we pay the same price for the DLC when there's less content. I didn't realise that was the case before I bought but how can they get away with that? Because of some marketing deal made behind the scenes?

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For the sake of £15 you're willing to miss out on all the forum action? Christ.

Forgetting all reasoned arguments around each individuals own subjective view of ‘value’ and the economics of mass market consumer entertainment products, the reason this is a day one purchase for me is the prospect of going into a raid completely blind with a bunch of regulars from here.

I missed all the VoG fun first time round coming to Destiny late but a new raid is easily the most exciting gaming prospect for me this year.

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i personally think this extra quest with Red Bull will be only one of many quests, something like the queens bounties.

There's a lot I suspect bungee haven't shown about TTK, they are the masters of drip feed, no chance they've spunked all the info for it yet. This is just the start. They'll have twitch feeds and reveals about strikes, quests, new modes, and everyone who plays it now, will very likely be happy with the content you get.

And those who "glad they quit after the beta/first few weeks/first DLC" will stick to what they like.

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Yeah, the Red Bull stuff will be shit. It's marketing fluff and will be some inconsequential quest that Bungie found down the back of the sofa or something.

The XP boost is also only slightly higher than the XP boost you get from doing the Nightfall every week which literally everybody does. It won't break the game, a few players will get to a higher level slightly quicker than others and given it doesn't take that long anyway and everyone being max level is pretty normal, it's, again, just marketing guff.

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Wonder if this will go free-to-play at some point. I don't know how I would feel about that. Maybe I'd be fine with it. I'm afraid I'd end up buying shaders, emotes, mounts and consumables. *throws money at screen*

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See as an Xboner it's ridiculous that we pay the same price for the DLC when there's less content. I didn't realise that was the case before I bought but how can they get away with that? Because of some marketing deal made behind the scenes?

I can obviously see why you would be annoyed, technically both PS4 and Xbox One owners pay for the exact same amount of content, it is Sony who paid for the extras for the PS4 players for a year.

Cash is king unfortunately, I really don't like exclusivity deals on 3rd party games.

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I don't think paying £40 for a single DLC expansion that contains less than half of what was in the original game represents 'excellent value of money' at all - and how much time I've spent playing Destiny is irrelevant in that judgment. There are many games that people get at least as much enjoyment out of, and might play for as long (a completely different marker of worth), which cost far less than Destiny will have by the end of its first year.

The fact that, as you state, a disc-based version that contains TTK and all the content so far is available for only £6 more than the TTK download alone just underlines this fact - if the expansion is worth £40, that means the original game, TDB and HoW together only cost £6. Of course, that's bollocks. None of us has yet played TTK, but to call a £40 expansion (likely only one expansion of three during the year) 'excellent value for money' is laughable, and slightly worrying. How much you enjoy the game is irrelevant - and how much time you've spent grinding in it even moreso - it's an extremely high price for a single piece of DLC.

I look forward to Destiny 2 coming in at about £100 for the base game and some here calling it 'excellent value for money' because, when you divide the cost by the hours you've invested in it, it comes out at around 20p an hour - far less than the hourly cost of watching that mediocre film you saw at the cinema the other week! With this line of reasoning I also look forward to the market reacting to all these people 'willing to throw money at the screen' and adjusting game prices ever upward, stretching out content as thinly as possible over as many 'expansions' and different packs as possible because, after all, the market thinks it's great value for money and will probably buy the lot. Should my £39 preorder for Fallout 4 really cost £120, I wonder?

It's perfectly possible to enjoy a game, yet criticise its business model or regard aspects of it badly - especially when it comes to gouging prices from customers who feel they've invested time in it; ratchet prices up for those who are hooked while massively discounting the product to get new users in, in the hope of turning them into hooked users who at point of update will have to give up altogether or pay full release prices for a fraction of the content, several times a year. It's an unpleasant business model that's unfortunately becoming ever more prevalent.

I don't even 'claim' not to be buying TTK: I'll see what develops at this point and see if any cheaper options can be wangled (like buying the DLC from the US PSN). If enough of my long-term teammates are in, and enough of a deal can be done, I may well be in. But that won't remove my capacity for judging which developers/publishers offer honest, open, reasonable deals on their products, and which leave one with a bad taste in the mouth. Or being able to comment on them, so that Bungie don't run away with the idea that their player base will swallow anything they sell at any price, and that hopefully other developers and publishers aren't encouraged to follow in such foul suit.

But by all means, get that list started. I've started mine already:

2015 Hall of shame/biggest disappointment:

1. Bungie/Activision for the way they've handled and sold Destiny expansions

Bit of a come down from my 2014 GOTY, but, you know... it might make 2015 GOTY too, as well as the above accolade. The two aren't mutually exclusive, because you are more likely to be ripped off by someone selling something you love than by someone selling something that's unappealing to you. That's how this works, and Bungie clearly know that. The question is at what point someone's desire not to be stiffed outweighs their desire to continue playing the game. Those who quit earlier than others might simply not be so hooked on the product. I don't think people currently prevaricating over the price should be on some sort of 'list'. Or, if they are, I'd probably put them on a list of gamers who can discern between good business practice and bad business practice, and between a company that respects its customers and one which treats them like cash-bloated idiots. And who can recognise that, at some point, they might have to decide what they actually think of themselves in this respect.

In other news, I'll be on around 7:30 if anyone fancies some PoE 34s.

I generally agree but the all in version is £55 so its £15 more than what we are expecting to pay as no UK RRP for the TTK dlc only as yet... of course it should be £25 $>£ so there are shenanigans there to deal with as ever.

However this is just how it is, COD is £80/year as is the BF franchise so we are not any different from those and while you could argue all day long which has more 'content' I think this is just how gaming franchises are these days - its almost an odd way of doing it for developers as it has limited how many games I buy as I just don't have enough time if I get hooked onto one of them - these days I could survive on my PS+ sub and Destiny any yet I still have bought FF Hardline and Project Cars as I 'had to have them' but have not played either really - If I can break that spell I could pick up games when I have time and at vastly reduced cost later on!!

But then its just odd, I still think the Driveclub launch has been the most disappointing thing I have seen in gaming in all my years (removing actually disgusting thinks like gamer gate obv) and yet most of this forum thought I was some kind of weirdo for calling out a forum darling who happened to be responsible for it - I seem to be on the opposite side of the argument with this because for me it still represents excellent VFM and I think that is the crux of it as we all have different ways of defining VFM!

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I generally agree but the all in version is £55 so its £15 more than what we are expecting to pay as no UK RRP for the TTK dlc only as yet... of course it should be £25 $>£ so there are shenanigans there to deal with as ever.

There is an official price for the DLC in the UK - it's £40. And that's that.

Did you even see the picture above?

Consumers are used to paying a premium for additional content (Downloadable content can cost up to $20)

(Downloadable content can cost up to $20)

can cost up to $20

$20

Forty quid to you, mate. Aren't you the one who buys loads of full-price games and never plays them?

But then its just odd, I still think the Driveclub launch has been the most disappointing thing I have seen in gaming in all my years (removing actually disgusting thinks like gamer gate obv) and yet most of this forum thought I was some kind of weirdo for calling out a forum darling who happened to be responsible for it - I seem to be on the opposite side of the argument with this because for me it still represents excellent VFM and I think that is the crux of it as we all have different ways of defining VFM!

The Driveclub launch was a fiasco - broken servers and online systems were at the heart of it. But since then they've fixed those. And they've also vastly improved the core game itself, with numerous extra features. And they've added a load more free DLC. And the cost of the season pass DLC didn't go up - it stayed the same price but added even more content - I don't think I've seen a driving game (or maybe any game) with more added content, month on month, than Driveclub - and all added within less than a year. The season pass costs... yes, it's £20. And they've continued to make improvements for free to the underlying game itself - adding replays, weather effects, photo mode - all for free. They've even changed how the cars handle in response to customer feedback. The version of the game which exists now is unrecognisable from that which launched late last year, and all those improvements are free, and you can have a vast swathe of additional content added on a regular update basis for a one-off cost of £20.

I find it astonishing that you of all people, given your numberless complaints in the DC thread, would gladly swallow up the cost of a single expansion of an admittedly incomplete game (yes, Destiny is incomplete!) - with bits chopped out of the expansion itself in order to to sell those bits to collector's edition rebuyers of the whole game, and to Red Bull drinkers, and to whomever else thinks their audience will buy anything - that comes, without these extras, to the price of a complete new game: £40.

If you can't tell the gouging developer from the one that recognises its errors and is working its arse off to correct them and to satisfy its audience, then I give up. I know you're happy paying £40 for an incomplete DLC expansion... oh no, wait, you're paying £75 for the collector's edition with the strange plastic coin, aren't you? Like you say, I guess, 'excellent VFM' is in the eye of the beholder. It's just... when you've torn seven strips off the makers of DriveClub, yet can't see that Bungie are taking the piss here, I find that bizarre. Like, really, really odd. Regardless of how much time you've spent playing the game. The disparity in the two companies' attitudes to their fans and to their own failures couldn't be more stark.

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That Red Bull stuff above stinks quite bad.

That XP boost could be quite handy for people (like me potentially) thinking of starting a third character before the new stuff drops). I'm getting a touch bored of the House of Wolves already as I don't seem to be finding many new weapons or armour I really like. I've actually ended up rediscovering some of the Vault of Glass stuff. Still the best content in this game.

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There is an official price for the DLC in the UK - it's £40. And that's that.

Did you even see the picture above?

Consumers are used to paying a premium for additional content (Downloadable content can cost up to $20)

(Downloadable content can cost up to $20)

can cost up to $20

$20

Forty quid to you, mate. Aren't you the one who buys loads of full-price games and never plays them?

The Driveclub launch was a fiasco - broken servers and online systems were at the heart of it. But since then they've fixed those. And they've also vastly improved the core game itself, with numerous extra features. And they've added a load more free DLC. And the cost of the season pass DLC didn't go up - it stayed the same price but added even more content - I don't think I've seen a driving game (or maybe any game) with more added content, month on month, than Driveclub - and all added within less than a year. The season pass costs... yes, it's £20. And they've continued to make improvements for free to the underlying game itself - adding replays, weather effects, photo mode - all for free. They've even changed how the cars handle in response to custom feedback. The version of the game which exists now is unrecognisable from that which launched late last year, and all those improvements are free, and you can have a vast swathe of additional content added on a regular update basis for a one-off cost of £20.

I find it astonishing that you of all people, given your numberless complaints in the DC thread, would gladly swallow up the cost of a single expansion of an admittedly incomplete game (yes, Destiny is incomplete!) - with bits chopped out of the expansion itself in order to to sell those bits to collector's edition rebuyers of the whole game, and to Red Bull drinkers, and to whomever else thinks their audience will buy anything - that comes, without these extras, to the price of a complete new game: £40.

If you can't tell the gouging developer from the one that recognises its errors and is working its arse off to correct them and to satisfy its audience, then I give up. I know you're happy paying £40 for an incomplete DLC expansion... oh no, wait, you're paying £75 for the collector's edition with the strange plastic coin, aren't you? Like you say, I guess, 'excellent VFM' is in the eye of the beholder. It's just... when you've torn seven strips off the makers of DriveClub, yet can't see that Bungie are taking the piss here, I find that bizarre. Like, really, really odd. Regardless of how much time you've spent playing the game. The disparity in the two companies' attitudes to their fans and to their own failures couldn't be more stark.

Driveclub launched fundamentally broken beyond anything I have ever seen, Destiny would have had to launch with guns being unable to fire to be remotely comparable and it took months to get the base game close to working as advertised - they gave us £2 of shitty DLC for free when the game was still broken and have still not delivered the 'free' PS+ game.

Of course during the 6 months it was broken you could buy the DLC and even when they pulled the PS+ version you could upgrade from that to the full broken game.

Bungie are being greedy with he DLC pricing I agree, they are pushing the VFM as far as they think people will go but how that can compare to a thoroughly broken game with dishonest developers stringing punters along while they took the money is beyond my belief - they worked their arses off to fix a broken game that played terribly on launch so I'm not sure they deserve pats on the back for getting the promised launch game almost as advertised 6 months later?

I have also decided i couldn't give a shit about a plastic coin so will not be getting the collectors edition and will stump up my £32 for the DLC ;)

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Take it to the DC thread, Shimmy (or, rather, don't): but I do have to say that what you wrote about DriveClub and its developers there is demonstrably untrue, containing the full complement of factual inaccuracies garnished with wild exaggeration to which the worst posts on this forum are increasingly prone. And I'm not even a massive fan of DriveClub - I can just see when a developer is feverishly trying to put something right to win over fans. And when one is actually happy to take its customers for a ride.

There's something undeniably seedy, grasping, and which wears the ugly face of corporate profit-whoring, about Bungie's Destiny - that much becomes clearer by the month. You might not care about that - might even embrace it - but at some point, I suspect a fair number of customers will find it so much of a turn-off that they'll be happy to go and play something else - buy something else - in preference to fuelling the phenomenon any further. I fully expect the standard damage limitation speech from DeeJ tomorrow, but I can guarantee it'll be calculated to throw the bare minimum at fans judged necessary to appease them. And I'm willing to admit that, depending on how far that calculation goes, it might be enough to get me to reconsider my current course of not buying anything else of theirs.

But it won't remove the bad taste from my mouth, or make me think that Bungie are on par in my heart with developers who treat their fans with respect, and who make every effort to not do anything to damage their creative integrity or devalue their brand. I look forward to stuff like the Bloodborne DLC for that reason - I expect high quality, care, craftsmanship from the product; from these developers. After HoW's PvE content, and the grossly fake excitement of the PoE reveal video (a true low in gaming) - and the raid-stealing £40 DLC - and then the *throw money at screen to rebuy all content* emote interview, and now the Red Bull Missions - I don't expect anything of the sort from Bungie. I hope that maybe we'll get something a bit better than Crota. But it's only a hope, not an expectation, and if I wanted to spend £40 every few months on pure hope, I might as well start doing the lottery - or, as wags would have it, the idiot tax. I might even have a better chance of that bet paying off than of Bungie achieving something better than VoG for my forty quid.

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